OT-ish: Seattle vs SF

[krooj]

The S/O and I have been in SF for about a year and we're finding that the drawbacks outweigh the benefits and have started thinking about Seattle. Some things that have been killing us about SF are:

* Laughable levels of sketch
* Insane CoL for what you get
* Tourist hellscape
* My allergies
* S/O is a runner and hills are killing her ankles
* Outer Richmond somehow has ZERO decent grocery stores ?!?

We're gonna take a look at Seattle in a month or so and I was curious how the road riding up there compares with SF and the Bay Area.

[mjb266]

Ummm…Seattle has pretty much modeled itself after SF. PM if you want details about smaller areas north of SEA.

[prototoast]

Honestly, in my experience, Seattle is pretty bad along all those dimensions too.

Obviously some things are neighborhood specific, but I wouldn't, as a general matter, say Seattle actually has an advantage among any of those characteristics you listed. Plus the weather is worse most of the year

Are you looking specifically to live in a big city? On the west coast?

[AngryScientist]

Do you need to be IN the city? Seems you can solve all of those issues if you migrate out a bit?

[xnetter]

Originally Posted by krooj

The S/O and I have been in SF for about a year and we're finding that the drawbacks outweigh the benefits and have started thinking about Seattle. Some things that have been killing us about SF are:

* Laughable levels of sketch
* Insane CoL for what you get
* Tourist hellscape
* My allergies
* S/O is a runner and hills are killing her ankles
* Outer Richmond somehow has ZERO decent grocery stores ?!?

We're gonna take a look at Seattle in a month or so and I was curious how the road riding up there compares with SF and the Bay Area.

You've pretty much summed up West Coast urban living :-P
Perhaps consider a smaller city?

KJ

[pasadena]

Bellingham, Wa is really nice.
But the PNW has a pretty bleak rainy season/winter compared to norcal

When I go to the bay area, I don't even go into SF. It's really nice just over the bridge and tons of fantastic riding. I would love to move into the Bay Area one day.

[Faucet]

Re: Road riding. I moved to Seattle last year from San Diego. I knew it was gonna rain…but I wasn’t prepared for just how rainy the winter was. I ended up riding a lot of mountain bikes in the winter and didn’t touch my road bike until spring.

Regarding what you dislike about SF, Seattle is much better (and as somebody said neighborhood dependent). However, the good thing about Seattle is that housing is anecdotally cheaper than SF. Yeah there are some sketchy places downtown, but on the whole the city is fine. My friends have some bad allergies in the spring; worse than they did in SD. Lastly, lots of good flat places to run.

Seattle’s great. The winter is rough for riding, but you find other things to do

[jtakeda]

Can I ask what you were expecting from SF?

That might help steer you in a better direction

Also can you elaborate on “laughable levels of sketch?” Are you referring to smash and grabs or something more sinister?

[truth]

Originally Posted by krooj

The S/O and I have been in SF for about a year and we're finding that the drawbacks outweigh the benefits and have started thinking about Seattle. Some things that have been killing us about SF are:

* Laughable levels of sketch
* Insane CoL for what you get
* Tourist hellscape
* My allergies
* S/O is a runner and hills are killing her ankles
* Outer Richmond somehow has ZERO decent grocery stores ?!?

We're gonna take a look at Seattle in a month or so and I was curious how the road riding up there compares with SF and the Bay Area.

Seattle doesn't have much sketch.

Cost of living is insane for what you get.

Not as much of a tourist hellscape.

My allergies were better in Seattle.

There are flat-ish areas to run.

There are good grocery stores all over.


Have you considered the East Bay at all?

[mhespenheide]

I moved back to Seattle only about a year ago, so I wouldn't say I'm all that qualified to pass judgement.

To your points,

• There are sketchy places here, too, but not to the extent and level as San Francisco. I sometimes need to ride through / bike commute through one of the larger homeless encampments and I don't feel threatened or unsafe when I do.
• CoL is high. Slightly lower than SF, but still high. Counterintuitively, though, other cities in WA have shot up in costs after COVID. So if you're going to come up here, you might as well go for Seattle and its higher wages.
• Seattle proper is very hilly. As much as SF, depending neighborhood-to-neighborhood. But there are some places that are flatter, too. There are some nice parks for running, but nothing like Forest Park in Portland. Over here in West Seattle / Burien, I can put together a run almost 2 hours long that's 90% on trails that's an out-and-back with some variations (by which I mean that I'm not just running the same small loop over and over).
• I've been blessed to live in some great areas for riding. As a city, Seattle can be good. But it's not amazing. Santa Cruz and the southwest peninsula are far better. Sonoma county is far better. Up here, Bainbridge is good. Vashon is good. But the rain and darkness and general population density are real issues.

[joosttx]

Portland is better than Seattle.

[dave thompson]

I moved FROM Seattle to Spokane 20-ish years ago. While i do miss the bright lights and big city life, I don't miss a cost of living that's near 2X of Spokane. I don't miss the many dull, dull and dreary days. When I lived there I used to tell folks I wasn't tan, it was rust. Seattle is a constant traffic jam. Sometimes I fly to Seattle and have to rent a car. It's like hand-to-hand combat.

I was born in the PNW. I love it but Seattle has turned into a place that I no longer desire to live.

[mhespenheide]

Originally Posted by dave thompson

I moved FROM Seattle to Spokane 20-ish years ago. While i do miss the bright lights and big city life, I don't miss a cost of living that's near 2X of Spokane. I don't miss the many dull, dull and dreary days. When I lived there I used to tell folks I wasn't tan, it was rust. Seattle is a constant traffic jam. Sometimes I fly to Seattle and have to rent a car. It's like hand-to-hand combat.

I was born in the PNW. I love it but Seattle has turned into a place that I no longer desire to live.

Dave, I don't discount your other points, but Spokane real estate has gone up so much post-pandemic... compared to wages, it's not that different anymore. (Given what we're looking at for my inlaws in Spokane Valley.)

[72gmc]

Originally Posted by truth

Seattle doesn't have much sketch.

Cost of living is insane for what you get.

Not as much of a tourist hellscape.

My allergies were better in Seattle.

There are flat-ish areas to run.

There are good grocery stores all over.


Have you considered the East Bay at all?

I’ve lived here since 1989. I agree with the notes above, and I count SF and Portland, OR among my favorite cities. My allergies find something not to like pretty much anywhere on the west coast, it seems.

[dave thompson]

Originally Posted by mhespenheide

Dave, I don't discount your other points, but Spokane real estate has gone up so much post-pandemic... compared to wages, it's not that different anymore. (Given what we're looking at for my inlaws in Spokane Valley.)

Just wait a little. There's a huge glut of apartments and houses being built now and I'm figuring that the excess is going to bring things down. Spokane is still such a blue/collar town that it can't/won't support the large increases in price. There's absolutely no good reason for current prices here except greed.

Still far cheaper to live here than Seattle.