Unbonded Vitus 979...wall art, fixable, or full disclosure sale?

[illdthedj]

Hi guys...
Im new here but from perusing there seems to be some very knowledgeable people here, so i thought i would pick your collective brains...

i have (had?) a Vitus 979 aluminum bonded frameset. I picked it up for decently cheap and built it up and enjoyed riding a small part of cycling history.

however after a year or so a combination of its age, use, and my extremely powerful man-legs (re: fat-ass) resulted in the bottom bracket becoming unbonded from the seat-tube.

in case you arn't familiar with the Vitus 979, heres a blurb i copy pasted:

"The most iconic of those frames was the Vitus 979, a true classic of cyclosport history which was revolutionary for its time and is still highly prized by collectors today. The 979 was among the first wave of aluminium-framed bikes to replace steel tubing in pro peleton, most notably under Sean Kelly who rode a 979-framed bike in several Tours de France."

Essentially its composed of aluminum tubes that were heated and "glued" into aluminum "lugs". so after time and use the seattube seperated from the bottom bracket lug.

I've asked other people in other forums about this, but i thought i would ask here...

what should i do with this frameset?
all the components have since moved onto other bikes...

if all hope is lost, hey i have a nice wall art piece for the garage. i didn't pay all that much for it, enjoyed it for a while, so im not in any sort of distress over it.

However there has been talk of it being fixable. Now i do know there once was a bicycle store of sorts that specialized in fixing Vitus 979s, because apparently they came unbonded (after decades of use) somewhat regularly. This store though has since been disbanded or something. Even if i could hunt them down (all is left is a website that looks a decade old and containing misdirected links and misplaced images) im sure the cost to ship the frame, have them fix it, then have them ship back is many times more than im willing to pay.

Some have said the frame could be fixed by anyone themselves, since various epoxies or bonding agents exist today in stores that are more powerful than anything that existed back when these bikes were created. and some have mentioned just having the offending unbonded area welded. but honestly, i dont really have the time, patience, or knowledge to undergo such a fix. and im not sure i would trust my work.

SOOOO what about selling it, with (of course) FULL disclosure on its condition? Although i might not be able to, maybe theres plenty of Vitus 979 fans/collectors out there with the know-how to fix it?

Honestly if i were to sell it, and it wouldnt be a bad idea to sell and there was a buyer, it would probably be for a small pittance (really mostly just the cost to ship). i dont want to sell to make money, but moreso would want to sell to pass along something somebody could fix and would appreciate.

ive also thought about just selling the fork, and the proprietary seatpost and seatpost bolt...and relegating the frame to the garage wall (although, down the line my wife might persuade me to trash the frame...which would be depressing throwing away a piece of history)


So what are your feelings on the subject?

[Louis]

wall art, fixable, or full disclosure sale?


It's all of the above, of course.

I have a NOS 979 I purchased from Nashbar a few years ago when they were selling a bunch. I had plans to build it up, but decided that it probably wasn't worth it. So right now it's just part of the collection, and will eventually become wall art.

Anything can be repaired, but is it worth the hassle? It's probably just a matter of time until other joints also start to go. Yes, it's history, but there are plenty of other options that are just as interesting, with fewer issues.

In your case I think wall art is the best option, and if that doesn't interest you, then a "full disclosure" sale. (which all sales should be, anyway)

Good Luck

[ultraman6970]

No Kidding ok? We used to fix those using loctite back in the day. Now a days you have better bonding stuff moving around than what the guys used to glue the frame together.

You can give it a try but you will need a jig to keep it straight while the epoxy bonds.

[marinoni62]

You might want to contact them and see what options there are.
http://guywires.com/vitusmain.htm

Maybe they would be willing to buy the frame, repair it and then sell it locally.
No idea if they would be interested, just a suggestion. That way the Vitus stays on the road, you get some money back and guywires might make a few dollars, assuming everything works out for both parties.

good luck

[Gummee]

Havnoonian was supposed to be a wizard fixing these bikes.

