Packing heat while on tour/middle of nowhere

[professerr]

Originally Posted by The B

So... how's everyone feel about abortion?

"Legalized abortion appears to account for as much as 50 percent of the recent drop in crime."

http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levi...alized2001.pdf

[Dead Man]

Originally Posted by professerr

"Legalized abortion appears to account for as much as 50 percent of the recent drop in crime."

http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levi...alized2001.pdf

And the other 50% is the liberalization of gun laws.

[choke]

For anyone who has a real interest in the subject, I'd suggest reading the study linked in this article (the study itself is in pdf format).

In an independent research paper titled “Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?,” first published in Harvard’s Journal of Public Law and Policy, Don B. Kates, a criminologist and constitutional lawyer, and Gary Mauser, Ph.D., a Canadian criminologist and professor at Simon Fraser University, examined the correlation between gun laws and death rates.

http://www.bostonmagazine.com/news/b...ence-with-ban/

[Bruce K]

Amazing how 8 pages of reasoned discussion can head for the cliff when one or two folks decide that's where it needs to go.

Let's try to get back on track if we can, please.

Unless there is some agreement we've exhausted the conversation that the OP was interested in.

BK

[Neil]

Originally Posted by tuscanyswe

This whole topic is crazy, unfortunately a reality for you guys it seems. I will never understand as an outsider but I'm very glad i don't have to debate weather or not to bring a gun for a ride..

+1, totally alien suggestion to anyone not in the US of A.

It'd be a bit like bringing a chainsaw on a ride - a tool, and one that you might construct a situation in which it was useful, but...

[christian]

Originally Posted by The B

Have I been sarcastic or condescending toward you in this thread?

It was an analogy, as you know.

You need a parachute when you go parachuting. Or do you bring one on commercial flights? It's a rock stupid analogy, because it presumes you're going to be parachuting. It's more like wearing a life-preserver on dry land than a parachute in free fall. Yeah, if it floods, you may need it, but really it's pretty unlikely to flood.

(PS: I'm not angry and I recognize that shooting guns is fun and hunting is a worthwhile endeavor, but it saddens me that gun ownership in this country is so conflated with "self-defense" stupidity. I don't know what the heck people are so damn afraid of.)

[Joachim]

Originally Posted by The B

So... how's everyone feel about abortion?

While on a bike?

[Bruce K]

Miscounted. We're on page 14. Pretty reasoned discussion until one or two chimed in with rather off-base content and/or tone.

One last reminder guys - and you know who you are.

Let's get back to the original conversation or the related discussion.

BK

[pbarry]

Originally Posted by Bruce K

Amazing how 8 pages of reasoned discussion can head for the cliff when one or two folks decide that's where it needs to go.

Let's try to get back on track if we can, please.

Unless there is some agreement we've exhausted the conversation that the OP was interested in.

BK

Thank you.

There's been some devolvement of the level of discussion in a few contentious threads lately. Things have turned personal quickly, yet PL members/discussions have long history of being above the scrum that's de rigueur in some forums. Yep, I've lost it in some discussions here, regrettably, and it's embarrassing in retrospect.

Let's keep it classy.

[laupsi]

Originally Posted by christian

You need a parachute when you go parachuting. Or do you bring one on commercial flights? It's a rock stupid analogy, because it presumes you're going to be parachuting. It's more like wearing a life-preserver on dry land than a parachute in free fall. Yeah, if it floods, you may need it, but really it's pretty unlikely to flood.

(PS: I'm not angry and I recognize that shooting guns is fun and hunting is a worthwhile endeavor, but it saddens me that gun ownership in this country is so conflated with "self-defense" stupidity. I don't know what the heck people are so damn afraid of.)

Ah, a sane comment! (No, that was not sarcasm)

[SlackMan]

Originally Posted by professerr

"Legalized abortion appears to account for as much as 50 percent of the recent drop in crime."

http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levi...alized2001.pdf

I know it's off topic from original post, but since the professor brought this up, for a complete story, one might also want to read the paper by Lott and Whitley that statistically refuted the results in the Donohue and Levitt paper. the L&W working paper is linked below. Eventually published in Economic Inquiry.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.c...ract_id=270126

Indeed, the L&W paper concludes that abortion actually increased crime rates.

[bcgav]

Originally Posted by Bruce K

Amazing how 8 pages of reasoned discussion can head for the cliff when one or two folks decide that's where it needs to go.

Let's try to get back on track if we can, please.

Unless there is some agreement we've exhausted the conversation that the OP was interested in.

BK

To summarize and get back OT, I think it would be helpful to respond if you can add to the conversation in a constructive way by offering first-hand or SME advise on the topic:

Originally Posted by josephr

no....no talking about hand warmers....actually talking about carrying a pistol or some sort of armament if you were riding by yourself in a very remote area. Just sort of curious if anyone carries in case you're surprised by a hungry coyote or worse, a meth-head needing cash. If so, have you ever had to use it?

If the OP is asking whether they should or shouldn't, that's a personal choice and I don't think that conversation will get us anywhere.

[christian]

I don't know where you got that phraseology, but that wasn't what the OP asked. I suppose I'm an SME - I see coyotes regularly when I bicycle commute and almost every time I trail run. Frequently as many as five or six in a family group. Never once have they posed even a whisper of a threat -- they bound away, tails below the horizontal. (this is how I know they are coyotes!)

[wpod]

I live in the upper valley of a rural, mountainous, orchard area with lots of gun friendly residents( human and otherwise ). I frequently ride alone on local fire, logging, county and state maintained roads and have never considered carrying a side arm.

[bcgav]

Originally Posted by christian

I don't know where you got that phraseology, but that wasn't what the OP asked. I suppose I'm an SME - I see coyotes regularly when I bicycle commute and almost every time I trail run. Frequently as many as five or six in a family group. Never once have they posed even a whisper of a threat -- they bound away, tails below the horizontal. (this is how I know they are coyotes!)

Point taken, edited.