Ouch my 2010 CERVELO R3 Cracked [Archive]

znfdl

12-07-2011, 09:29 AM

Only 400 miles. I should go back to a Moots. :crap:

http://www1.snapfish.com/snapfish/thumbnailshare/AlbumID=4703743017/a=12708753_12708753/otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/

:crap:

jeffin, I have been becoming less and less a fan of carbon. I know other materials also crack, but carbon seems to crack more often.

I cracked two FSA SRM cranks in three years......

binouye

12-07-2011, 09:30 AM

I hope there was no crash involved, or no injuries to riders.

At least most carbon failures are repairable -- velonews posted something recently about places that repair carbon frames -- but I second the thought to head back to Ti!

Z3c

12-07-2011, 09:39 AM

I am certainly no expert but after looking at the pics I would say there is a reasonable chance that your crack is just the paint. There is a lot of carbon in that area so I think it would take a lot to crack it. I would take the pics to your dealer and let them send them in. Mark both ends with a sharpie and ride it. The marks will allow you see if the "crack" grows..

Good luck!

lhuerta

12-07-2011, 09:46 AM

I have cracked four R-series frames in the last 24 months (all pre-2011 BBRight)...all cracked at the BB just like yours. If you visit the Cervelo forum you will see hundreds of others report the same issue with the R-series frames (all with cracks at BB).

Cervelo has never taken more then 10 days to issue a full frame/fork replacement with no questions asked. In fact they even upgraded my frame along the way. Their customer service is quite strong, unfortunately they have caused a lot of problems for those who have to keep paying a shop wrench to tear down and rebuild their bike. For me its not an issue because its the only time I really get to work on my bike.

Take it to your local Cervelo dealer, have them get the warranty replacement process started including sending pics immediately up to Toronto, then you need to follow-up with Cervelo directly and make sure they forwarded pics to Toronto and got the replacement approved. Shouldn't take more then a few days to get approved and then Cervelo will send out the replacement frame to the shop. In your case you will get a 2011 or 2012 with the new BBRight, which depending on what crank you are using, you may have to switch up (see BBRight compatible BB systems at bbright.net)

If you are not the original owner you are up the creek...

Good luck,
Lou

dancinkozmo

12-07-2011, 09:49 AM

Note to self.....NEVER buy a used cervelo

old_fat_and_slow

12-07-2011, 10:04 AM

Do you have to have a Snapfish account to see the photos?

All I see is a small version of photo 1, and can't access the other photos?

Yes, I am techno-challenged.

rain dogs

12-07-2011, 10:24 AM

Note to self.....NEVER buy a used cervelo

I guess this is true with most, if not all manufacturers. But your point is a good one, that if this frame is prone to failure you're dancing with the devil if you buy a used R3.

BumbleBeeDave

12-07-2011, 10:48 AM

Do you have to have a Snapfish account to see the photos?

All I see is a small version of photo 1, and can't access the other photos?

Yes, I am techno-challenged.

. . . I use Picasa.

BBD

oldpotatoe

12-07-2011, 10:49 AM

that guy

12-07-2011, 11:03 AM

A friend just had a carbon mountain bike repaired by Calfee. Cost him $175 and took about 2-3 weeks. That's cheaper than repairing steel!

Fixed

12-07-2011, 11:11 AM

..hence the need for 2 bikes
cheers
sorry to hear about the crack

lhuerta

12-07-2011, 11:14 AM

CNY rider

12-07-2011, 11:21 AM

Note to self.....NEVER buy a cervelo

Fixed that for you. :beer:

jeffinCT

12-07-2011, 11:35 AM

Here are the photos in Picasa.

https://picasaweb.google.com/114083882679003983111/CrackedCervelo?authuser=0&feat=directlink

ultraman6970

12-07-2011, 11:36 AM

I would sand the paint in the area, it could be a paint problem.

Paint tends to move and there is when u have cracks in the paint. Cracks in steel frames are easy to spot because u notice gaps in the crack when u put your nail over the cracked area but with carbon w/o sanding the paint and looking inside is hard to know.

I really find rare a carbon frame to crack just there. Probably the area is not that stiff as everybody thinks and then the paint cracked.

