Pegoretti: Mxxxxxo v Love #3

[lavi]

TLDR: Mxxxxxo for that smokey steel feel (albeit with stiffness (that is smooth) galore). Want more pizzaz and wanna notch it up, Love #3.

I was able to get both of these bikes out. I'm looking forward to countless rides to further compare and contrast. I know, these "comparos" are so subjective, but whatever.

The "winner" was to get built with SR12! See below, way below.

What I was afraid of was that they'd feel so similar that I wouldn't be able to feel a difference. I know, silly me. I was also nervous (in a fun way) of which I'd perhaps prefer. Mxxxxxo: it's sorta the Peg gold standard. What would I think? Love #3: it's a sassy cousin that's familar as I've had a few already. So what would I think? Well, read on.

My testing route was a 6 mile loop with 500 feet of climbing. It's part of a larger 10ish mile loop that is my daily ride. Over 20 years, I've ridden this loop many, many hundreds of times. So i know the road, and what it offers, very well...like the back of my hand. Also, data point: I'm 6'2", 190-200 lbs. I mention this because the stiffness of these two bikes is somewhat covered by my weight. I can certainly see that a 140, 160, and 180 lb rider would have different experiences.

Wheels/tires were the same. Saddle and seatpost were the same. I transfered b/t bikes to limit variables. The "fit" of each bike was identical in terms of saddle height and stem-to-bar reach. Just sitting on them, they felt identical.

Here are my thoughts. This is my first experience with the brutish Mxxxxxo. It's a homecoming for the Love #3. Time to see how the ride in comparison.

I'd say the Mxxxxxo rode like is so often described. It's stiff, yet super smooth. The power transfer is 100% there. I dare say it's the closest to carbon I've felt in terms of pedal inputs. Push the pedal, and off you go! Very awesome. The handling (of both of these bikes) is bliss. Dario knew what he was doing! Duh. As I've said elsewhere, the reverberations of what comes through the frame is pure steel. By that I mean the way steel rides. It seems (to me) that steel has a certain frequency that comes through the frame. Like I high tensile tingle...in the best of ways. The Mxxxxxo has that in spades. But, it does it with the jump of carbon. The immediacy of pedaling inputs is noticeable. To boot, the bike feels "light". Light steering inputs are all that are required. It's not twitchy, but I do still pay attention. For a rider like me (and an ex motorcycle racer), it's a joy.

Ok fine. How does the Love #3 compare?

The geo/handling feel the same. Same steering/leaning/mid corner adjusting precision. What's different? I can feel the Love is Aluminum is what is different. I'd say it rides just a hair more "light" (not necesarilly weight). It seems to react just a hair more quickly to pedaling inputs than the Mxxxxxo. Not much difference, but it's there. It also loses some of the smoothness that steel offers. It is almost jumpy/bouncy. This is not a bad thing. I'm trying to describe what I'm feeling. That tingle from the road is different. I can feel more of the road surface. Again, nothing unpleasant at all. It's more about what a person, or myself, would prefer. Thankfully, I don't have to choose. Wanna punch it and go, the Love #3 has you covered. It is raring and ready to go. More than any other bike I've felt. Numbers may prove differently. However, seat of the pants, this thing is a rocket. It's not docile in terms of handling. The Mxxxxxo is smooth and somewhat calm in the midst of being stiff and precise. The Love is moreso with some scalded cat thrown in.

To really illustrate the ride difference, there's this. There's one particular downhill corner on the loop I rode that really highlights the handling quality differences. It's steepish downhill right with a little compression dip just prior to the apex. The road then immediately flicks left. Going with proper speed (on my speedometer), it's great fun. The Mxxxxxo was right there with me. It was smooth, but definitely race bike handling. For comparision, I blast through this on my Ti Hampsten on 32s/35s...and I man handle the corner. Not so on the Pegs. It's more like buckle up, buttercup. For me, and my agressive descending style, it's a hoot. So...the Mxxxxxo handles it perfectly. The Love: it's a different occasion. I'm hanging on to the bike as it precisely arcs, but let's me know exactly what is happening. I'd say it is exactly what something like Kirk's Terraplane stays are counteracting. The rear end is NOT glued to the road. It's bucking and snorting. And I loved every meter of it! It suits my riding style to a T. Do I want this ride experience every time, no. But a spirited ride on a spirited bike gets my buzzing for the rest of the day. Afterwards, I was left thinking about what I was feeling coming through to my hands, ass, and feet. I was more than pleased.

