A cautionary tale - along with some bad customer service

[benb]

I don't really see any issue with them denying warranty really. Even if there was some gray area, the warranty doesn't say anything about weird marketing one-offs or gray market sales out of the factory. It didn't go through the normal dealer channel, etc, blah, blah, blah.

But the fact that a $3k wheelset is blowing up like this is just yet another nail in the coffin IMO.

They want to convince me I should spend 3X what a set of Ksyriums or locally handbuild wheelset with aluminum rims would cost.

You can argue about the miniscule and fleeting performance benefits of these carbon wheels all day long but these IMO are recall level safety defects.

$3k wheelsets should not have this many red flag recall level issues. What the heck are you paying for? There are too many issues like this with this company that show up on the forum.

IMO the issue here is they updated the design to fix this and didn't recall the existing wheels. Recalling them would cost money, but they should have the money cause they charge a fortune for the wheels!

Tubeless designs that completely rely on the rim tape befuddle me too.. no thanks. I like how the UST wheels I had this stuff was all welded and didn't rely on tape.

[NHAero]

I'd like to hear about this too, having an Enve rim brake fork on my Firefly.

Originally Posted by johnniecakes

So now it we have established that their rims are of questionable quality, how are their forks? I may be having a steel frameset built for me over the winter and one of the options is an Enve fork. Should I insist on someone other than Enve if i decide to go with a carbon fork? If course steel is an option, but want to know more about the carbon options

[pdmtong]

Originally Posted by Pinned

I've ridden 3.4ARs for quite a long time, no issues on my own wheels. They do have the pressure relief nut (which came with them).

Tubeless tape, in general is a poor solution and causes tons of problem. It's too easy for sealant to get past it, it can easily get wrinkled when removing or installing new tires, etc. It's crazy to me that it's the industry standard, even allowing for something like this to be possible. Tubeless standards should be updated to force the rim beds to be sealed off from the spokes / fairing / cavity / etc.

isn't tape a carry over from mtb where pressures are lower and deep section wheels are not a thing?

I have to admit being shocked and surprised as well that this potentially deadly outcome was possible. The deep section of the wheel becoming a pressurized chamber.

I applaud the OP for sharing with an even hand. I to would have hoped that Enve would have made a better offer - not free - but better than $750. Perhaps $750 versus the MSRP of a brand new wheel is quite a discount?

[echappist]

Originally Posted by pdmtong

isn't tape a carry over from mtb where pressures are lower and deep section wheels are not a thing?

I have to admit being shocked and surprised as well that this potentially deadly outcome was possible. The deep section of the wheel becoming a pressurized chamber.

I applaud the OP for sharing with an even hand. I to would have hoped that Enve would have made a better offer - not free - but better than $750. Perhaps $750 versus the MSRP of a brand new wheel is quite a discount?

My only comment on this is that this rises far above the level of something more minor (e.g. a lot of spokes breaking on a wheel) and into something that could be catastrophic. As such, isn't this a CPSC issue, above and beyond what a manufacturer is contractually obligated to provide?

I mean, third-hand cars still get recall notices, even though the manufacturer did not benefit from the sale. Why should a different standard apply here?

[cmg]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

the sealant went into the rim, rotted it out and the wheel exploded. It was an alloy wheel.

So the sealant touching an alloy rim rotted it out. The tape didn't cover the sidewall of rim, this would have eventually happen as a sidewall blowout. What was the sealant that dissolves alum. but seals against leaks?

[pdmtong]

Originally Posted by echappist

My only comment on this is that this rises far above the level of something more minor (e.g. a lot of spokes breaking on a wheel) and into something that could be catastrophic. As such, isn't this a CPSC issue, above and beyond what a manufacturer is contractually obligated to provide?

I mean, third-hand cars still get recall notices, even though the manufacturer did not benefit from the sale. Why should a different standard apply here?