As for the comment about fixing carbon, well.. if its cracked in that area is just cover the thing with carbon putty and then add a couple of more layers if carbon just to reinforce, thats the nice about plastics, 2 or 3 layers put in the right direction will fix the issue big time and not noticeable after painting.

In steel is so different because it depends of the master builder skills how he is going to approach the problem. In carbon the fix is applied over it (generally), dont need to take the shell off at all. In steel a crack in that area means to replace the whole shell. If the builder is good is a 2 hours work, if the guy has no idea well... no comments. Carbon needs skills but the logistic u need to repair is less than with steel, that's why get fixed a steel frame is expensive, thats the other reason u dont see many builders doing weird repairs. In carbon is different because almost everything is possible to get it fixed and relatively low cost than with steel.

Good luck to the op with the frame swap.

thwart

12-07-2011, 12:08 PM

Ultra-light frames. Durability.

Pick one.

Can you imagine if you'd dropped $1K for a 'mint' used Cervelo R3 and it did that? Ouch.

ahumblecycler

12-07-2011, 01:10 PM

Hold up OP! Is the frame new and purchased from an authorized dealer? If yes, DO NOT sand that area. You run the risk of voiding your warranty. Cervelo is great on their warranties; take it to your authorized dealer from whom you purchased the bike, and (s)he will do the rest.

If you bought it second hand, as bad as this sounds, it is the risk we all run. I agree that if second hand have some reputable CF handler repair it. The bike is nice and worth the repair. And since you do not have a warranty at this point, feel free to sand it down.

sg8357

12-07-2011, 01:45 PM

Only 400 miles. I should go back to a Moots. :crap: ]

:crap:

No stage of the Le Tour is anywhere near 400 miles in length,
sounds like a well designed race bike, maybe a bit
over built. :)

Carry some fiberglass, super glue and baking soda
and you can fix that crack on the road side just like
Eugene Christophe.

toaster

12-08-2011, 10:12 AM

I too have the same frame. Recently, I noticed a creaking noise and like all noises emanating from bikes I went through my checklist and did several things to remedy the noise. Things like clean and check bearings and the bearing cups on Campy UT, re-assemble and re- torque UT crankset, clean the head tube bearing surfaces, clean and lightly grease both skewers, clean and re-lube chain were all a part of this routine.

I did notice right away that the same cracking effect in the paint around the BB area was evident. My first thought was that the frame was cracking. However, that cannot be true since after the above maintenance the bike is quiet again.

My belief is that it is the paint I see cracking.

lhuerta

12-08-2011, 11:17 AM

toaster, you might be right, but without an actual x-ray of your frame (or at least scraping paint from area) you will not know for certain. I too am fairly convinced that in most cases of R-series BB cracks the issue was cosmetic, where a less brittle finish (more elastic paint) would have kept cracks from forming on the paint surface in a high stress area. However, there have been many reported cases of the BB shell simply coming loose from frame. Thus the reason Cervelo simply sends you a new frame when these sort of cracks appear on for frame. If yours is cracked why not just stop by your Cervelo dealer and get a free upgrade to newer (and far better) BBRight frame.
Good luck,
Lou

PS-in my four cases of cracked R-series frame, the cracks simply got larger with use and then the clicking noise would eventually get louder

Peter P.

12-08-2011, 06:12 PM

I agree with the other poster who said that might be the paint and not the frame. I'd put a magic marker "dot" at each end of the crack and watch to see if the crack increases in length beyond the marks.

Unless you can flex the frame and make that crack open up, I don't think you should raise a red flag yet.

Mark it and watch.

benitosan1972

12-08-2011, 06:19 PM

Paint crack or not, seems stressful to own/ride a Cervelo.
Nice about the good warranty, but who needs the headache?
I'd rather just ride my bike, and not have to be super-vigilant on pins-and-needles about my $3-8k bike, that's just me? :rolleyes:

cnighbor1

12-08-2011, 06:30 PM

On TV they had how a bicycle is built. they chose to show a carbon fiber Guru. Once the frame was out of mold they had at with a hand held power sander. Carbon fiber small particles were flying all over the place. Once frame was smooth it was painted.
My point is this I thought these frames were designed based upon how many layers of Carbon fiber you apply and were you apply it. that darn sander sure took off at less one lyer in mutiple areas. I* am not going to ride one. Unless like a Parlee were there are lugs and tubes
Charles Nighbor A Wimp you likes staying uprigth!!!!

