OT: so who else is on the job market?

[buddybikes]

On vac this week, don't want to go back or if I do part time.

[RWL2222]

Originally Posted by Idris Icabod

I'm an organic chemist working in pharma. I've done this for 20 years since finishing my post-doc. Our company was acquired in March and we are all out on July 15th. I passed the patent bar about 5 years ago and am looking to make the transition to a law firm. I thought I had a position lined up to work for a small firm and they would train me as I/we knew I am essentially entry level. They gave me my first assignment this week to write claims on a very complex invention completely outside if my field with no help. I am not an anxious person but I think I experienced my first panic attack last night that lasted 3 hours from midnight until 3 AM. It looks like this isn't going to work out, at least at this place. Kinda sucks as it was a not too hideous drive and the family would have moved as I got more comfortable, but it looks like expectations aren't a mutual fit. Back to square one in job hunting!

Until recently I oversaw a portfolio of nine patents (physical chemistry) in various stages of prosecution, and now have licensed two in a separate family. You have the advantage in that you are available, have connected with the opportunity (i.e. the job) and have a cross-domain perspective. By contrast, given that it's a new technique, it might be the case many of the experts in the particular field are a) hard to find and engage; and b) know enough to be criticize very specifically without the creativity to constructively advance the claims. You know how to do a literature search, and applying these same skills to the patent search system can take you a long ways, and offer a framework for what questions to ask. What I have seen in working with loads of counsel at five different large law firms (my counsel, plus those representing three different universities) is that they ask a stack of questions, then restate the answers for clarity, and importantly for the strategy underlying the patent. Choose your initial questions as preparation.

You bring base of expertise from a different field that informs the *process* of discovery and documentation that you can take charge of. There is no "ideal" best lawyer for technically complex claims--it's new for everyone. Cross-domain perspectives are useful. Perhaps you can find parallels from your own base of experience that are applicable anecdotally to get the discovery questions rolling. But strictly speaking it is not expertise in the underlying science that matters. You are fortunate to have an opportunity at a crazy time like this, and there are different angles from which you can approach it. Patent claims are a process of creativity and inquiry.

Take a deep breath, give it your best efforts and try to have fun with the challenge.

[OperaLover]

Originally Posted by Idris Icabod

I'm an organic chemist working in pharma. I've done this for 20 years since finishing my post-doc. Our company was acquired in March and we are all out on July 15th. I passed the patent bar about 5 years ago and am looking to make the transition to a law firm. I thought I had a position lined up to work for a small firm and they would train me as I/we knew I am essentially entry level. They gave me my first assignment this week to write claims on a very complex invention completely outside if my field with no help. I am not an anxious person but I think I experienced my first panic attack last night that lasted 3 hours from midnight until 3 AM. It looks like this isn't going to work out, at least at this place. Kinda sucks as it was a not too hideous drive and the family would have moved as I got more comfortable, but it looks like expectations aren't a mutual fit. Back to square one in job hunting!

That test was destined for failure. The fact that they did that to you tells me you should not work for them. Claim construction can be pretty subjective and that was not fair. I'm not a patent attorney but everyone has their own style. The fact that it was out of your technology area was doubly unfair. Law firms are tough, and the IP world is just getting squeezed. Good luck in your hunt. Organic PhDs are usually in demand. Where in the country are you?

[OperaLover]

Originally Posted by gasman

Wow-that's a lot to unpack. You've got an admirable attitude. Hang in there and good luck.

Thank you, Gasman.

[weaponsgrade]

Originally Posted by OperaLover

I'm a trademark/intellectual property attorney. I was with my firm for almost 19 years. Laid off in November. Frankly, I was burned out, battling depression, going through a long separation, and now a divorce. My oldest son leaves for the USMC in 4-days. I'm happy and proud, but will miss him terribly! Selling house and wife is moving to So. California and taking the remaining kids (16yo daughter and 14yo son) to take care of aging parents and a job that is a career move for her. I accept this and it is in the best interest of all involved. A custody battle does no good for anyone and she is a good mother. At least things are moving forward.

