Spoke nipples breaking....advice

[TBLS]

Rear wheel, stock giant wheel from TCR advanced (PRs-2). Metal rim, 2 years old

Drive side spoke nipples keep breaking .. one previously that I had new nipple added, two just on today's ride. Spoke holes do not appear to be damaged

Any advice on how I can avoid this or should I just start over and rebuild/replace wheel?

[rellis]

Are the spokes long enough? Should be flush with the slot in the nipple or close. If the spokes end below the head of the spoke breakage in inevitable.

[Gummee]

Personally, I build rear wheels with brass DS nipples regardless of what the rest of the nipples in the wheels are.

Were that my rear wheel, I'd go thru and replace* ALL the nipples to be on the safe side. Knowing that you'll have to replace AL nipples in 3-5 years (depending), I'd say brass DS and AL NDS.

...but that's me. I actually enjoy building wheels.

M

*detension everything a turn at a time till things are loose

[Peter P.]

How/where on the nipple are they failing?

Are they aluminum nipples or brass?

If they're already brass nipples, failure is unusual.

It's possible they're the wrong nipples for the spoke. Some spokes have cut vs. rolled threads. A mismatch of nipple to spoke can lead to poor thread engagement and nipples that de-tension or fail.

[TBLS]

I believe they are aluminium nipples and they are breaking off at the top, farthest point. Nipple stays on threaded portion of spoke.

[Peter P.]

Originally Posted by TBLS

I believe they are ALUMINUM nipples and they are breaking off at the top, farthest point. Nipple stays on threaded portion of spoke.

"ALUMINUM" says it all. Replace them with brass nipples and your troubles will be over.

[saab2000]

Alloy nipples in the right hands are fine. I've been using them for decades. But they need to be properly lubricated and as mentioned, they can't be too short.

I am no flyweight and I specify my wheels to be built with alloy nipples. They never break. I can count breakage on a couple fingers, tops.

I used to build my own wheels and never had issues. Ergott builds most of my wheels now because he does a better job than I did and we share similar wheel philosophies.

A bit of an aside there, but the problem isn't alloy nipples in a vacuum. It's a larger issue of build quality.

[FriarQuade]

Originally Posted by TBLS

I believe they are aluminium nipples and they are breaking off at the top, farthest point. Nipple stays on threaded portion of spoke.

Sounds like a classic case of spokes that are a hair too short. You could rebuild the wheel with the correct length and keep aluminum nipples and the problem will go away or you can hide the problem with brass nipples and it will likely be reliable as well.

[ultraman6970]

OP you have to replace all the spokes and nipples, that wheel will continue popping spokes as it is IMO.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by TBLS

I believe they are aluminium nipples and they are breaking off at the top, farthest point. Nipple stays on threaded portion of spoke.

Take all the tension off and replace all with brass nipples..Sapim Secure lock brass, 14mm, , black or silver, are a great choice..PM me if you'd like to buy some..$.25 per.

Alloy nipples 'can' work but in general, costs more, does nothing to 'help' a wheel. IMHO. I don't use them.

[zap]

edit

Originally Posted by saab2000

Alloy nipples in the right hands are fine. I've been using them for decades. But they need to be properly lubricated and as mentioned, they can't be too short.

Decades of tandem use as well. Busted spokes, rims and a WI hub but never broke an al alloy nipple.

[Tony]

Originally Posted by saab2000

Alloy nipples in the right hands are fine. I've been using them for decades. But they need to be properly lubricated and as mentioned, they can't be too short.

I am no flyweight and I specify my wheels to be built with alloy nipples. They never break. I can count breakage on a couple fingers, tops.

Agree, only time I had issues with alloy nipples is a bike that spent lots of time camping along the coast, even in that environment the wheelset lasted for many years before the nipples were toast.

[Tony T]

Originally Posted by TBLS

….two just on today's ride.

Any advice on how I can avoid this or should I just start over and rebuild/replace wheel?

Two in one ride?
Rebuild — as already suggested, I'd go with Sapim brass.
And consider using a tensiometer.

[weiwentg]

Originally Posted by saab2000

I am no flyweight and I specify my wheels to be built with alloy nipples. They never break. I can count breakage on a couple fingers, tops...

Not to be pedantic, but if you broke one or two alloy nipples (I’m assuming that’s what you meant), then that’s to zero breakage, right?

After going through a weight weenie phase, I settled on brass everywhere. I agree that well-built wheels with alloy nipples plus a good builder are fine. Thing is, isn’t it true that they seize more readily than brass? Even with a good builder, you have a slightly elevated risk of something going wrong, I think. I would rather replace the wheel when the rim wears out.

Also, if I remember the numbers, alloy saves 20g of weight off a 32 spoke wheel. So, it saves less than that for many of us here. I don’t mind paying a trade off for performance vs reliability in many contexts, but here, the payoff isn’t big enough for me. Those 40 total grams versus a higher chance of a nipple breaking or a spoke seizing aren’t worth it. Because I know I ride fairly light, I would rather make the trade off with fewer spokes, because I know I can otherwise get a lot of miles out of a 24/28 or 20/24 wheelset.

And related to ergott, he actually built me a 20/24 wheelset, and I thought I had specified brass along the way ... when he sent me the final build sheet and I looked it over, I noticed that his default was alloy. It would probably have been fine, but I am glad I looked!