BumbleBeeDave

12-08-2011, 06:43 PM

. . . but if I were paying that much for a frame I would not accept the frame doing that, whether it's just the paint cracking or not. While this is not quite in the same class as the bars coming off in your hand or the fork breaking while descending a hill at 45mph I would certainly not want to have a major problem with my BB in the same situation.

BBD

lhuerta

12-08-2011, 07:01 PM

. . . but if I were paying that much for a frame I would not accept the frame doing that, whether it's just the paint cracking or not.

Cracked frames are a fact of life for any manufacturer, regardless of material, but especially with carbon frames. I have heard similar stories from those who own Pinarello, DeRosa, Colnago, etc. I would like to believe that in Cervelo's case that because they manufacturer a heck of a lot more frames then the competitors I list, we are likely to hear about Cervelo defects more then others. However, I have also read about and talked with many other folks like me who have experienced multiple failures in the same pre-2011 R-series frames...so I wonder? In the case of the pre-2011 R-Series frames I think Cervelo recognized they had a true manufacturing defect which is why they have bent over backwards with excellent customer service and quickly provided warranty replacements to all who were effected....thus avoiding a mass recall. With the introduction of the 2011 and newer frames with BBRight, I have yet to hear about a cracked BB. Their new issue is cracked carbon dropouts, but I suspect this is not a manufacturing defect, instead a result of user error due to over zealous torquing of skewers.
Lou

BumbleBeeDave

12-08-2011, 07:07 PM

If my multi-$k frame that I bought new cracks like that the maker is going to hear from me immediately and loudly. :mad:

BBD

maunahaole

12-08-2011, 07:55 PM

I'm with Dave on this one. Even if it is just a paint crack, it shouldn't happen, especially at that price point. These guys sell themselves as a product with superior engineering. Why then can they not get the paint right?

toaster

12-09-2011, 08:13 AM

I really want a Moots titanium frame. I love carbon but at the same time it has become so ubiquitous that it's kinda boring.

The fact is that brands don't matter much when paint is all that covers the same basic carbon bikes from China and Taiwan.

My last Torelli Montefalco showed similar cracks in paint around the bottom bracket. I believe it is fairly common. I do believe it could indicate further stress cracking but in practical use if it were truly cracked then complete failure is not far away.

I had a carbon Campy UT crankarm fail at the pedal threading where the carbon started cracking. That failed pretty quickly once the carbon began to crack and soon I could feel the pedal moving and then I barely made it home.

Charles M

12-09-2011, 08:20 AM

I doubt this case is a $175 repair job....crack at tube joints/lugs are much more difficult and costly to repair, if at all repairable. In this case, the repair will likely require removal of BB threaded insert/sleeve and be much more involved then a cracked tube. Lou

I doubt it's a 175$ repair too...

More likely it's 0$

Unless there's more to this, Cervelo will take very good care, not that it should happen in the first place..
.

But you're right on thinking it "Might" be more in the case the shop or manufacturer wont take care of it.

In the case someone else gets something like this, most BB's can be repaired as well. The cost changes with the BB standard.

Keith A

12-09-2011, 10:13 AM

Note to self.....NEVER buy a used cerveloI have two friends riding Cervelo's, one guy is on his 3rd frame (cracked an R3 and S2) and the other guy is about to send in his 2nd S2 for his third.

William

12-09-2011, 10:37 AM

It sounds like the downward QC spiral of buying/mfr'ing goods from China.

Lower cost yes, but usually large minimums so you have to ship in a lot of product. Much of the time so much of your incoming goods have issues that you start having trouble supplying your customers. Replacements take a few months to get so you're behind the eight ball. Sometimes goods end up getting sent out anyway (putting QC in the customer's lap) to satisfy upset customers knowing that the customer might have an issue (but hoping they won't notice). By the time (if) they do the next shipment has come in so it's easier to just replace it and hope for the best. You can try to work with the mfr to fix the issues but it will take a while to get fixed product into the que, and then longer waiting for shipment to traverse the Ocean on a slow boat (while you're still sending out replacements and trying to placate customers - or stall them until the next shipment comes in). That's assuming of course that the mfr wants to listen to you. If not, then you're searching for a new Chinese mfr and the cycle starts all over again.

