Mountain lion attack

[sfscott]

Originally Posted by colker

A woman, probably young, was killed. Maybe a mother, a father is grieving her daughter. A man was severely mauled and is probably in shock..
It´s not about revenge. There is a tight balance when large predators live side by side w/ humans but there is a hierarchy in place. Predators cannot stalk and kill humans... it becomes a habit. That´s one of the reasons the animal who kills is put down.

True, except that the humans were in the cat's neighborhood, not at the mall.

[Llewellyn]

Originally Posted by djg21

after they attack a human. The animals are predators, and are attacking what they believe to be easy prey. If you want to play in the backcountry or in wild animal habitat, you should expect wild animals to be present and take proper precautions to minimize the risk. You are encroaching into their habitat.

Maybe if the animal had moved into a residential area, there could be cause. But it’s really sad to see these beautiful animals killed because they are acting like wild animals. I’m pretty sure that the mountain lion didn’t start the day by deciding to attack a human on a bicycle.

+1,000.

[sitzmark]

Originally Posted by sfscott

True, except that the humans were in the cat's neighborhood, not at the mall.

The mall and the cat's neighborhood aren't all that far apart. There's a fair amount of human traffic in the area. Northbend is "rural-burban Seattle" and depending on where the den was, residential neighborhoods are probably within typical territorial distance for a predator cat. Too dangerous to have a cat without a fear of humans that close to population centers (Redmond, Sammamish, Issaquah only 10-20 miles). There may be more to learn, but doesn't sound like the bikers intentionally provoked the animal. Might have been a territorial defense on the animal's part or natural hunt for food. Given the abundance of wildlife in the area as a source for food, it is very unusual for a cat to interact with humans - especially to leave and come back. Very sad situation in every way.

My family has lived in a collection of subdivisions just outside Redmond for 25+ years and bears (deer, coyotes, and other wildlife) still wander through the back yards 2-3 times/week, day and night. There's a creek running through with protected natural growth boundaries and lots of spawning salmon in season. It's a little unsettling as children and pets are at constant play, but it goes with living in a forested metropolitan area that continues to expand. Pets periodically disappear but thankfully not children. Hopefully it stays that way.

[weisan]

Finally read a news article that has more complete information.

http://www.kxan.com/news/national-ne...g-1/1190066438

SEATTLE (AP) - The two mountain bikers did what they were supposed to do when they noticed a mountain lion tailing them on a trail east of Seattle.

They got off their bikes. They faced the beast, shouted and tried to spook it. After it charged, one even smacked the cougar with his bike, and it ran off.

It wasn't enough, authorities said.

As they stood trying to catch their breath, the cougar returned, biting one of them on the head and shaking him, Capt. Alan Myers of the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife Police said Sunday.

The second cyclist ran, and the animal dropped the first victim and pounced on him, killing him and dragging him back to what appeared to be its den.

"They did everything they were supposed to do," King County sheriff's Sgt. Ryan Abbott said. "But something was wrong with this cougar."

The attack Saturday near North Bend, in the Cascade Mountain foothills 30 miles (48 kilometers) east of Seattle, was the first fatal cougar attack in the state in 94 years. Myers said Sunday that the cougar was underweight — about 100 pounds (45 kilograms), when a typical 3-year-old male in the area would be 140 to 180 pounds (63 to 81 kilograms).

The 31-year-old Seattle man who was bitten first, Isaac Sederbaum, survived. Rescuers flew him to a hospital, where he was in satisfactory condition Sunday, Harborview Medical Center spokeswoman Susan Gregg said.

Myers identified the deceased victim, a 32-year-old Seattle resident, as S.J. Brooks.

After the cougar attacked Brooks, a badly bloodied Sederbaum managed to get on his bike and ride off. He rode for 2 miles (3 kilometers) before he could get a cellphone signal to call 911.

When rescuers arrived, it took about half an hour to find Brooks, who was dead with the cougar on top of him in what appeared to be a den-like area. An officer shot at it, and it ran off. Several hours later, Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife agents used dogs to track it to a nearby tree. They shot and killed it.

