OT: Given the Wagon (Wagen?) love on this forum . . . (specific car-buying question)

[C40_guy]

You could also take a look at the Volvo Cross Country wagon. It will carry as much as a minivan and still not be a minivan.

[p nut]

Originally Posted by C40_guy

You could also take a look at the Volvo Cross Country wagon. It will carry as much as a minivan and still not be a minivan.

I’d have to challenge that.

[exapkib]

A small update:

We need to make a purchase this week. Our Subaru is accelerating the process by unraveling more rapidly than we had hoped. I had hoped to take my time with this decision, but c'est la vie . . .

At this point, these are the front-runners:

--2012 Toyota Sienna LE, 94k miles, $13,000
--2016 Toyota Sienna LE, 62k miles, $19,000
--2012 Toyota Sienna Limited, 63k miles, $17,000 (Rebuilt title)
--2015 Golf Sportwagen TDI, 94k miles, $14,000

We had decided to go with a minivan, but driving the top three options (those listed above) my wife was disappointed with the idea of paying so much money for a car that felt so 'used.' All of them feel just a little bit tired--minivans live hard lives.

Digging around on the TDI forums around the web, I'm both excited and anxious about this Golf. Where the maintenance is such a big part of what makes the difference between a VW that lives beyond 200k miles and one that lives in the service bay of the dealership, I'm nervous to buy one with so many miles.

Because we're paying cash, we have a pretty solid ceiling ($18k). Trying to be honest with myself about what else I might sell (already sold the Parlee) to close that gap if the 2016 Sienna is worth it.

Any final thoughts or tips? Thanks again for the advice up to this point. Most helpful.

[AngryScientist]

unless you have a pretty damned good (documented) history, i'd avoid the one with the rebuilt title, especially for that much money.

do you have the maintenance records for the one with 94k on it? that's still young for a toyota motor, but remember minivans are heavy vehicles, and if they have not been changed out yet, at that mileage it's getting near the time to do suspension work. with a fresh detail, maybe some nice custom seatcovers for the front two seats, and a suspension refresh, that van will feel like new again, but not necessarily a cheap endeavor.

[exapkib]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

unless you have a pretty damned good (documented) history, i'd avoid the one with the rebuilt title, especially for that much money.

do you have the maintenance records for the one with 94k on it? that's still young for a toyota motor, but remember minivans are heavy vehicles, and if they have not been changed out yet, at that mileage it's getting near the time to do suspension work. with a fresh detail, maybe some nice custom seatcovers for the front two seats, and a suspension refresh, that van will feel like new again, but not necessarily a cheap endeavor.

I've excluded branded titles from our search, but this one is owned by good friends of ours. We know about the accident (and the work) that resulted in the rebuilt status, so for me it mostly boils down to the question, "Will I ever want to sell this car?" In my mind, I think the answer to that question is "No." We drive cars, we don't sell them.

[rnhood]

I have a '98 Sienna LE with 274K miles on it, and it still runs great. Love the van. Someday I will get a new one, but this one seems to just be broken in now. Having said this, it has had one or two problems over the years (I am original owner) that were expensive to repair but overall, for cycling and traveling I don't know of a better vehicle.

My advice would be to buy as new as you can afford. I would try to get one from a dealer that is off lease now, and probably has less than 20k miles. Otherwise, I think that I might see what kind of deal I can get on a Kia Sedonna, as they have a decent warranty and cost considerably less than a Sienna or Odyssey.

I'd stay away from Volkswagens.

[Ken Robb]

Check to ensure that you can get insurance that you like on a car with a salvage/rebuilt title.

[dbh]

If you're considering a minivan in addition to a sport wagen, why not broaden the search to a compact SUV? We just went through the search process a few months ago for a family wagon replacement (2 kids). We ended up with a Mazda CX5 and are pretty happy with it so far. There are so many options in this category, especially in your pricepoint used.

[likebikes]

i'd still fix your old subaru.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by exapkib

Because we're paying cash, we have a pretty solid ceiling ($18k). Trying to be honest with myself about what else I might sell (already sold the Parlee) to close that gap if the 2016 Sienna is worth it.

Any final thoughts or tips? Thanks again for the advice up to this point. Most helpful.

If you are holding $18k cash, I would just go buy a brand new golf sportwagen. A local dealer here (DC area) is offering them at $21.5k out the door. The delta between a 100k VW and that is not worth the cost savings - and the new ones get a 6/72k warranty. Its a small amount to finance but you'll save that in maintenance over the used one in short order. At 100k, any car is going to start showing wear items.

They're available with AWD & 6-speed manuals if you like, otherwise the DSG is very good.

My $.02.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by exapkib

A small update:

We need to make a purchase this week. Our Subaru is accelerating the process by unraveling more rapidly than we had hoped. I had hoped to take my time with this decision, but c'est la vie . . .