So which "wins"? No excitement here. They both win. Which would I take if a person where to put a gun to my head? The Love #3. No offense to the Mxxxxxo because it will likely get very equal miles and pedal revs. It'll come down to how I'm feeling on a given day. I'd say the Love will be a 2-3 hour bike. The Mxxxxxo will be for 3 hrs and longer. Or, I'll do as I please as choosing bikes is one of the only decisions I get to make in this adult life where I only need to please myself!

ps: wait, weight! I know many say that weight doesn't matter, and it doesn't. I would say that any weight difference is only felt in hand. On the road, I couldn't tell. But we always see "How much does it weigh?". The weight difference is noticeable. Not shockingly, but certainly there. I don't have bike scale (yes, I know i can hold a bike while standing on a scale). One bike, Love #3, has SR12. C12 on the Mxxxxxo. This wasn't a preference thing. It was the order in which I received the bikes.

As I mentioned above, the "winner" would get SR12. I'm leaving the SR build on the Love. For now.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by lavi

TLDR: Mxxxxxo for that smokey steel feel (albeit with stiffness (that is smooth) galore). Want more pizzaz and wanna notch it up, Love #3.

I was able to get both of these bikes out. I'm looking forward to countless rides to further compare and contrast. I know, these "comparos" are so subjective, but whatever.

The "winner" was to get built with SR12! See below, way below.

What I was afraid of was that they'd feel so similar that I wouldn't be able to feel a difference. I know, silly me. I was also nervous (in a fun way) of which I'd perhaps prefer. Mxxxxxo: it's sorta the Peg gold standard. What would I think? Love #3: it's a sassy cousin that's familar as I've had a few already. So what would I think? Well, read on.

My testing route was a 6 mile loop with 500 feet of climbing. It's part of a larger 10ish mile loop that is my daily ride. Over 20 years, I've ridden this loop many, many hundreds of times. So i know the road, and what it offers, very well...like the back of my hand. Also, data point: I'm 6'2", 190-200 lbs. I mention this because the stiffness of these two bikes is somewhat covered by my weight. I can certainly see that a 140, 160, and 180 lb rider would have different experiences.

Wheels/tires were the same. Saddle and seatpost were the same. I transfered b/t bikes to limit variables. The "fit" of each bike was identical in terms of saddle height and stem-to-bar reach. Just sitting on them, they felt identical.

Here are my thoughts. This is my first experience with the brutish Mxxxxxo. It's a homecoming for the Love #3. Time to see how the ride in comparison.

I'd say the Mxxxxxo rode like is so often described. It's stiff, yet super smooth. The power transfer is 100% there. I dare say it's the closest to carbon I've felt in terms of pedal inputs. Push the pedal, and off you go! Very awesome. The handling (of both of these bikes) is bliss. Dario knew what he was doing! Duh. As I've said elsewhere, the reverberations of what comes through the frame is pure steel. By that I mean the way steel rides. It seems (to me) that steel has a certain frequency that comes through the frame. Like I high tensile tingle...in the best of ways. Steel has a certain ride quality. The Mxxxxxo has that in spades. But, it does it with the jump of carbon. The immediacy of pedaling inputs is noticeable. To boot, the bike feels "light". Light steering inputs are all that are required. It's not twitchy, but I do still pay attention. For a rider like me (and an ex motorcycle racer), it's a joy.

Ok fine. How does the Love #3 compare?

The geo/handling feel the same. Same steering/leaning/mid corner adjusting precision. What's different? I can feel the Love is Aluminum is what is different. It say it rides just a hair more "light" (not necissarily weight). It seems to react just a hair more quickly to pedaling inputs than the Mxxxxxo. Not much difference, but it's there. It also "looses" some of the smoothness that steel offers. It is almost jumpy/bouncy. This is not a bad thing. I'm trying to describe what I'm feeling. That tingle from the road is different. I can feel more of the road surface. Again, nothing unpleasant at all. It's more about what a person, or myself, would prefer. Thankfully, I don't have to choose. Wanna punch it and go, the Love #3 has you covered. It is raring and ready to go. More than any other bike I've felt. Numbers may prove differently. However, seat of the pants, this thing is a rocket. It's not docile in terms of handling. The Mxxxxxo is smooth and somewhat calm in the midst of being stiff and precise. The Love is moreso with some scalded cat thrown in.