Clearly enve isn't set up nor wants to do much for 2nd owner relief. But yes, for something as catastrophic I would have expected a recall notice plastered everywhere one could be plastered.

your car example isnt quite the same since there is some federal law mandating VIN number tracking but your point is valid.

If the solutions are use this alloy nut and do a better tape job, then I find myself in the not a buyer category.

[54ny77]

Ditto on the not a buyer category here also. I've developed an irrational liking of late for carbon wheels, and was giving thought to trying road tubeless.

After this thread, I think I'll take a pass for a bit, irrespective of Enve-specific issues.

Do all tubeless rims rely solely on rim tape for keeping the proverbial stuff from hitting the fan? If so that seems bonkers.

Originally Posted by pdmtong

Clearly enve isn't set up nor wants to do much for 2nd owner relief. But yes, for something as catastrophic I would have expected a recall notice plastered everywhere one could be plastered.

your car example isnt quite the same since there is some federal law mandating VIN number tracking but your point is valid.

If the solutions are use this alloy nut and do a better tape job, then I find myself in the not a buyer category.

[glepore]

I'm flat out shocked that they know about this and haven't publicized a fix. This on a front at speed could be fatal.

I'd second the notion that the cpsc should be notified. Not out of spite but for the benefit of those that don't know.

[tylercheung]

Kind of off-topic, but it's been floating on the back of my mind for a bit - how has ENVE been affected by being sold off to that HK/Chinese sporting conglomerate? I suppose one would have to be on the inside to know, but I am especially interested in terms of whether carbon fork R&D and build quality would be affected (as well as support)

[unterhausen]

Originally Posted by cmg

What was the sealant that dissolves alum. but seals against leaks?

I think older Stan's had this problem and they fixed it, but I'm not an expert. Ammonia doesn't affect tires, but does eat aluminum.

[msriddle]

Enve has had way too much of this stuff for years.
I wouldn’t buy anything from them long before this thread.
Sucks but glad you were not on the bike at speed.
Invest in some Bora’s or WTOs and ride worry free for years.

[DRZRM]

Yeesh, if I were Enve those are not the images I'd want popping up when people searched for my $2,500 wheels. Seems like one of those cases when a company should ignore the fine print and just do the right thing. A few years back when I had some of their nipples dissolving on a pair of wheels (Edge? Enve?) that I had I bought used, they had new ones in the mail to me immediately, for the wheelset, for free, when I was happily offering to pay.

[djdj]

Originally Posted by glepore

I'm flat out shocked that they know about this and haven't publicized a fix. This on a front at speed could be fatal.

I'd second the notion that the cpsc should be notified. Not out of spite but for the benefit of those that don't know.

They published it on their website (see one of the posts above by rwsaunders) -- I think someone here said it was a year ago or more ago? What more should they have done?

"I don’t know the year that your wheels were built and it sounds like Colby, or whoever prepped his rim, didn’t properly install the tape. However, ENVE’s web site instructions regarding the setup of a tubeless road tire, have specifically addressed this issue (improper tape installation and pressure relief) since at least February 2019. The image on the site even shows the infamous red tape. Be glad that you weren’t hurt.

https://www.enve.com/en/journal/how-...ess-road-tire/"

[zero85ZEN]

Yup, they should have taken care of the OP with no questions asked and maybe a request that he NOT share pictures on internet forums...

I just texted the link to this thread to three of my riding buddies. And I'll probably share it with more.

I ride rim brake alloy rims, mostly from HED and I've never been a fan of the the carbon wheel craze...Just not for me. This thread (and similar ones) simply confirms my luddite ways in this one particular aspect of bicycle componentry.

[NHAero]

Wondering as a mech engineer about what the cross section of the rim looks like for various rim depths. In a vertical loading, the deeper rim is stiffer and stronger and could be made thinner. The deeper rim represents a longer distance for the material to span and to resist internal pressure, so the stress is higher. So I imagine deeper rims may be more susceptible to this type of failure. The analogy is that hoop stress in a pipe is directly proportional to diameter.

Those with more knowledge of how rims are configured are invited to comment please.