Willy Mays-winner

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

He was really hurt by most of that career in Candlestick.

The offensive gap with Ruth is too wide, and if he'd played in Oracle/Pac Bell/AT&T like his godson, his stats might mirror his godson's a little closer, but Bonds is the better post-war hitter. Though that might change if Trout keeps going at the rate he's going.

Easily top 5 and one of the three best position players, but best ever? Bit shy of that.

I could see making the case for Bonds as the better pure hitter (possible for Ted Williams too) but not the better complete player. And, while comparisons across long time periods are difficult, simply the fact that Ruth did not compete against half of the best ballplayers of his age nullifies the disparity IMO. And, again, as a complete player, no comparison even with Ruth's pitching achievements.

I'm curious who you have ahead of him. Griffey?

[wc1934]

Originally Posted by cgolvin

I could see making the case for Bonds as the better pure hitter (possible for Ted Williams too) but not the better complete player. And, while comparisons across long time periods are difficult, simply the fact that Ruth did not compete against half of the best ballplayers of his age nullifies the disparity IMO. And, again, as a complete player, no comparison even with Ruth's pitching achievements.

I'm curious who you have ahead of him. Griffey?

How does that big headed juicer even get into this conversation?

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by wc1934

How does that big headed juicer even get into this conversation?

As much as I dislike the guy, when you ignore the power numbers and just look at his ability to strike the ball, it's hard to argue against him being one of the best pure hitters.

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by wc1934

How does that big headed juicer even get into this conversation?

Because even before steroids he was one of the best postwar hitters in the game.

Originally Posted by cgolvin

I could see making the case for Bonds as the better pure hitter (possible for Ted Williams too) but not the better complete player. And, while comparisons across long time periods are difficult, simply the fact that Ruth did not compete against half of the best ballplayers of his age nullifies the disparity IMO. And, again, as a complete player, no comparison even with Ruth's pitching achievements.

I'm curious who you have ahead of him. Griffey?

Even with a segregated league Ruth's numbers are stupefying, the gap defensively where Mays is better is more than offset by the superiority at the plate.

If we're restricting to position players:
Ruth, Cobb, Bonds, Mays and either Henderson or Williams, depends on the day.

But an absolute Top 5 would have to include Walter Johnson and Cy Young.

[reuben]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

But an absolute Top 5 would have to include Walter Johnson and Cy Young.

I read this book a few years ago. I'm not a real baseball fan, but I thought it was a great read.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0964543907/

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Even with a segregated league Ruth's numbers are stupefying, the gap defensively where Mays is better is more than offset by the superiority at the plate.

If we're restricting to position players:
Ruth, Cobb, Bonds, Mays and either Henderson or Williams, depends on the day.

But an absolute Top 5 would have to include Walter Johnson and Cy Young.

Thanks. Clearly we disagree.

[fiamme red]

Happy 90th birthday Willie Mays!

https://www.mlb.com/news/willie-mays-90th-birthday

[OtayBW]

Originally Posted by fiamme red

Happy 90th birthday Willie Mays!

https://www.mlb.com/news/willie-mays-90th-birthday

^
YAAAAAAYY!

[XXtwindad]

Great article in the NYT: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nyt...ys-90.amp.html

But, maybe a fact-checker would be in order:

“ It’s as if a curtain were falling on an entire era of baseball, and an extraordinary era it was — from the 1950s through the ’70s, a period when M.L.B.’s expansion west turned the game into a transcontinental enterprise; when the burgeoning medium of television created instant megastars; and when the All-Star Game mattered. When the “Game of the Week” was must-watch TV and baseball was venerated as a model of inclusion and diversity.

Mays alone now holds the torch for that era.”

Apparently, the author has never heard of Sandy Koufax.

[OtayBW]

I don't care for or go to FB too often, but I did today, and I found the following. Some of these quotes are priceless. I LOVE this:

1) "That Willie Mays, he's one of the greatest center fielders who ever lived. You can go back as far as you want and name all the great ones – Tris Speaker, Eddie Roush, Max Carey, Earle Combs, Joe DiMaggio. I don't care who you name, Mays is just as good, maybe better." — Harry Hooper

2) "Willie Mays is the greatest ballplayer I've ever seen. I never saw Joe DiMaggio play, but if Joe DiMaggio was better than Willie Mays, he belongs in Heaven." — Roberto Clemente

3) "I think I was the best ballplayer I’ve ever seen. I feel nobody in the world could do what I could do on a baseball field. I hope I’m not saying anything wrong, but you have to think you’re the best. The next one would be Roberto Clemente." — Willie Mays