To really illustrate the ride difference, there's this. There's one particular downhill corner on the loop I rode that really highlights the handling quality differences. It's steepish downhill right with a little compression dip just prior to the apex. The road then immediately flicks left. Going with proper speed (on my speedometer), it's great fun. The Mxxxxxo was right there with me. It was smooth, but definitely race bike handling. For comparision, I blast through this on my Ti Hampsten on 32s/35s...and I man handle the corner. Not so on the Pegs. It's more like buckle up, buttercup. For me, and my agressive descending style, it's a hoot. So...the Mxxxxxo handles it perfectly. The Love: it's a different occasion. I'm hanging on to the bike as it precisely arcs, but let's my know exactly what is happening. I'd say it is exactly what something like Kirk's Terraplane stays are counteracting. The rear end is NOT glued to the road. It's bucking and snorting. And I loved every meter of it! It suits my riding style to a T. Do I want this ride experience every time, no. But a spirited ride on a spirited bike gets my buzzing for the rest of the day. Afterwards, I was left thinking about what I was feeling coming through to my hands, ass, and feet. I was more than pleased.

So which "wins"? No excitement here. They both win. Which would I take if a person where to put a gun to my head? The Love #3. No offense to the Mxxxxxo because it will likely get very equal miles and pedal revs. It'll come down to how I'm feeling on a given day. I'd say the Love will be a 2-3 bike. The Mxxxxxo will be for 3 hrs and longer. Or, I'll do as I please as choosing bikes is one of the only decisions I get to make in this adult life where I only need to please myself!

ps: wait, weight! I know many say that weight doesn't matter, and it doesn't. I would say that any weight difference is only felt in hand. On the road, I couldn't tell. But we always see "how much does it weigh". The weight difference is noticeable. Not shockingly, but certainly there. I don't have bike scale (yes, I know i can hold a bike while standing on a scale). One bike (L#) has SR12. C12 on the Mxxxxxo. This wasn't a preference thing. It was the order in which I received the bikes. As I mentioned above, the "winner" would get SR12. I'm leaving the SR build on the Love. For now.

Nice write-up.

P.S. I've seen that top location in so many photos (I think Dan uses it too) that there ought to be some sort of commemorative plaque.

[bigbill]

In 2006, I went from a Fina Estampa to a BLE. The Fina was a race bike, stiff and responsive, while the BLE, although pretty stiff, was an all day bike. I gave the BLE new life with new paint and a few years ago, upgraded to a Falz. The Fina would have been better with a Falz instead of the stock Mizuno.

[Clean39T]

https://abovecategory.com/blogs/jour...oretti-line-up

They concur -

[lavi]

^^^^

I saw this too. They must be reading our posts! Lol.

I bet Wertz wants to ride his Mxxxxxo more than he gets occasion to.

Reading what they wrote, I want a DID and a Round.

I'm thinking the Round would straddle the Mxxxxxo and Love, no? Take the staunch power transer of both and meld the individual characteristics into one.

No, I'm not buying one. Just yet.

[AngryScientist]

Good comparo. I definitely want to ride a marcelo. One day!

All this talk has me considering upgrading my fork to a falz.

[lavi]

..... Dup post.

[Steve in SLO]

Great comparison and data points for those who may be trying to choose.
Thanks for putting this up.

[paredown]

Thanks for the careful parsing and word choice. I may not ever get to ride either, but it is a treat to read a "real" review--one that is not just cliches strung together.

