Why would we build better bike infrastructure? I once saw a cyclist run a red light!

[cribbit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0kqsUnpGlU

[fiamme red]

I posted a link to this video in another thread: https://forums.thepaceline.net/showt...10#post2578510.

I don't see what this has to do with better bike infrastructure.

[cribbit]

Originally Posted by fiamme red

I posted a link to this video in another thread: https://forums.thepaceline.net/showt...10#post2578510.

I don't see what this has to do with better bike infrastructure.

It deserves its own thread. All Cars Are Bastards. This is a nationwide problem, coming to a head in NYC.

Any time you talk about bike safety - which invariably means building bike infrastructure - the counterpoint is that cyclists run red lights, and therefore deserve to die.

[fiamme red]

Originally Posted by cribbit

It deserves its own thread. All Cars Are Bastards. This is a nationwide problem, coming to a head in NYC.

Any time you talk about bike safety - which invariably means building bike infrastructure - the counterpoint is that cyclists run red lights, and therefore deserve to die.

I believe that most on-street bike infrastructure (called "protected bike lanes" by its supporters) gives the illusion of safety, but doesn't actually make streets safer. In fact, it often creates new dangers.

Last night I was riding down 2nd Ave on the Upper East Side outside the "protected" bike lane, doing about 20 mph. A driver yelled at me: "Get in the f****n' bike lane!!!" There was such anger in his voice that I was just glad he didn't run me over.

So today, I had to use a one-way street with a segregated bike lane for two blocks (S. 5th St in Williamsburg), and after my experience last night, I decided to take the bike lane. Well, I was nearly hit when a car turned right on Driggs Ave. The driver didn't see me behind the row of parked cars until he was already turning, so I couldn't blame him.

[Moyboy]

They ran the red light because there was a strava segment they wanted ride. See it all the time.

[denapista]

How are all cars bastards?

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by cribbit

It deserves its own thread. All Cars Are Bastards. This is a nationwide problem, coming to a head in NYC.

Any time you talk about bike safety - which invariably means building bike infrastructure - the counterpoint is that cyclists run red lights, and therefore deserve to die.

They certainly don’t deserve to die but a lot of bike infrastructure is via a vote..and piss off enough car drivers, the measure will not pass. Simple.

BTW, the chances of being killed on a bike much higher if you run a red light rather than, ya know, stopping..

BTW ‘some’ car DRIVERS are bastards as are some bike riders..riding a bike doesn’t automatically make one ‘divine’ nor does driving a car mean you will eternally burn in the pits of hell..yo!

[Ti Designs]

You see cars on the roads, you see bikes, you don't see many horses on the roads any more. I think they're the smart ones...


I have a drivers license, I took a class in high school about driving (and drinking), there was a road test and a written test, and if I ignore the laws a nice officer will give me a little reminder. I also learned how to ride a bike. That consisted of my father taking the training wheels off my bike and pushing me down a hill. From that point on I could go play in traffic. See the difference? There's no education in cycling, so what you have is exactly what you should expect to have.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by Ti Designs

You see cars on the roads, you see bikes, you don't see many horses on the roads any more. I think they're the smart ones...


I have a drivers license, I took a class in high school about driving (and drinking), there was a road test and a written test, and if I ignore the laws a nice officer will give me a little reminder. I also learned how to ride a bike. That consisted of my father taking the training wheels off my bike and pushing me down a hill. From that point on I could go play in traffic. See the difference? There's no education in cycling, so what you have is exactly what you should expect to have.

There's also no education for pedestrians, but they are allowed to play in traffic. And there is additional education (and testing) beyond that for personal automobiles to be allowed to drive large commercial vehicles (buses, tractor-trailers, etc). The idea is that the more dangerous a vehicle is to others, the greater the requirement for education and skills validation. The question is where to draw the line. Should there be some formalized training for bicycle riding? It's not a bad idea, but should it be mandatory?

[MilanoTom]

I see two types of people on bikes. The first are those people who can hardly be called cyclists - the food delivery guys in NYC, the DUI crowd (complete with cigarettes), and similar ilk. They're pretty much lost causes, and I think that the general public would agree.

The second group are the ones who should know better. They're on their nice road bikes, they wear helmets, and they fly through stop signs without slowing down and run red lights like they're not even there.

It's the second group that pisses me off. They're the ones who should know better, and if some driver nails me some day, the "commenters" will remember THESE guys when they say "all of those guys on their fancy bikes are always going through stop signs and red lights".

Tom

[tuscanyswe]

Wow that is so tough to watch, so sad. There is absolutely nothing anyone can do about a situation like that as a cyclist. Really tough to c how fragile life is on a bike in traffic.

[jmoore]

Originally Posted by tuscanyswe

Wow that is so tough to watch, so sad. There is absolutely nothing anyone can do about a situation like that as a cyclist. Really tough to c how fragile life is on a bike in traffic.

agreed. 100%. awful

[bikinchris]

Traffic studies have shown that bikes and cars break traffic laws at roughly the same rates.

[tuscanyswe]

Originally Posted by bikinchris

Traffic studies have shown that bikes and cars break traffic laws at roughly the same rates.

Are these studies made by car companies?

I find that hard to believe. There is hardly a single car out there that is not exceeding the speed limit all the time. Cars are violating this traffic law so often that i doubt its even seen as a statistic in these studies. But perhaps im wrong.

[fiamme red]

Originally Posted by tuscanyswe

Are these studies made by car companies?

I find that hard to believe. There is hardly a single car out there that is not exceeding the speed limit all the time. Cars are violating this traffic law so often that i doubt its even seen as a statistic in these studies. But perhaps im wrong.

It depends what traffic laws we're discussing. Cars exceed the speed limit far more often than bicycles, but bicycles go through red lights far more often than cars.