Authorities plan to match DNA taken from the animal with DNA from the victims to be certain they killed the right cougar. They sent the animal's carcass to a veterinary lab at Washington State University for a necropsy to determine what might have been wrong with it.

There are an estimated 2,000 cougars in Washington. Until the 1960s, the state paid hunters a bounty for killing them. Now, it allows 250 to be hunted in 50 designated zones.

While they are sometimes known to kill livestock or pets, and though one even found its way into a park in Seattle in 2009, encounters with people in Washington state are rare.

Attacks have become more common as people increasingly encroach on the animals' territory. In North America, there have been about 25 deadly attacks and 95 nonfatal attacks reported in the past century, but more attacks have been reported in the U.S. West and Canada over the past 20 years than in the previous 80, according to Fish and Wildlife.

Experts say that people encountering the big cats in the wild should stop and pick up small children immediately. Because running and rapid movements can trigger the animal's prey drive, don't run. Instead, face the cougar, speak firmly and slowly back away — appearing as large as possible, such as by standing on a rock or stump or opening a sweatshirt or jacket.

Keep your eyes on the animal and become more assertive if it doesn't back off. And if it does attack, fight back.

"The idea is to convince the cougar that you are not prey, but a potential danger," Fish and Wildlife advises on its website.

[josephr]

Originally Posted by weisan

Finally read a news article that has more complete information.

http://www.kxan.com/news/national-ne...g-1/1190066438

Thanks Wei-Pal for an article that really covers it....I'd like to think that if I was the second guy, that I'd attack back and try to help my friend, but hopefully never get into that situation to find out.

[Mikej]

Well, we recently had a large cougar walking through the neighborhood's of Brookfield WI, caught on various home surveillance tapes. It was a huge "novelty" on the news, coffee shop talk, etc., but none of the "authorities" made any type of warnings, like - this cat will kill your children or you as you walk to / from the school bus stop. I mean, if it may rain, the news just lays it on for hours, but a cougar - its just neat that he thinks his reflection is another cougar in your picture window - ha ha -look out for that guy!

[oldpotatoe]

"They did everything they were supposed to do," King County sheriff's Sgt. Ryan Abbott said. "But something was wrong with this cougar."

They sent the animal's carcass to a veterinary lab at Washington State University for a necropsy to determine what might have been wrong with it.

Hmmm..MTB guys were in Cat's backyard..It's a shame that the response to these, seems like everywhere, is to kill it and 'maybe' investigate cause. I don't think it helps to have a LEO opine about the mountain lion's 'condition', unless he is trained to. Seems like the decision to kill it, like immediately, is a 'political' decision to look like 'something was done to fix this', for victim's family. A real shame when nature and humans intersect like this but I certainly don't fault the animal. The concept that it must be killed because it now has a 'taste' for humans is balderdash. IMHO, of course.

[Mikej]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Hmmm..MTB guys were in Cat's backyard..It's a shame that the response to these, seems like everywhere, is to kill it and 'maybe' investigate cause. I don't think it helps to have a LEO opine about the mountain lion's 'condition', unless he is trained to. Seems like the decision to kill it, like immediately, is a 'political' decision to look like 'something was done to fix this', for victim's family. A real shame when nature and humans intersect like this but I certainly don't fault the animal. The concept that it must be killed because it now has a 'taste' for humans is balderdash. IMHO, of course.

Possibly now it considers humans an everyday menu item, and could pass this trait along to its young, who feel its a menu item, and so on, then cougars are ok with showing up at your backyard graduation party and find out there are smaller ones. I'm not a cougar specialist and don't have any wildlife type degree, so I'm going to let the authorities handle this according to their protocol. The footage of the one we had walking around looked like it was pretty comfortable in the city 'hood, its been gone for awhile, but who knows where it went.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Mikej

Possibly now it considers humans an everyday menu item, and could pass this trait along to its young, who feel its a menu item, and so on, then cougars are ok with showing up at your backyard graduation party and find out there are smaller ones. I'm not a cougar specialist and don't have any wildlife type degree, so I'm going to let the authorities handle this according to their protocol.