4) "[Mays] and Joe DiMaggio are the greatest center fielders I ever saw. But Joe couldn't run the bases as well; he wasn't as daring as Willie. I would pay money just to see him play. He brings back the old days for a fellow like myself. . . . How about that arm? It's the greatest I ever saw. Bob Meusel, of the old-time Yankees, was good, too. But you can't beat Willie." — Frankie Frisch

5) "Outside of Joe DiMaggio, Willie Mays is the greatest all-around baseball player of my time. Certainly, he's been the most daring. Mays would steal home, a tough play and one in which you've got a great chance to look bad. Willie didn't even think of that, he'd just go. Nine times out of ten, he'd make it." — Mickey Mantle

6) "Snider, Mantle, and Mays. You could get a fat lip in any saloon by starting an argument as to which was best. One point was beyond argument, though. Willie was by all odds the most exciting." — Red Smith

7) "I've seen Speaker, Cobb, Hooper – oh, all the great outfielders – but I've never seen anyone who was any better than Willie Mays. . . . [He] can throw, field, hit, run, anything. . . . Cobb was a better hitter. But Mays – I don't know, there's just something about him." — Al Bridwell

8) "Mays is the only man in baseball I'd pay to see play." — Ty Cobb

9) "Mays is one of the few modern players who [is] just as good as the best of the old-timers." — Sam Crawford

10) "There have been only two geniuses in the world: Willie Mays and Willie Shakespeare." — Tallulah Bankhead

11) "You used to think if the score was 5-0, [Mays] would hit a five-run homer." — Reggie Jackson

12) "[Mays] scooped the ball up at the base of the 406-foot sign, whirled and fired. It came in on one bounce, directly in front of the plate, and into the glove of catcher Tom Haller, who put it on the astonished Willie Stargell. It was described by old-timers as the greatest throw ever made in ancient Forbes Field." — Bob Stevens, San Francisco Chronicle, August 25, 1965

13) "I couldn't believe Mays could throw that far. I figured there had to be a relay. Then I found out there wasn't. He's too good for this world." — Willie Stargell

14) "People talk about that catch [1954 World Series] and, I've said this many times, that I've made better catches than that many times in the regular season." — Willie Mays

15) "An unusual event occurred in the seventh. [Jim] Greengrass tripled over the head of Willie Mays. To a Giant fan, this is like tripling over the Empire State building." — Bob Cooke, New York Herald Tribune, 1954

16) "I can't believe that Babe Ruth was a better player than Willie Mays. Ruth is to baseball what Arnold Palmer is to golf. He got the game moving. But I can't believe he could run as well as Mays, and I can't believe he was any better an outfielder." — Sandy Koufax

17) "They invented the All-Star Game for Willie Mays." — Ted Williams

18) "If [Mays] could cook, I'd marry him." — Leo Durocher

19) "As a batter, his only weakness is a wild pitch." — Bill Rigney

20) "I'm not sure what the hell charisma is, but I get the feeling it's Willie Mays." — Ted Kluszewski

21) "I always enjoyed playing ball, and it didn't matter to me whether I played with white kids or black. I never understood why an issue was made of who I played with, and I never felt comfortable, when I grew up, telling other people how to act. . . . It was the grownups who got upset . . . I never got into a fight that was caused by racism." — Willie Mays

22) "When I was seventeen years old, I realized I was in a form of show business. It's like being on the Broadway stage. He doesn't phrase his part exactly the same way every day. He thinks up new things. So I played for the fans, and I wanted to make sure each fan that came out would see something different I did each day." — Willie Mays

23) "In order to excel, you must be completely dedicated to your chosen sport. You must also be prepared to work hard and be willing to accept constructive criticism. Without one-hundred percent dedication, you won't be able to do this." — Willie Mays

24) "Hopefully, they can say, 'There goes the best baseball player in the world.' I honestly believe I did everything in baseball that a baseball player can do, and I did it with love." — Willie Mays

Sources: https://www.gq.com + https://en.wikiquote.org + https://www.baseball-almanac.com + https://www.quotetab.com + https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov + https://www.theatlantic.com + Ritter, Lawrence. "The Glory of Their Times: The Story of the Early Days of Baseball Told by the Men Who Played It." New York: HarperCollins, 1992.