[Metz]

Wonderful writeup, thanks so much for taking the time to post it. It's not making my (hand wringing) decision on which size and model Peg to purchase any easier - right now the front runners are a Duende (comfort and low risk cost of entry to Peg world), Marcelo (steel + speed for big fellas) or a local Respo (damn the torpedoes). Oh yeah there's also a size 60 Love #3 Saporito (fave colorway) I can get my hands on. Plus now you have me dreaming about a disc Round or Respo with Ekar. Yes, I said it, Ekar. Maybe change that to disc Peg w/ Ekar EPS if we're dreaming. If anyone wants to hear me wax poetic about Ekar as a road group let me know and I will start a thread so as not to hijack a lovely thread.

[lavi]

Originally Posted by Metz

Wonderful writeup, thanks so much for taking the time to post it. It's not making my (hand wringing) decision on which size and model Peg to purchase any easier - right now the front runners are a Duende (comfort and low risk cost of entry to Peg world), Marcelo (steel + speed for big fellas) or a local Respo (damn the torpedoes). Oh yeah there's also a size 60 Love #3 Saporito (fave colorway) I can get my hands on. Plus now you have me dreaming about a disc Round or Respo with Ekar. Yes, I said it, Ekar. Maybe change that to disc Peg w/ Ekar EPS if we're dreaming. If anyone wants to hear me wax poetic about Ekar as a road group let me know and I will start a thread so as not to hijack a lovely thread.

Thank you, and the others, for the comments. I'm loving these bikes! Working, while obsessing on bikes, is not easy.

AND, by all means go ahead an start a thread waxing poetic on Ekar as a road group. I'd do the same. I think the cassette ratios are perfect. In fact, I would have loved to have gone Ekar on one of my builds...save for the ergos of the hydro levers. I think the 11s/12s rim brake ergos are my favorite feeling control lever, ever. However, and sadly for me, there's a slight concave to the hydro levers that just don't fit right for me. I tried with C12 hydro and couldn't keep it. Boo!

Good luck choosing a model! The Duende seems to be the swiss army knife of the bunch. Nothing negative implied at all. That is unless you're north of 200#s. Then get the Mxxxxxo.

[Metz]

6' 4" 180, current FTP 270ish but would love to get it back to 175/290ish in 2023. So not a super powerful or strong guy but....my fave carbon bikes have been a F10 rim and the last bike I raced, a 2009 Ridley Noah I nicknamed Boneshaker so I'm guessing I could (but maybe wouldn't want to) handle a Marcelo or Love #3. Looking back I can't believe I used to do long road races and 100 milers all the time on the Noah.

I had a size 60 Duende Somebody lined up but it sadly fell through....I think a 59 would suit me best. 59.5 F10 with no spacers was perfect.

[lavi]

Originally Posted by Metz

6' 4" 180, current FTP 270ish but would love to get it back to 175/290ish in 2023. So not a super powerful or strong guy but....my fave carbon bikes have been a F10 rim and the last bike I raced, a 2009 Ridley Noah I nicknamed Boneshaker so I'm guessing I could (but maybe wouldn't want to) handle a Marcelo or Love #3. Looking back I can't believe I used to do long road races and 100 milers all the time on the Noah.

I had a size 60 Duende Somebody lined up but it sadly fell through....I think a 59 would suit me best. 59.5 F10 with no spacers was perfect.

I don't know my numbers, but you certainly have me beat. By a lot. So ya, the Mxxxxo would likely really float your boat. Same for the Love #3.

I had and F8 and F10. Awesome bikes. I'd agree with your feelings about them. And, they weren't very light.

As this thread states, I have both of these (59 Love, 58 Mxxxxxo). Come on up when the weather ain't garbage. I'll put you on the loop and you can decide for yourself. If you wanna ride with someone that can keep up, it'll be Clean. I'm the partypace dude around these parts...until the road gradient goes negative.

[IJWS]

Lavi, I hereby DEMAND that all bike reviews be written by people with my dimensions!!! Great write-up. Could you do a brief list of your past bikes--maybe whatever you think is relevant? Like Favorite Carbon/ALU/Ti etc? Asking for a friend

ps-kudos to having trouble concentrating at work because the toys at home are all-consuming! It's a rare feeling but so fun!

[Metz]

Thanks so much for the offer! Trust me, my specialty these days is chatty recovery rides featuring a mid-ride cafe stop so we can both watch Clean ride off into the sunset. OK, enough about me - let's get back to our regularly scheduled programming......more discussion about your bikes......