Hasn't been an attack like this there in 94 years. I doubt the ML numbers are higher, BUT probably more people in their habitat. I doubt it can differentiate a 'human' as a menu item from a deer or other larger mammal, anymore than a shark can differentiate a swimmer from a seal. To say one killed a human way up in the mountains will result in MLs at your graduation party is a stretch. IMHO.

The 'authorities' will certainly handle according to their protocol, no doubt but it 'seems' the first order of business is to find it and kill it.

[mistermo]

My thoughts are with the guy who likely wouldn't have survived, had his buddy not run off, attracting the cougar instead. I expect he's got massive survivor's guilt.

[Mikej]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

hasn't been an attack like this there in 94 years. I doubt the ml numbers are higher, but probably more people in their habitat. I doubt it can differentiate a 'human' as a menu item from a deer or other larger mammal, anymore than a shark can differentiate a swimmer from a seal. To say one killed a human way up in the mountains will result in mls at your graduation party is a stretch. Imho.

The 'authorities' will certainly handle according to their protocol, no doubt but it 'seems' the first order of business is to find it and kill it.

ok

[Kirk007]

Originally Posted by Mikej

Possibly now it considers humans an everyday menu item, and could pass this trait along to its young, who feel its a menu item, and so on, then cougars are ok with showing up at your backyard graduation party and find out there are smaller ones. I'm not a cougar specialist and don't have any wildlife type degree, so I'm going to let the authorities handle this according to their protocol. The footage of the one we had walking around looked like it was pretty comfortable in the city 'hood, its been gone for awhile, but who knows where it went.

Well, I was a wildlife biologist, (now lawyer) and I work with a lot of cougar and carnivore specialists. There wouldn't be any genetic trait to pass on of a taste for humans. It is possible that this cougar (or others) lose any fear of humans (they normally avoid us - smart animals), and cougars, unlike wolves don't form family units so it wouldn't be the Tom (male) who would be training any kits in hunting.

I have heard one report up hear remarking that the cougar was considerably underweight (40 pounds) for its age (initial reports said it appeared to be a healthy 3-4 year old though). If for some reason it was having a hard time hunting/eating, that could go a long way to explain its aggressiveness to what it seems to have perceived as a viable prey.

[Mikej]

Originally Posted by Kirk007

Well, I was a wildlife biologist, (now lawyer) and I work with a lot of cougar and carnivore specialists. There wouldn't be any genetic trait to pass on of a taste for humans. It is possible that this cougar (or others) lose any fear of humans (they normally avoid us - smart animals), and cougars, unlike wolves don't form family units so it wouldn't be the Tom (male) who would be training any kits in hunting.

I have heard one report up hear remarking that the cougar was considerably underweight (40 pounds) for its age (initial reports said it appeared to be a healthy 3-4 year old though). If for some reason it was having a hard time hunting/eating, that could go a long way to explain its aggressiveness to what it seems to have perceived as a viable prey.

Thanks, I would not have known the males don't train their young.

[Clean39T]

Originally Posted by mistermo

My thoughts are with the guy who likely wouldn't have survived, had his buddy not run off, attracting the cougar instead. I expect he's got massive survivor's guilt.

Seriously. I can’t even imagine...

[sitzmark]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Hasn't been an attack like this there in 94 years. I doubt the ML numbers are higher, BUT probably more people in their habitat. I doubt it can differentiate a 'human' as a menu item from a deer or other larger mammal, anymore than a shark can differentiate a swimmer from a seal. To say one killed a human way up in the mountains will result in MLs at your graduation party is a stretch. IMHO.

The 'authorities' will certainly handle according to their protocol, no doubt but it 'seems' the first order of business is to find it and kill it.

The cat population is relatively stable in WA. Legal hunting of cats in season to help control population is practiced.

If the rolling terrain to Lookout Mountain in Golden is "way up in the mountains", then the point is fair. Logistically similar scenario. Similar for lands leading into the Flat Irons in the republic. I don't consider that way up in the hills, even though Red Rocks and Genesee used to be fairly "exotic" destinations. No longer.
Should have built a wall and locked the gates to CO 40 years ago. LOL