Pulling Threads....the unraveling of the forum?

William · #1 02-23-2006, 05:38 AM

I find it interesting that the thread that was started by a very happy and excited gentleman about his new custom Zanconato build was pulled? How many times do we read posts/threads about peoples Richard Sachs, Pegs, Spectrum, Kirk's etc...build experiences? What about folks chiming in who already own those builders wares and want to congratulate them on choosing that particular builder? What about forumites who ask questions about the build process, specs, paint choices and the reasoning behind the choices? What about advice on gruppos, wheels, tires and other bits to round out the custom builds being talked about. We've seen it hundreds of times on this forum about builders other then Serotta. So what gives with the persistent pulling of Zanconato threads, and pm requests to not talk too much about it?

I understand your concern about what was termed to me as "Gorilla marketing" in one of your pm requests. But the people who have talked about Zanks are long time forum folks with no history of constantly trying to "market" particular products. Does Zank have a small but vocal following? Yes, but in the history of this forum, no more, and absolutely less so then all the talk and followers of Sachs, Peg's, Spectrums, Kirk's and other quality builders. If you had a problem with the posting of a website address, you should have just pulled the post, not the entire thread. One long time forumite asked if there was an address, another long time forumite answered buy posting it. Again, you should have pulled the post, not the entire thread. A warning about posting addresses would have sufficed IMO. Now you have an excited newbie wondering what the "F" happened.

Climbing off my soap box.

I can't wait until my build gets under way. Stay tuned.

William

SamIAm · #2 02-23-2006, 06:12 AM

If Serotta was still in the business of making lugged steel bicycles, I could understand. But, they made a business decision to stop selling the CSI. It probably made good business sense too. It's not like I would go looking for lugged steel and end up with Titanium Carbon Fiber hybrids. Although, I am sure they are top notch if you like that sort of thing.

I recently bought a used CSI off of this forum by the way.

BumbleBeeDave · #3 02-23-2006, 06:32 AM

. . . William describes, a simple reminder that posting web sites for other builders is not allowed would have sufficed. Granted, this IS part of the forum user's agreement, as quoted below.

<<You may not advertise other websites, via posts, PMs, or signatures. The purpose of this rule is to prevent careless spammers from abusing our forum. This also is intended to prevent posts of a competitive nature. These posts will be edited or deleted, with or without notice, and the members may be banned.>>

The motivation behind this rule is clear, but it ends up being a caution only, since it is practically unenforceable. A mental image comes to mind of Serotta Andrew's head exploding from boredom as he spends yet another night eavesdropping on tedious PM's.

Coming down on a new member this way seems a slight bit heavy-handed, IMHO.

BBD

H.Frank Beshear · #4 02-23-2006, 08:05 AM

Sorry folks but I'll have to disagree. Some the posts about Zanks bikes and frames have bordered on being way over the line as far as the forum agreement goes. If you disagree and some of you will that is your right as for pulling the thread that is Serottas right and should be. It's not "our" forum it's Ben's and we are all here because of his largesse. I'll get of my soapbox now. Frank

#5 02-23-2006, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H.Frank Beshear

Sorry folks but I'll have to disagree. Some the posts about Zanks bikes and frames have bordered on being way over the line as far as the forum agreement goes. If you disagree and some of you will that is your right as for pulling the thread that is Serottas right and should be. It's not "our" forum it's Ben's and we are all here because of his largesse. I'll get of my soapbox now. Frank

Do you have an example? I was shocked to read William's post about how the thread got moved. As someone new to the fourm I would have never though that Serotta would mange the posts so strictly. I would have thought that an talk about custom builds would be good for Serrotta as it shows that people have a gaining interest in their market.
...now I'm going to get kicked off...

93legendti · #6 02-23-2006, 08:27 AM

Here: we have been thru this before:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

e-RICHIE · #7 02-23-2006, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93legendti

Here: we have been thru this before:

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showth...hlight=threads

i found this chestnut buried in the third link:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpo...38&postcount=6

dirtdigger88 · #8 02-23-2006, 08:56 AM

Im just bummed that the steroid thread got pulled before I could get my fix

Jason

BumbleBeeDave · #9 02-23-2006, 09:00 AM

. . . posted by the administrator would go a long way toward forestalling threads like this one. At least for me, it's much easier understanding why a thread may have been pulled if someone simply tells me why. Things simply "disappearing" leaves the situation open to rampant speculation, which usually ends up creating more dissatisfaction than the original situation ever warranted.

Communication from the Administrator to forum members would seem to be the key, IMHO.

BBD

e-RICHIE · #10 02-23-2006, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BumbleBeeDave

Communication from the Administrator to forum members would seem to be the key, IMHO.

BBD

way to co-opt the urbane acronym yo atmo.

Andreu · #11 02-23-2006, 09:09 AM

I see quite a difference in the way threads are treated or responded to (not just by Serotta but also by the forum thought police). It seems like some folk can get away with quite a lot and others not. As an example, E-richie, in my honest opinion (english for imho), is the epitome of how one should conduct oneself in such matters.
A

Smiley · #12 02-23-2006, 09:13 AM

William , I can understand your being upset . Try to view the thread ( I have not read the whole thread before it was pulled ) from Serotta's stand point or better yet from their dealers stand point. I have sent many a client to the website to ask for reviews of Serotta's products just to ease my clients concerns that the bike I am suggesting will work for their style of use. Along the way maybe my client gets side tracked by a thread like the one that was pulled . I am not saying that's happened to me but maybe it happens to someone else. I am open to everything bicycle but in all honesty Serotta as a company and product line has been very good to me and I respect their people who pay to allow us to play in their internet play pen.

93legendti · #13 02-23-2006, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by e-RICHIE

i found this chestnut buried in the third link:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpo...38&postcount=6

Let's roll!

Johny · #14 02-23-2006, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William

So what gives with the persistent pulling of Zanconato threads, and pm requests to not talk too much about it?

William

???
I can still search and find many Zanconato threads posted by you and others.

William · #15 02-23-2006, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H.Frank Beshear

Sorry folks but I'll have to disagree.....

Frank, I see no difference between posts about Zanconato's, and other people's posts pushing the myriad of other custom builders they like on the forum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by e-RICHIE

i found this chestnut buried in the third link:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpo...538&postcount=6

"e", I understand your point, but I think you would feel differently if posts that mentioned your builds started getting pulled. With all due respect to you and your work, you've received way more press (kudos, recommendations, build summaries etc...) about your work on this forum then any other builder. I think that's fine and good. It just starts looking like there's a "your in, your out" mentality when it comes to builders on this forum. Sure Serotta can do what they like, it's their forum. But I think it runs contrary to what people think this forum is about. It's always been considered an open forum to discuss Serotta, and other bike related topics. What draws a lot of people here is it's seeming openness and wealth of info, access to knowledgeable people, breadth of topics, and key people in the biz...not just Serotta. So, call me crazy if I don't like what appears to be selective censorship.

This forum has so far been pretty good at policing itself. So far it's not to the point of some other forums with zealot administrators who delete opinions they don't like, or even change peoples posts to distort what they are trying to say. I don't think it will go that far. I do believe that openness has been one of the keys to this forums success IMHO. What it needs is consistancy* in enforcing what ever Serotta wants its rules to be.

William

*The proper word pointed out to me from a fellow forumite.