floyd a victim ?

Fixed · #1 08-03-2006, 06:44 PM

do any of the bros feel he was just pawn in the game ?
or he just cheated ?

nobrakes · #2 08-03-2006, 07:00 PM

Floyd's plight is being used to sell newspapers. Whatever the cause of the T/E imbalance, Floyd is being used by L'Equipe to sell it's rag.

Marcusaurelius · #3 08-03-2006, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fixed

do any of the bros feel he was just pawn in the game ?
or he just cheated ?

Well I still believe he is innocent until proven guilty and even then I still refuse to cast any stones at him.

chrisroph · #4 08-03-2006, 07:29 PM

Leaking the A sample result was a little dirty and I doubt he had anything to do with it. Unfortunately, one of the greatest rides in tour history is tainted. He's got a long, tough, expensive road ahead of him, whether or not he intentionally administered T. Sure he's a pawn and being used by WADA, Pound, the UCI, the media, the forum, etc.

Big Dan · #5 08-03-2006, 07:50 PM

I think he rang the bell on stage 17, people noticed......
Now he's just a passenger.......

#6 08-03-2006, 09:50 PM

For sure. There was an article a few months back in Outside Magazine about all the rich guys that run USA cycling. We're all pawns at some point though, very few people are truly in control, so I might as well be a pawn in something that I love doing right?

e-RICHIE · #7 08-03-2006, 09:59 PM

pawns redux atmo.

andy mac · #8 08-03-2006, 10:15 PM

he certainly worked very hard to be a pawn.

Avispa · #9 08-03-2006, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcusaurelius

Well I still believe he is innocent until proven guilty and even then I still refuse to cast any stones at him.

I don't understand why some of us continue to subscribe to this "innocent until proven guilty..." theory. In this case, Floyd has been proven guilty already on the first positive test!!!

Now he and his lawyers, not the testing lab, not the UCI has to prove that he didn't dope. The athletes have the burden of proof. He is actually guilty until he can prove his innocence!

Those are the rules of sport, not the rules of civil/criminal courts.

nobrakes · #10 08-04-2006, 12:09 AM

Floyd is being exploited. His positve should have never been released to the media until the B sample has been tested to verify the A result. We are unfairly judging Floyd when all the evidence hasn't been presented. IMHO it isn't fair to judge someone's credability based on leaked information. The leaked A sample results were released to L'Equipe by the French lab doing the tests, which is clearly a UCI confidentiality violation. As of yet, nobody is being held responsible for releasing it. It's all about selling papers. This has happened the last 8 years, at the conclusion of the Tour, to cast doubt on the winner. Doping or not, it's sensationalism, meant purely to increase sales and badmouth the winners. It's L'Equipe tradition.

BdaGhisallo · #11 08-04-2006, 04:02 AM

From what I have heard, after much discussion, both the UCI and Floyd together decided to release the news of the A positive. They were worried that the Paris lab would leak the news and wanted to get out ahead of it and announce it "properly". Kinda shines a big spotlight on the process and its supposed confidentiality when you can trust the actors in the process. WADA or whoever has the power to do so, should demand that there be a personnel clearout at the lab before they can again do WADA work going forward. If they can't get this, use another lab that can be trusted.

OldDog · #12 08-04-2006, 08:48 AM

We are talking France here. They have few riders who are worth their weight in Lycra. I'd like to see all the pros boycott the tour and support the Giro and Tour of CA. Let the French cycling media machine go broke and bankrupt.

That will never happen, but it was a pleasent thought.

geezohwiz · #13 08-04-2006, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BdaGhisallo

WADA or whoever has the power to do so, should demand that there be a personnel clearout at the lab before they can again do WADA work going forward. If they can't get this, use another lab that can be trusted.

You want to trust WADA to fairly adminster drug testing? That lab is every bit as much a part of WADA as is Diick Pound, who used to be a high ranking official at UCI. The lab does exactly what WADA wants it to do...it finds positive results from rider's samples, regardless of the circumstances. WADA doesn't care about justice, they care about positive test results. That's their "raison d'�tre." So what if they defy every accepted method for properly handling specimens and determining what constitutes a banned substance. Any other reputable lab wouldn't do the work for them given the shoddy way in which they run their organization.

Why doesn't WADA test for things that it can clearly identify as "unnatural?" Why does it test for results that may or may not indicate the presence of other banned substances. A high testosterone level in and of itself is not proof of doping. The existence of an unnatural testosterone substance is. If you can't identifty the unnatural substance, then you shouldn't be allowed to aribitrarily decided what is an unnatural level (and the UCI leak of the "synthetic testosterone" from the isotope test again goes against common medical information,which states the test is unreliable). Furthermore, it's generally accpeted medical opinion that testosterone does not work immediately, but must be administered over time and combined with rigorous training to be effective. How many times before Stage 17 was Landis tested? At least 4, as the yellow jersey wearer. There have been no reports of prior or subsequent positive tests, and he wore the yellow jersey (and was tested) several times after Stage 17. It's all about WADA trying to remain relevant on the international sporting stage.

Fixed · #14 08-04-2006, 09:09 AM

nice point bro

BdaGhisallo · #15 08-04-2006, 10:16 AM

Hey Geezo,

I get you there bud. No indications of doping -> no government funding -> a lot of bureaucrats lose a lot of nice cushy jobs. I get it.

I think the whole process is rotten to the core. Sure pro cycling is dirty with all the dope taking, but the whole process, infrastructure and mechanism to stop it and punish those who dope is even worse in my eyes. Far far worse! They want to set themselves up as a representative of sporting law of sorts. How can that be done when the authorities disabey and ignore their own bleeding rules and guidelines in their zeal to catch cheats. There is no protection for the athletes, the victims and the concept of due process is something that hasn't dawned on all the lawyers at WADA!!

All of this crap emanates from the IOC and their governance / blessing of all world sport via their role as gatekeepers to the Olympic games. National governments blindly accept IOC jurisdiction over any and all sport and every federation has to fall in line behind them lest they lose the blessing of those governments and all the help and funding that derives from that.

If only the UCI could be like FIFA and not give a toss about the IOC. Then again, FIFA is more powerful than the IOC in my eyes. The Beautiful Game has no need for the Olympics and the IOC's impramatur. The UCI feels they do.

Oh... I wish I had a magic wand.