Not a situation that any good company wants to be in. I'm not saying that is what's happening specifically with Cervelo, but I've seen it enough and a hint of it is in the air.

William

nm87710

12-09-2011, 10:54 AM

Hawker

12-09-2011, 10:55 AM

Note to self.....NEVER buy a used cervelo

Now that's probably some good advice.

bozman

12-09-2011, 03:26 PM

the same thing happened to a Cervelo a good friend of mine used to own. he went back to ti.

hillzofvalp

12-10-2011, 01:48 AM

Ouchhhhhhh :hello:

rice rocket

12-10-2011, 02:00 AM

You desperate to get your post count reset or something? 24 posts in an hour? :rolleyes:

DRZRM

12-10-2011, 06:00 AM

You desperate to get your post count reset or something? 24 posts in an hour? :rolleyes:

I think his motivations are pretty clear.

* what is the biggest lie you've ever told? I respect serotta for making me post 20 times to use classifieds.

Davefromaine

12-10-2011, 09:41 AM

the same thing happened to a Cervelo a good friend of mine used to own. he went back to ti.

Me too - that's why I'm going back to steel. I bought a used Colnago Mix aluminum frame with carbon B-stays to replace my long-term Merckx. Loved it until about 800 miles into ownership I hit some RR tracks and heard a gun-shot crack from the rear end. (I've ridden that road a thousand times and never damaged any wheels or frames). Found a crack in the naked carbon up near the brake bridge. (no paint - definitely a carbon crack). Retired it, bought my similarly made Pinarello Prince, but it rides stiffer and racier than the Colnago (or more importantly the Merckx!), so off it goes. At least the Prince is holding up better than the Colnago. And at least I have some back-up bike options.

WickedWheels

12-10-2011, 12:49 PM

Our shop just became a Cervelo dealer... we do a lot of tri business and you can't argue the strength of their marketing.

That being said, so far we've gotten in 6 bikes... 2 of them defective. Another one, an S5, just came in to the shop last week after being purchased elsewhere. Without going into details, the bike is a POS. Their designs may be okay, but the quality of the build is some of the poorest I've ever seen on a "high end" bike.

fourflys

12-10-2011, 12:57 PM

oldpotatoe

12-10-2011, 01:02 PM

I'll probably get a carbon bike when I come back down from Alaska in 3 yrs... I'm thinking if I do it will be a Calfee... I've never heard a bad thing about a Calfee and I know they have LONG warranties... the top one has a, I think, a 25 year warranty... that will be enough to give me some piece of mind...

The Calfee's may be slightly heavier than some of the uber-light frames right now, but I think I'm OK with that... ;)

but then again, 3 yrs is a long for bike lust and tech so who knows... :D

OP- hope you get taken care of...

Always gotta be concerned about a shop's rep when frames come thru that are poorly made. Manufacturer is the reason but the shop can take the beating. Used to sell Calfee, dropped them. About 5 years ago, they have had some shakeups internally, so hopefully they are better but......

rice rocket

12-10-2011, 01:52 PM

I'll probably get a carbon bike when I come back down from Alaska in 3 yrs... I'm thinking if I do it will be a Calfee... I've never heard a bad thing about a Calfee and I know they have LONG warranties... the top one has a, I think, a 25 year warranty... that will be enough to give me some piece of mind...

The Calfee's may be slightly heavier than some of the uber-light frames right now, but I think I'm OK with that... ;)

but then again, 3 yrs is a long for bike lust and tech so who knows... :D

OP- hope you get taken care of...

25 years is comparatively low to the lifetime warranty that Trek/Specialized/etc. are selling with nowadays.

Kontact

12-10-2011, 02:52 PM

25 years is comparatively low to the lifetime warranty that Trek/Specialized/etc. are selling with nowadays.
Trek has a one year warranty on their forks, and shorter warranties on certain bike models.

I could live with 25 years for a nice riding bike.

Colnago's 2 year warranty is pretty awesome.