58yo and no one wants to hire me. Not much luck in finding an in-house job with a company. Do not want to go back to a law firm, but it might be my only option.

Trying to stay positive. I have the support of my father and sister, a good therapist, and a great network of friends. A roof over my head and some savings. I have the freedom to move if I have to. Not to preach, but this has brought me closer to God, my family, and humbled me greatly. I have gained so much insight and a healthy outlook that there is so much out of our control.

Keep it in perspective. This too shall pass, but I've been in this battle for almost 5-years and I trust my luck will change soon. In the meantime, I stick to this motto.

"By God's grace I live my life one day at a time, but sometimes it's just one breath . . ."

That’s tough. Hang in there. I’d start with contacting all the previous people you did work for and tell them you’re available.

[Asudef]

I was coasting along until this week when the layoffs happened suddenly.
It wouldn't be so bad normally but in this economy/state of the world, its a little scary as there's multiple layers now to consider and especially given I'm looking to change fields or looking at how to fill in time/income in between.

I was wanting to quit eventually to make a change but not even having the freedom to travel and find or recollect myself right now is what's really hurting, right along with not having a say.

It sucks to say the least but like OperaLover, I'm focusing on the positive and being appreciative of the small things and just being grateful in general.
Not to take away from what's going on with you, I don't have as much going on nor would I feel as ready to handle things as you seem to be.
The way I'm framing it is that now, without the weight of work on me there's no better time than to work on myself and be a better person. To be more introspective and focus on myself more to find out what I want from life.

[buddybikes]

Originally Posted by steveandbarb1

On vac this week, don't want to go back or if I do part time.

I want to publicly apologize for not reading through this thread and seeing what people are going through. Will be more thorough before opening my fat mouth.
Good luck to those displaced. Unless you are self employed we are all venerable

[weaponsgrade]

Originally Posted by Idris Icabod

I'm an organic chemist working in pharma. I've done this for 20 years since finishing my post-doc. Our company was acquired in March and we are all out on July 15th. I passed the patent bar about 5 years ago and am looking to make the transition to a law firm. I thought I had a position lined up to work for a small firm and they would train me as I/we knew I am essentially entry level. They gave me my first assignment this week to write claims on a very complex invention completely outside if my field with no help. I am not an anxious person but I think I experienced my first panic attack last night that lasted 3 hours from midnight until 3 AM. It looks like this isn't going to work out, at least at this place. Kinda sucks as it was a not too hideous drive and the family would have moved as I got more comfortable, but it looks like expectations aren't a mutual fit. Back to square one in job hunting!

I'm clueless about pharma, but here's what I'd do. Get familiar with the technology area by reading up on other patents. Do a keyword search using terms from the invention disclosure. Try and get a sense from reading these other patents of the terminology and level of detail that's used. I'd guess the level of detail should be something between what you'd read in the nytimes and an academic journal. Study the independent claims so you can get a sense of how others have claimed things. Prepare a few sample independent claims that approach the invention from different angles and levels of detail. Try and get the managing atty to review and sign-off. Once you have that sign-off, use those claims as an outline for the rest of the application. The idea is to try and explode each one of those claim elements. The order of work should be claims -> drawings -> detailed description. Usually it's an iterative process. Good luck.

[texbike]

Originally Posted by C40_guy

So...how'd it go?

If you need to explore other opportunities, I know some people in Austin...and elsewhere...

Thanks for asking! The presentation went pretty well - great feedback and positive comments. However, 1st half results have been abysmal. The worst that I've had in 5 years. I'll send you a separate PM to compare notes. Again, thanks for asking!

Originally Posted by OperaLover

I'm a trademark/intellectual property attorney. I was with my firm for almost 19 years. Laid off in November. Frankly, I was burned out, battling depression, going through a long separation, and now a divorce. My oldest son leaves for the USMC in 4-days. I'm happy and proud, but will miss him terribly! Selling house and wife is moving to So. California and taking the remaining kids (16yo daughter and 14yo son) to take care of aging parents and a job that is a career move for her. I accept this and it is in the best interest of all involved. A custody battle does no good for anyone and she is a good mother. At least things are moving forward.