Try contacting him

M

[Mr Cabletwitch]

It can't be any harder than epoxying a golf club together. I've been doing golf club repair for 15 years if shafting epoxy will hold a club head on being swung at 120+mph I can't imagine it won't hold a bike together. The epoxy I use to fix clubs never actually fully hardens so it doesn't become brittle unless exposed to very high heat.

If you are close to me I'd be happy to try and fix it as a research experiment.

[illdthedj]

thanks for the input guys...

yes i am definitely not sad if it just become a piece of wall art in the garage...
although i find it interesting how some of you arnt too concerned with just fixing it oneself...because in another bike forum, lots of people seemed to assume a self-fix is assurance of instant failure down the road, lest you are some aerospace engineer or something.

honestly my bike stable is already too full...but i think there is probably someone out there willing to fix and ride this frameset, so i think i will try to sell it cheap, with full disclosure of course.

[choke]

although i find it interesting how some of you arnt too concerned with just fixing it oneself...because in another bike forum, lots of people seemed to assume a self-fix is assurance of instant failure down the road, lest you are some aerospace engineer or something. As Dario once said - "It's just a bike, it's not an airplane." :D

[ultraman6970]

What size is it to start with??? It is unbonded in the BB/st area???

Picture???

Between you and me I would be more scared of riding that because of a failure in the fork than in the frame. Those forks are good but they did not last 100 years. Saw several unglued back in the day. The darn fork is glued too just in case.

[Ti Designs]

so i thought i would pick your collective brains...


This is a case where the collective is far, far less than the sum of it's parts...

The local computer musium has a 386 powered PC XT in mint condition. They don't use it for anything, it's more to say "this is what we used in the 80's". A Vitus 979 says pretty much the same thing...

[zennmotion]

thanks for the input guys...

yes i am definitely not sad if it just become a piece of wall art in the garage...
although i find it interesting how some of you arnt too concerned with just fixing it oneself...because in another bike forum, lots of people seemed to assume a self-fix is assurance of instant failure down the road, lest you are some aerospace engineer or something.

honestly my bike stable is already too full...but i think there is probably someone out there willing to fix and ride this frameset, so i think i will try to sell it cheap, with full disclosure of course.

Selling it, even with full disclosure is very irresponsible, this is a clear ethical decision point. I can't even imagine debating it, if it's too risky for you it's too risky for anybody else outside a bonafide expert. And I fix all kinds of stuff myself including frame bits and dropouts with very basic skills and knowledge. I just don't pass those problems on to anybody else. This sounds less kind and respectful than I mean it, but W T F is wrong with you that you would even consider selling this- you're not even going to get much for it.

[Fixed]

Wall art if you are a Kelly fan
IMHO
Cheers :)

[Mr Cabletwitch]

Selling it, even with full disclosure is very irresponsible, this is a clear ethical decision point. I can't even imagine debating it, if it's too risky for you it's too risky for anybody else outside a bonafide expert. And I fix all kinds of stuff myself including frame bits and dropouts with very basic skills and knowledge. I just don't pass those problems on to anybody else. This sounds less kind and respectful than I mean it, but W T F is wrong with you that you would even consider selling this- you're not even going to get much for it.

It is repairable so I think the OP was more thinking of selling it for a few sheckels to somebody that will repair it. Its not like he is going to hide the fact that its unbonded. If it was glued originally no reason glue won't fix it. Epoxy breaks down with age and heat so its no surprise they come apart, and there is no reason to not fix it unless of course you just want it for wall art.

[zennmotion]

It is repairable so I think the OP was more thinking of selling it for a few sheckels to somebody that will repair it. Its not like he is going to hide the fact that its unbonded. If it was glued originally no reason glue won't fix it. Epoxy breaks down with age and heat so its no surprise they come apart, and there is no reason to not fix it unless of course you just want it for wall art.

