New means new - or maybe not

[shovelhd]

I've been building up a travel bike lately and I've sourced some specific parts from eBay. I have had issues with two of them.

First was a Ritchey WCS Logic headset, listed as New, pictured with the box. Purchased from a vendor who should be very familiar to most people here, plenty of positive feedback. Everything was new except for the crown race, which had obvious marks from the fork race removal tool. I wrote them, and we compromised on a settlement.

Second was a FD clamp band adapter, listed as New, pictured with the box. The details said "includes items shown". Purchased from a four figure FB seller. The clamp band had marks from installation. The shim for 28.6mm was missing, and I need that. I wrote him, with no reply. I'm going to have to initiate a return. That costs me money I should not need to spend.

eBay has two "New" condition categories:

New: "A brand-new, unused, unopened, undamaged item in its original packaging (where packaging is applicable). Packaging should be the same as what is found in a retail store, unless the item is handmade or was packaged by the manufacturer in non-retail packaging, such as an unprinted box or plastic bag. See the seller's listing for full details."

New other (see details): "A new, unused item with absolutely no signs of wear. The item may be missing the original packaging, or in the original packaging but not sealed. The item may be a factory second or a new, unused item with defects. See the seller's listing for full details and description of any imperfections."

In both cases, they should not have been listed under either New category.

Is this a trend, or just my bad luck?

[yakstone]

Not just your bad luck.
Some folks seem to not understand what "NEW" means.

Very similar to the misuse of "MINT".

[JWDR]

Not you at all. I bought a bike for my daughter listed as new that had been ridden for enough miles to square off the rear tire.

Multiple pictures of the bikes condition and the idea of having to refund my entire purchase price plus having to pay for return shipping was enough to get the seller to refund a significant chunk of cash to make it right.

[MattTuck]

I'm not a frequent user of eBay (used it maybe 3 times total), but my impression has always been that it is a digital equivalent of a flea market. Namely, most of the sellers are always trying to pull a fast one, or make a quick buck.

The situation you describe just confirms my existing bias. I realize that not everyone on eBay is like this, but it is my default expectation when I have to use the site. I bought a previous generation Aliante off eBay two years ago. Small scratch, small tear in the surface... about as good as you can hope for from that site.

[false_Aest]

That headset....

probably came off of the Ritchey I returned.

joking/not joking.

[beeatnik]

"new take off," as in, installed but never purchased by a human.

[ceolwulf]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

I'm not a frequent user of eBay (used it maybe 3 times total), but my impression has always been that it is a digital equivalent of a flea market. Namely, most of the sellers are always trying to pull a fast one, or make a quick buck.

I use it a fair bit. I don't think that's quite accurate, but it certainly applies to a lot of sellers. The biggest change though since I started with eBay (user since 2000 ... great I feel old now (already did so whatever)), is that it used to be a place for people to sell their old stuff, or stuff that wasn't necessarily old but they just weren't using any more, a sort of improved garage sale. And it was great for that, so much so that that's the reputation it still has. But now probably at least 95% of the listings on eBay (less in the cycling category, to be fair) are new items being sold by businesses. The nature of the site hardly even resembles what it started as.

[John H.]

Someone had some parts here advertised as "take-offs".
Then he said "parts have been ridden 40 miles".
To me take offs are new parts that have been taken off and not ridden.
Parts that have been ridden are "used parts".

[tuscanyswe]

Originally Posted by John H.

Someone had some parts here advertised as "take-offs".
Then he said "parts have been ridden 40 miles".
To me take offs are new parts that have been taken off and not ridden.
Parts that have been ridden are "used parts".

I think thats how 99% see it as well.

[cmg]

"except for the crown race, which had obvious marks from the fork race removal tool" so if it wasn't for the marks you wouldn't have been able to tell it was used or just installed? the actual race surface wasn't marked? could of came off a floor model. what would it matter it the part that doesn't effects the bearings performance has a scratch? did the ad say untouched, never installed, never removed from the box, virgin parts.......

