Modern Vehicles

[VC Slim]

Originally Posted by witcombusa

The engine shutting off/on at every stop is among the most ridiculous of the new 'mechanical' unpleasantries. CVT transmissions are also high on the list of grievances. Auto braking sounds like a problem waiting to happen too.

So far LED lighting is the only PLUS I've read...

Mark Cavendish's 2018 season started out with an abandonment in the Abu Dhabi Tour due to a crash in the neutral zone. It was caused by a caravan car not turning off the emergency auto braking feature.

I would not purchase a vehicle with an engine shut off/on feature.

[Climb01742]

Case closed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU4iyYeVIc4

[SPOKE]

Originally Posted by soulspinner

I work part time in a Volvo dealership. Sometimes people ask me if I could have any car what would it be? I tell them it would be a Singer Porsche. Just a car that costs a fortune and has none of the driver tech many my age have such a hard time with. Where else can you spend 6 figures on a car with straps for door handles and not care? YMMV

One of the few I’d like to have......not as s daily driver though.
The newer performance oriented cars work very well but the infotainment packages can be a little annoying.

[Ken Robb]

Originally Posted by VC Slim

I would not purchase a vehicle with an engine shut off/on feature.

All the ones I have tried had a defeat mechanism for auto start/stop. At first I thought there is no way I would ever drive with that system working but a couple of rentals that had it worked so smoothly I thought maybe I could stand it after all. I just wonder what these systems will do to starter and battery life. Manufacturers claim they have designed the cars so start/stop should not incur early failures but I dunno.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by slowpoke

But will laws change quickly enough?

I'm estimating autonomous vehicles (AV) 5-10 years to be available for consumer purchase, and say 2030 for mainstream adoption. You need an entire generational shift with consumers who are looking to buy a new car and younger people who think AVs are the norm.

You have to keep in mind that the impetus for self-driving vehicles is not personal consumer cars. The reason for the push is to be able to eliminate commercial drivers.

All the technology (sensors, servos, computers, etc.) to enable self-driving will be fairly expensive, and will add significant cost to the consumer, so consumer adoption will be fairly slow. But one of the major costs of operating a commercial motor vehicle (truck, taxi, etc.) is the driver (not to mention that humans have legal limits on daily operating time), Self-driving vehicles will substantially reduce the costs of commercial transportation.

So, when will self-driving vehicles get here? When the calculated cost savings of self-driving commercial vehicles exceeds the expected increase in lawsuit payouts for crashes cause by self-driving vehicles. As far as changing the laws, well, the cost of buying politicians will just be calculated into the costs.

We'll be sharing the roads with self-driving commercial vehicles sooner than you think, whether we like it or not.

[mtechnica]

I think a lot of people can benefit from the newfangled electronic safety gadgetry so in that regard I think most of it’s a good thing. On the other hand I personally want nothing to do with any of that crap and I’ll keep driving my e36 m3 until I’m forced to get an electric vehicle.

[b33]

This has been a fantastic thread. As an owner of a 2002 e39 BMW 530 with almost 200k I can say that particular vehicle is almost, literally, a tank. It's an inline 6 with basically no bells and whistles and it works. Except for the driver's mirror it has almost no extra safety anything (i.e., except or airbags). Sure the readouts burn out, and the adjustments on the seats get screwed up, but the car works.

I also own a 2016 Benz e350 and got that because it had the straight 6 with no turbo anything. The electronics have at least been tested and codified and hopefully will work, but there is no doubt they do make my car "safer"

- Camera for reverse: for sure is safe
- Blind spot for side mirrors: for sure is safe
- Bluetooth integration: for sure is safe. We all get calls and fumbling with a headset wasn't ideal
- Lane keeping assist: not awesome, but the car works fine without
- Keyless entry: why not, the car will work with the regular key. Always. And I have two of them - along with 2 keyless. Put it this way: dealing with batteries and all else is easier on my Benz than it is with my Garmin 520. Never mind if my Garmin was tied to SRAM wireless. . . . .

My 02 BMW is 280ish HP with an inline 6 and rear wheel drive and gets 30 mpg highway. My 16 Benz is 306 HP with an inline 6 and AWD and gets 31 MPG highway. I also get a rear camera, blind spot and bluetooth and the bluetooth let's me listen to my music.

[jlwdm]

Originally Posted by VC Slim

...

I would not purchase a vehicle with an engine shut off/on feature.

It is my understanding that in the near future you will not have a choice and you will not be able to disable the feature. I have one car with a permanent switch to control on/off and one that I need to push on each time I start the car. It does not bother me.

