"Off the shelf" 650B Road Frames (Low Trail Content)

[559Rando]

650B is getting a lot of attention in mtb, but I'm looking for a 650B road frame under $1k. And one with low trail, too.

Off the shelf, I know there were some Rawland, although the rSogn is sold out and the Stag and Drakkar II are not here yet.

If I break the budget, there's customs, Boulder, the BDB Pelican and the smaller Ocean Air Ramblers (but I need a big one--which come in 700C).

On the used market there's always Kogswell. And conversions.

Any others that I'm missing?

D

[goonster]

Rivendell Bleriot

Will this fit?

http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/bik/3178159515.html

[559Rando]

The Bleroit is long gone, but it (and other Rivs, of all wheel sizes) have higher trail.

I've seen that Raleigh posting a few times. It's too small and I'd like to avoid conversions.

[goonster]

I think I understand what you are after, but don't get too caught up on that trail number. My 650b randonneur does everything you'd want from low trail (high speed stability, low wheel flop, good steering with large front bag), but actually has higher trail.

[559Rando]

Originally Posted by goonster

My 650b randonneur does everything you'd want from low trail (high speed stability, low wheel flop, good steering with large front bag), but actually has higher trail.

Radical. What is it?
I've ridden front loads with high and low trail (both on plump tires) and the low trail helped me a lot with the wheel flop.

Here's the high trail front loader:

[DrSpoke]

I've been following this blog for a while and expect you might find some useful information there as she has long been an advocate for the 650b low trail bikes. I know she get's a lot of emails but you may try to contact her in that was as I'm sure she would have lot's of suggestions. In fact she is currently collaborating with a builder in the Boston area on just such a project.

http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/


You may want look at some bikes built (or sold) by:

VO: http://velo-orange.com/
Surley: http://surlybikes.com/
Soma: http://www.somafab.com/

I know these all have 650b bikes but not sure if they all qualify as low trail.

As stated previously Rivendell currently has 650b bikes in certain sizes, such as the Sam Hilborne, but, as above, not sure if they qualify as low trail.

[goonster]

Originally Posted by 559Rando

Radical. What is it?

A Bilenky.

Can't recall the figure off the top of my head, but I believe trail is in the low 50's.

Edit: I stand corrected. Looked up the spec sheet, and the trail of this bike is right around 40 mm. If I had micromanaged the design, I would have asked for something between 32 and 35 mm, but I told Stephen what I wanted from the bike and did not second-guess the geo. I'm very happy with the results. Based on the photo you posted, with the high-volume tires, large rack and big bag, I would certainly not try to talk you out of something less than 40 mm trail.

[559Rando]

Originally Posted by DrSpoke

I've been following this blog for a whilehttp://lovelybike.blogspot.com/

I'm not particularly impressed with "Veloria's" knowledge, but I stop by there occassionally. I'd rather be on the receiving end of a terse iBob e-mail and learn something than look at the eye candy in Veloria's non-commital puppies and rainbows photo essays.

Originally Posted by DrSpoke

You may want look at some bikes built (or sold) by:

VO: http://velo-orange.com/

I forgot about VO. They have the Polyvalent, but I read that the tubing is quite stout. That might be a good backup option, though. Good clearances, reasonably price, attractive.

[jamesutiopia]

Unless you find a last gen Kogswell P/R or someone else's custom I don't think you're going to find a low trail steed with lightweight tubing.

Probably not what you want to hear, but I think this is a good state for the market because customers who don't appreciate what they are buying will probably not end up with one (because they're fairly custom, and not in stock at the local shop at any price). It is very easy to build up a lightweight front loading frameset into a bike that has unsafe handling characteristics not found in other more common designs, because the design is intended to be close to the margins from a frame flex and handling perspective. These two aspects can negatively reinforce each other in scary ways in the (depressingly common) worst case scenario.

Regular BQ readers will have noticed that analysis and cures for front end shimmy is a very common subject. A lightweight low-trail frame that works well for one rider might be scary for someone who is a few inches taller, a dozen pounds heavier, or with a different pedaling/climbing style...

That said, I have successful front loading 700C and 650B bikes that work great for me and enjoy riding them. I'd be worried to see similar steeds on the floor at my LBS.

IMO, the TIG Boulder bike is a really good deal and you'll get advice on tubing choices from someone who has actual experience with this type of project (Mike Kone)

[goonster]

Originally Posted by jamesutiopia

IMO, the TIG Boulder bike is a really good deal

+1

It really is the best value out there.

[mossman]

the pelican or the boulder are your best options. a little more than what you want to spend but they're worth the value. excellent frames. 700c or 650b.

otherwise, take an old sports tourer to a local framebuilder for a little modification. that'll keep you under a grand.

If I were to do it again, I'd go with a tig'd Boulder with a little custom tweaking. Talk to Mike Kone.

[GRAVELBIKE]

I may be selling my M/L Rawland rSogn (low trail, 650B wheels, no puppies or rainbows). Shoot me a PM if you're interested.

[soupless]

There's a shop near me that has several RSogns sitting around.
PM me for info.

[bigmatt]

I built up a Velo Orange Polyvalent to give a low trail 650b a try. I searched to find other options, but there are not many that would fit me. If I had the money I wouldn't hesitate to order a Boulder. I might end up with a custom Boulder in the future because I doubt a stock will work at my size: 6'6" 240lbs.

Here is the basics of the build:
60 cm Polyvalent
SRAM Rival group with 48/34 crank in 180mm
Cr720 brakes
Nitto technomic and noodle
Berthoud 50mm fenders
Dt Swiss 190 rear/Shimano 71 generator hub laced to Velocity A23 rims
Grand Bois Hetres
Nitto m12 rack with Cyo light
Seculite rear not installed yet and a Berthoud GB28 front bag not shown

[Wilkinson4]

Another VO, not sure your size

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/bik/3215713707.html

mIKE