[shovelhd]

Originally Posted by cmg

"except for the crown race, which had obvious marks from the fork race removal tool" so if it wasn't for the marks you wouldn't have been able to tell it was used or just installed? the actual race surface wasn't marked? could of came off a floor model. what would it matter it the part that doesn't effects the bearings performance has a scratch? did the ad say untouched, never installed, never removed from the box, virgin parts.......

Did you read the eBay descriptions? What is it about New that you don't understand?

[Bentley]

I would open a case with EBay. I've bought and sold plenty, if the item is not as described its pretty much a slam dunk and the seller pays shipping both ways. Generally you don't even have to return the item (obviously it depends on item value).

I know folks here are not big fans, but you get pretty good service from EBay, especially as the buyer

Ray

Originally Posted by shovelhd

I've been building up a travel bike lately and I've sourced some specific parts from eBay. I have had issues with two of them.

First was a Ritchey WCS Logic headset, listed as New, pictured with the box. Purchased from a vendor who should be very familiar to most people here, plenty of positive feedback. Everything was new except for the crown race, which had obvious marks from the fork race removal tool. I wrote them, and we compromised on a settlement.

Second was a FD clamp band adapter, listed as New, pictured with the box. The details said "includes items shown". Purchased from a four figure FB seller. The clamp band had marks from installation. The shim for 28.6mm was missing, and I need that. I wrote him, with no reply. I'm going to have to initiate a return. That costs me money I should not need to spend.

eBay has two "New" condition categories:

New: "A brand-new, unused, unopened, undamaged item in its original packaging (where packaging is applicable). Packaging should be the same as what is found in a retail store, unless the item is handmade or was packaged by the manufacturer in non-retail packaging, such as an unprinted box or plastic bag. See the seller's listing for full details."

New other (see details): "A new, unused item with absolutely no signs of wear. The item may be missing the original packaging, or in the original packaging but not sealed. The item may be a factory second or a new, unused item with defects. See the seller's listing for full details and description of any imperfections."

In both cases, they should not have been listed under either New category.

Is this a trend, or just my bad luck?

[beeatnik]

Originally Posted by John H.

Someone had some parts here advertised as "take-offs".
Then he said "parts have been ridden 40 miles".
To me take offs are new parts that have been taken off and not ridden.
Parts that have been ridden are "used parts".

A few weeks back, I took out a $13000 anniversary bike out for test ride.
Guys at the shop were super stoked about it since it came with 2015 Super Record. I'm one of the few Campy riders in the area so they wanted me to share in their enthusiasmz. Don't tell anyone but I took off on a 45 min test ride (prolly 15 miles). Well, I told them I was going to be gone for half an hour when I walked out the door. That was 2 months back and the bike is still on the sales floor. I'm guessing it's easily at 50 miles now. Here's the rub: bikes aren't cars. And a test ride is not always a test ride. Short story long, I still consider that $13K bika a new bike...tho the parts may be, um, worn or less than new.

Maybe cats should use demo instead of "take off."

[John H.]

Right, But if you took the parts off to sell them would you describe them as new take-offs?
I wouldn't.

Originally Posted by beeatnik

A few weeks back, I took out a $13000 anniversary bike out for test ride.
Guys at the shop were super stoked about it since it came with 2015 Super Record. I'm one of the few Campy riders in the area so they wanted me to share in their enthusiasmz. Don't tell anyone but I took off on a 45 min test ride (prolly 15 miles). Well, I told them I was going to be gone for half an hour when I walked out the door. That was 2 months back and the bike is still on the sales floor. I'm guessing it's easily at 50 miles now. Here's the rub: bikes aren't cars. And a test ride is not always a test ride. Short story long, I still consider that $13K bika a new bike...tho the parts may be, um, worn or less than new.

Maybe cats should use demo instead of "take off."

[shovelhd]

I'm not talking about forum classified descriptions, flea market descriptions, or CL descriptions. I'm talking about very specific eBay descriptions shown above. If a fork race was installed, how does that make it "A brand-new, unused, unopened, undamaged item in its original packaging"? It doesn't.

Yeah, I could open a case with eBay. I'd rather work it out with the seller, and I'd much rather people be OPEN and HONEST instead of shady.