I'm not getting into a debate about it (well I guess apparently I am) but neither the OP, you, me or probably anybody else in this forum have the knowledge to determine the likelihood of failure. Even if it is small, it is surely significant, and the RISK (ie potential for loss) is assumed by the new owner, not the seller. You're focused on your limited knowledge of materials; that would be appropriate if the OP were to keep the frame and accept the risk of riding it himself. But selling it to someone else shifts the focus to ethics, some things are just wrong. And for a "few sheckels"? This is OK now, really? I'm done, not reading the flames, sorry.

[Bob Loblaw]

Oh I don't know. I think an old Vitus like that wight be fun to have if it were safe to ride. Comparing bike frame tech to computers is apples/oranges. An old computer is useless, but you can (I know because I do) ride older tech bikes quite happily and even make a good account of yourself in the Sunday World Championships or local crit.

The real problem with this one is the potential expense. To feel safe I would want to have the frame completely disassembled and then rebonded. You don't want to feel like a cat that used up a life every time you ride the thing. I think selling it to someone who can fix it is the right way to go.

BL

This is a case where the collective is far, far less than the sum of it's parts...

The local computer musium has a 386 powered PC XT in mint condition. They don't use it for anything, it's more to say "this is what we used in the 80's". A Vitus 979 says pretty much the same thing...

[redir]

If it was mine I'd just try to glue it. Even if you just want to hang it on the wall.

[Mr Cabletwitch]

I'm not getting into a debate about it (well I guess apparently I am) but neither the OP, you, me or probably anybody else in this forum have the knowledge to determine the likelihood of failure. Even if it is small, it is surely significant, and the RISK (ie potential for loss) is assumed by the new owner, not the seller. You're focused on your limited knowledge of materials; that would be appropriate if the OP were to keep the frame and accept the risk of riding it himself. But selling it to someone else shifts the focus to ethics, some things are just wrong. And for a "few sheckels"? This is OK now, really? I'm done, not reading the flames, sorry.

I don't think the OP has any intention of fixing it and selling it. I think he is considering selling it to someone the way it is so that the next owner can fix it, in that instance the next owner would take on the liability of the repair. If I had two dimes to rub together right now I'd buy it just for the exercise in repair. I for one have built and repaired many things including bike frames so I wouldn't have any qualms about bonding a frame and using it myself. Which is what the OP is considering giving someone the opportunity to do.

[ultraman6970]

Want to see this thing... pictures??

[illdthedj]

Selling it, even with full disclosure is very irresponsible, this is a clear ethical decision point. I can't even imagine debating it, if it's too risky for you it's too risky for anybody else outside a bonafide expert. And I fix all kinds of stuff myself including frame bits and dropouts with very basic skills and knowledge. I just don't pass those problems on to anybody else. This sounds less kind and respectful than I mean it, but W T F is wrong with you that you would even consider selling this- you're not even going to get much for it.

whoa you need to calm down and actually read the entirety of the post, or known what you are talking about before throwing stones and calling me unethical.

true my particular frame has come unbonded, but i've heard a number of people with the ability to fix these frames themselves, and there is even a bicycle shop in california with web presence whose specialty was fixing these frames. so yes, there do exist "bonafide experts".

do you really think i would sell a frameset to someone without telling them the frame was unbonded? what kind of person do you think i am??

these frames have history, and there are plenty of people who collect this particular frame, and obviously people with experience in fixing them. the only reason i would sell the frame is not to make money but to hand it down to one of these people so that they could have it and so someone else could appreciate it.

you make it sound like im trying to make money off of unsuspecting dolts, or trying to pass a problem to someone else.

because eventually, its going to go in the TRASH because i know my wife isn't going to want it being hung on the wall in the garage forever. im sure theres at least a handful of people out there that would be happy to save that from that fate. probably a Sean Kelly fan :)

oh and heres the bike when i had it build up:
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6043/7001008773_67b0ff651f_c.jpg