58yo and no one wants to hire me. Not much luck in finding an in-house job with a company. Do not want to go back to a law firm, but it might be my only option.

Trying to stay positive. I have the support of my father and sister, a good therapist, and a great network of friends. A roof over my head and some savings. I have the freedom to move if I have to. Not to preach, but this has brought me closer to God, my family, and humbled me greatly. I have gained so much insight and a healthy outlook that there is so much out of our control.

Keep it in perspective. This too shall pass, but I've been in this battle for almost 5-years and I trust my luck will change soon. In the meantime, I stick to this motto.

"By God's grace I live my life one day at a time, but sometimes it's just one breath . . ."

Wow! That's a lot of change. I'm really sorry to hear that you've dealt with so much recently. I really love your perspective highlighted above! Given our remote work environment and your background, it seems like it might be easy to pick up some contract work until something more permanent comes along. I wish you the best in your job search and other life changes.

Texbike

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by OperaLover

I'm a trademark/intellectual property attorney. I was with my firm for almost 19 years. Laid off in November. Frankly, I was burned out, battling depression, going through a long separation, and now a divorce. My oldest son leaves for the USMC in 4-days. I'm happy and proud, but will miss him terribly! Selling house and wife is moving to So. California and taking the remaining kids (16yo daughter and 14yo son) to take care of aging parents and a job that is a career move for her. I accept this and it is in the best interest of all involved. A custody battle does no good for anyone and she is a good mother. At least things are moving forward.

58yo and no one wants to hire me. Not much luck in finding an in-house job with a company. Do not want to go back to a law firm, but it might be my only option.

Trying to stay positive. I have the support of my father and sister, a good therapist, and a great network of friends. A roof over my head and some savings. I have the freedom to move if I have to. Not to preach, but this has brought me closer to God, my family, and humbled me greatly. I have gained so much insight and a healthy outlook that there is so much out of our control.

Keep it in perspective. This too shall pass, but I've been in this battle for almost 5-years and I trust my luck will change soon. In the meantime, I stick to this motto.

"By God's grace I live my life one day at a time, but sometimes it's just one breath . . ."

Yikes, good luck...your bad news plate is full, you deserve some good news..another saying...

"Things will be Ok in the end, If it's not Ok, it's not the end"

Attorney? Even if it ain't the best path, I'm sure you can find employment in these really bizarre times.

Hang in there..

AND, thank your son for his service...as an aside, during these times, going into the military is not a bad choice, for any of you who have recent HS grads who aren't necessarily 'college' bound...

[OperaLover]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Yikes, good luck...your bad news plate is full, you deserve some good news..another saying...

"Things will be Ok in the end, If it's not Ok, it's not the end"

Attorney? Even if it ain't the best path, I'm sure you can find employment in these really bizarre times.

Hang in there..

AND, thank your son for his service...as an aside, during these times, going into the military is not a bad choice, for any of you who have recent HS grads who aren't necessarily 'college' bound...

Thank you for your kind words. My son has wanted to be a Marine since he was a freshman in high school. I am so proud of him for choosing the military option and not simply as a fallback. He tested extremely well and got his choice of MOS, which was Intelligence. He scored solidly for his slot but was a few points short of going to language school, which was a relief for him. His goal is MARSOC and boots on the ground. If you can't tell, I am bursting with pride and crying at the same time.

Once he leaves I'm not sure when I will see him again. Graduation is currently closed and leave is canceled. Hopefully, things will open up by the time he gets out of boot camp. In the meantime, I pray that he stays safe and continues to make good choices.

[gomango]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

....going into the military is not a bad choice, for any of you who have recent HS grads who aren't necessarily 'college' bound...

Or for those who are exceptionally talented for that matter.

My nephew is off to med school this fall and the AF offered an awfully compelling package to join.

He said yes to their offer and he certainly knows what he will be doing for the next decade.

We are so proud of him and his upcoming service.