Jeff

[jlwdm]

I have a few newer cars and they are so much fun to drive. We are fortunate to be at a time when cars with great handling and performance are available.

I love the safety features also:

Bluetooth for phone
Lane departure
Blind spot warning
Back up cameras
Automatic braking
Adaptive cruise control
Navigation system


Jeff

[Ken Robb]

RE: New features. A few years ago we rented a Mercedes C300 at the Nashville Airport. I was handed the keys and directed to space b-43. I was hip to the key fob to open the trunk and doors. Then after 10-15 minutes trying to start the car I found the owners' manual in the trunk! Who knew I had to have my foot on the brake to start the car even though it was in park? I think they all work that way now.

[Gummee]

Seems to me we're trying to make it so you don't have to pay attention to your driving: lane departure warnings? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

Emergency braking? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

Blind spot monitoring? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

etc etc etc

I was almost backed into walking to my car by the lady that works in the office next to me. She never once looked around her car. All she did was stare at the backup camera. *I* was watching what she was doing so it was a non-event, but still. You HAVE to look outside your car when you're driving! The cameras, etc can't see everything.

M

[BikeNY]

Originally Posted by Ken Robb

RE: New features. A few years ago we rented a Mercedes C300 at the Nashville Airport. I was handed the keys and directed to space b-43. I was hip to the key fob to open the trunk and doors. Then after 10-15 minutes trying to start the car I found the owners' manual in the trunk! Who knew I had to have my foot on the brake to start the car even though it was in park? I think they all work that way now.

I think all cars have worked that way for like 20 years!

Originally Posted by Gummee

Seems to me we're trying to make it so you don't have to pay attention to your driving: lane departure warnings? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

Emergency braking? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

Blind spot monitoring? Stop looking at your #$%#$ phone!

etc etc etc

I was almost backed into walking to my car by the lady that works in the office next to me. She never once looked around her car. All she did was stare at the backup camera. *I* was watching what she was doing so it was a non-event, but still. You HAVE to look outside your car when you're driving! The cameras, etc can't see everything.

M

Agreed, at least on the backup camera. Turning you head to look out the back gives you a much wider and more complete view of what's behind you. I do think the Blind spot monitoring is a good thing, because like the name implies, it's a hard spot to see. I'm not a fan of the lane departure warning thing, I don't want the car telling me to get back back in my lane!

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by VC Slim

Mark Cavendish's 2018 season started out with an abandonment in the Abu Dhabi Tour due to a crash in the neutral zone. It was caused by a caravan car not turning off the emergency auto braking feature.

I would not purchase a vehicle with an engine shut off/on feature.

ALL are easily able to be shut off...

[Climb01742]

There's another angle on car safety: the rest of us knowing a car is there. Particularly true while riding. Electric cars can be utterly silent while driving. We humans use sound to know what's around us and coming at us and coming up behind us. I've gotten surprised a few times on my bike by an electric car passing me silently. Should all cars need to make some sound for people outside the car?

One other thought. Self-driving cars won't need headlights, right? They'll 'see' by other means. But imagine in the future, self-driving electric cars silently driving through the night sans headlights? In that case, they'd 'need' lights not for the car but for us, outside the car, to see it. Crazy world ahead.

[martl]

Originally Posted by jlwdm

I have a few newer cars and they are so much fun to drive. We are fortunate to be at a time when cars with great handling and performance are available.

I love the safety features also:

Bluetooth for phone
Lane departure
Blind spot warning
Back up cameras
Automatic braking
Adaptive cruise control
Navigation system


Jeff

Agree on most parts. Backup camera is just an excuse for "permission to design a car with zero thought about driver vision", but i love my adaptive CC, the emergency braking assistant and i got used to the lane assist. BT is a convenience, satnav is great, as are heated windscreens and mirrors.

My Subi has those, it also has a mechanical dimming rv mirror and an old school handbrake, which i love, and when i open the hood i actually see an engine block with ignition cables and stuff, instead of a plastic fairing saying "take your unskilled unauthorized fingers of me, you peasant". I might even be able to touch something in there without the need for a factory reset of the electronics, who knows.

Things i don't have and don't need are: parking assistant (my VW had one, and it worked only in spaces big enough to land a jumbo jet in), intelligent seat management, self-opening bootlids, ambient light assistant, ambient air assistant, ambiant smell assistant, sound design, high beam assistant, a choice of 17 interior application designs and materials, HUD, Gesture Control, running board assistant, or an intelligent heated cup holder. Sorry.