At this point, these are the front-runners:

--2012 Toyota Sienna LE, 94k miles, $13,000
--2016 Toyota Sienna LE, 62k miles, $19,000
--2012 Toyota Sienna Limited, 63k miles, $17,000 (Rebuilt title)
--2015 Golf Sportwagen TDI, 94k miles, $14,000

We had decided to go with a minivan, but driving the top three options (those listed above) my wife was disappointed with the idea of paying so much money for a car that felt so 'used.' All of them feel just a little bit tired--minivans live hard lives.

Digging around on the TDI forums around the web, I'm both excited and anxious about this Golf. Where the maintenance is such a big part of what makes the difference between a VW that lives beyond 200k miles and one that lives in the service bay of the dealership, I'm nervous to buy one with so many miles.

Because we're paying cash, we have a pretty solid ceiling ($18k). Trying to be honest with myself about what else I might sell (already sold the Parlee) to close that gap if the 2016 Sienna is worth it.

Any final thoughts or tips? Thanks again for the advice up to this point. Most helpful.

Has the 2015 TDI been modified? Is that a requirement for resale, from a private party(assuming it is from any car dealer)?

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by .RJ

If you are holding $18k cash, I would just go buy a brand new golf sportwagen. A local dealer here (DC area) is offering them at $21.5k out the door. The delta between a 100k VW and that is not worth the cost savings - and the new ones get a 6/72k warranty. Its a small amount to finance but you'll save that in maintenance over the used one in short order. At 100k, any car is going to start showing wear items.

They're available with AWD & 6-speed manuals if you like, otherwise the DSG is very good.

My $.02.

My 2017 GSW, 4Motion, 'S' model was $23.5...DSG, VERY happy with it.

[R3awak3n]

I was the guy that said I would never buy a new car, waste of money yada yada. Bought my 17 sportwagen brand new and its nice to have a new car. Know exactly whats happening to it, can keep it clean if I want to, ect.

I know everyone here is enamored with tdis but gas wagon gets good gas mileage. Easily 35mpg highway if you drive speed limit.

[p nut]

Out of those, I would go with the 2016. I believe it was in 2015 that Toyota beefed up the sound deadening and (IIRC) the glass was more sound absorbent. Check me on that. The infotainment and electronics got updates as well. Also, I love the 7-seater better than 8. No fuss getting to the back row with the two captain chairs. Unless you need passenger capacity, I would go 7.

Here are a few I found:

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4622663?ad_cid=7

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4883486?ad_cid=8

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4893625?ad_cid=16

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4919379?ad_cid=2

(My bro bought a Sienna from this dealership about 4 years ago. Good experience).
https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4018381?ad_cid=6

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4904027?ad_cid=9

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4852558?ad_cid=13

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4875217?ad_cid=16

https://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/4863731?ad_cid=17

Couple 2014's mixed in, but mostly 15-16's.

[exapkib]

Grateful for the insight shared here.

Yesterday we drove all of the cars mentioned in my latest post. Interesting result. My wife came away feeling like the minivan was just too big--she was nervous driving it. That will go away quickly with more time in the driver's seat, but still . . . She loved LOVED the newer Outback, and I'll be surprised if that's not the direction we end up going. I had a long talk with the dealer about the maintenance of the VW, and they just don't have enough information about what's been taken care of and what hasn't. We both loved driving the car, but it feels risky.

Originally Posted by dbh

If you're considering a minivan in addition to a sport wagen, why not broaden the search to a compact SUV? We just went through the search process a few months ago for a family wagon replacement (2 kids). We ended up with a Mazda CX5 and are pretty happy with it so far. There are so many options in this category, especially in your pricepoint used.

Partly for fuel efficiency (which is one reason the minivan is a hard sell), but we have considered the Honda CRV (definite possibility if one pops up in our area), Toyota Highlander (tough to find in our price range), Mazda CX5 (glad to hear you like yours--again, just hasn't popped up used in our area), etc.

Nowadays, they call the Outback an SUV. It's gotten so big that's not far off.

Originally Posted by likebikes

i'd still fix your old subaru.

Me too. My neighbor works on cars and is going to walk me through the fix. We'll hold on to it for a while. It's just passed the point in its life in which it can serve as our only car.

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Has the 2015 TDI been modified? Is that a requirement for resale, from a private party(assuming it is from any car dealer)?

It has been modified.

Originally Posted by .RJ

If you are holding $18k cash, I would just go buy a brand new golf sportwagen. A local dealer here (DC area) is offering them at $21.5k out the door. The delta between a 100k VW and that is not worth the cost savings - and the new ones get a 6/72k warranty. Its a small amount to finance but you'll save that in maintenance over the used one in short order. At 100k, any car is going to start showing wear items.

They're available with AWD & 6-speed manuals if you like, otherwise the DSG is very good.

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

I was the guy that said I would never buy a new car, waste of money yada yada. Bought my 17 sportwagen brand new and its nice to have a new car. Know exactly whats happening to it, can keep it clean if I want to, ect.

I know everyone here is enamored with tdis but gas wagon gets good gas mileage. Easily 35mpg highway if you drive speed limit.

We have looked hard at the math on new/used. I'm no Dave Ramsey, but I'm also simple enough (numbers-wise) that I think I want to stick with no car payment.