[pdmtong]

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by OtayBW

I don't care for or go to FB too often, but I did today, and I found the following. Some of these quotes are priceless. I LOVE this:

1) "That Willie Mays, he's one of the greatest center fielders who ever lived. You can go back as far as you want and name all the great ones – Tris Speaker, Eddie Roush, Max Carey, Earle Combs, Joe DiMaggio. I don't care who you name, Mays is just as good, maybe better." — Harry Hooper

2) "Willie Mays is the greatest ballplayer I've ever seen. I never saw Joe DiMaggio play, but if Joe DiMaggio was better than Willie Mays, he belongs in Heaven." — Roberto Clemente

3) "I think I was the best ballplayer I’ve ever seen. I feel nobody in the world could do what I could do on a baseball field. I hope I’m not saying anything wrong, but you have to think you’re the best. The next one would be Roberto Clemente." — Willie Mays

4) "[Mays] and Joe DiMaggio are the greatest center fielders I ever saw. But Joe couldn't run the bases as well; he wasn't as daring as Willie. I would pay money just to see him play. He brings back the old days for a fellow like myself. . . . How about that arm? It's the greatest I ever saw. Bob Meusel, of the old-time Yankees, was good, too. But you can't beat Willie." — Frankie Frisch

5) "Outside of Joe DiMaggio, Willie Mays is the greatest all-around baseball player of my time. Certainly, he's been the most daring. Mays would steal home, a tough play and one in which you've got a great chance to look bad. Willie didn't even think of that, he'd just go. Nine times out of ten, he'd make it." — Mickey Mantle

6) "Snider, Mantle, and Mays. You could get a fat lip in any saloon by starting an argument as to which was best. One point was beyond argument, though. Willie was by all odds the most exciting." — Red Smith

7) "I've seen Speaker, Cobb, Hooper – oh, all the great outfielders – but I've never seen anyone who was any better than Willie Mays. . . . [He] can throw, field, hit, run, anything. . . . Cobb was a better hitter. But Mays – I don't know, there's just something about him." — Al Bridwell

8) "Mays is the only man in baseball I'd pay to see play." — Ty Cobb

9) "Mays is one of the few modern players who [is] just as good as the best of the old-timers." — Sam Crawford

10) "There have been only two geniuses in the world: Willie Mays and Willie Shakespeare." — Tallulah Bankhead

11) "You used to think if the score was 5-0, [Mays] would hit a five-run homer." — Reggie Jackson

12) "[Mays] scooped the ball up at the base of the 406-foot sign, whirled and fired. It came in on one bounce, directly in front of the plate, and into the glove of catcher Tom Haller, who put it on the astonished Willie Stargell. It was described by old-timers as the greatest throw ever made in ancient Forbes Field." — Bob Stevens, San Francisco Chronicle, August 25, 1965

13) "I couldn't believe Mays could throw that far. I figured there had to be a relay. Then I found out there wasn't. He's too good for this world." — Willie Stargell

14) "People talk about that catch [1954 World Series] and, I've said this many times, that I've made better catches than that many times in the regular season." — Willie Mays

15) "An unusual event occurred in the seventh. [Jim] Greengrass tripled over the head of Willie Mays. To a Giant fan, this is like tripling over the Empire State building." — Bob Cooke, New York Herald Tribune, 1954

16) "I can't believe that Babe Ruth was a better player than Willie Mays. Ruth is to baseball what Arnold Palmer is to golf. He got the game moving. But I can't believe he could run as well as Mays, and I can't believe he was any better an outfielder." — Sandy Koufax

17) "They invented the All-Star Game for Willie Mays." — Ted Williams

18) "If [Mays] could cook, I'd marry him." — Leo Durocher

19) "As a batter, his only weakness is a wild pitch." — Bill Rigney

20) "I'm not sure what the hell charisma is, but I get the feeling it's Willie Mays." — Ted Kluszewski

21) "I always enjoyed playing ball, and it didn't matter to me whether I played with white kids or black. I never understood why an issue was made of who I played with, and I never felt comfortable, when I grew up, telling other people how to act. . . . It was the grownups who got upset . . . I never got into a fight that was caused by racism." — Willie Mays

22) "When I was seventeen years old, I realized I was in a form of show business. It's like being on the Broadway stage. He doesn't phrase his part exactly the same way every day. He thinks up new things. So I played for the fans, and I wanted to make sure each fan that came out would see something different I did each day." — Willie Mays

23) "In order to excel, you must be completely dedicated to your chosen sport. You must also be prepared to work hard and be willing to accept constructive criticism. Without one-hundred percent dedication, you won't be able to do this." — Willie Mays

24) "Hopefully, they can say, 'There goes the best baseball player in the world.' I honestly believe I did everything in baseball that a baseball player can do, and I did it with love." — Willie Mays

Sources: https://www.gq.com + https://en.wikiquote.org + https://www.baseball-almanac.com + https://www.quotetab.com + https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov + https://www.theatlantic.com + Ritter, Lawrence. "The Glory of Their Times: The Story of the Early Days of Baseball Told by the Men Who Played It." New York: HarperCollins, 1992.

Really cool! Thx!

[OtayBW]

Originally Posted by pdmtong

Awesome!!

[OtayBW]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

Really cool! Thx!

[BigDaddySmooth]

5'10 170# 660 zingers and he had to face some of the best pitchers ever. Next!'