Ritchey 50th Anniversary Road Logic

[buddybikes]

Where are these made, Taiwan?

[tbike4]

Originally Posted by cabbagelookin

I’ve had bikes with steel forks that have been dogs (looking at you, All City Mr Pink) and some where the fork has been amazing (the Hampsten I just sold had an amazing Tweedy fork).

I can verify this since he sold it to me. Would not consider a carbon fork.
I have a 2018 Logic, wish it was blue and it used to be my go to steel bike, until I got the Hampsten.

[spoonrobot]

Originally Posted by Eli Bingham

Edit: Tom has discussed at length why they don't spec steel forks on these bikes.

What'd he say?

[EB]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

What'd he say?

TL;DR version is that he feels that the weight and stiffness that results when a modern production steel fork has to pass modern ISO crash test standards is unacceptable for a road bike. Hence, carbon forks.

Custom builders don't have these restrictions, but this is a production road bike TIG welded in Taiwan, with a limited edition paint job.

[Kirk007]

Originally Posted by Likes2ridefar

I’ve yet to ride a steel fork that outperforms a carbon fork in anything but aesthetics…especially on a steel frame like that Ritchey. Pass

Wow, my experience is 100% the opposite. Probably depends on what we value and who is making it - for me it has been Dave Kirk, Tom Kellogg and Richard Sachs. I've yet to ride a carbon fork that offers the ride quality of a well built steel fork. Now if you want the most rigid, stiff fork you can find then yeah, carbon. The best riding carbon fork I've had was a Wound Up and of course it has polarizing aesthetics. I like the look of the Ritchey fork and it rides decently, at least the one on my Swiss Cross Disc does.

[EB]

Originally Posted by Kirk007

Wow, my experience is 100% the opposite. Probably depends on what we value and who is making it - for me it has been Dave Kirk, Tom Kellogg and Richard Sachs. I've yet to ride a carbon fork that offers the ride quality of a well built steel fork. Now if you want the most rigid, stiff fork you can find then yeah, carbon. The best riding carbon fork I've had was a Wound Up and of course it has polarizing aesthetics. I like the look of the Ritchey fork and it rides decently, at least the one on my Swiss Cross Disc does.

This bike is not a Kirk, a Kellogg, or a Sachs. It's a production road race bike TIG welded out of standardized tubing in Taiwan to spec in stock sizes that has to pass an ISO crash test. It's a completely different beast. This bike would suck with a steel fork on it given the constraints.

Edit: I'd love to have a Sachs too, but I'm not going to pretend I can get a brand new one shipped to me in 2 weeks for $1500.

[Kirk007]

Originally Posted by Eli Bingham

This bike is not a Kirk, a Kellogg, or a Sachs. It's a production road race bike TIG welded out of standardized tubing in Taiwan to spec in stock sizes that has to pass an ISO crash test. It's a completely different beast. This bike would suck with a steel fork on it given the constraints.

Edit: I'd love to have a Sachs too, but I'm not going to pretend I can get a brand new one shipped to me in 2 weeks for $1500.

Oh I agree re this bike; was drifting in response to the blanket statement that no steel fork measured up to a carbon fork. The Ritchey looks nice and I think his steel frames ride very nicely for a $1500 frame.

[Likes2ridefar]

Originally Posted by Kirk007

Wow, my experience is 100% the opposite. Probably depends on what we value and who is making it - for me it has been Dave Kirk, Tom Kellogg and Richard Sachs.

I’m sure they ride great. I wouldn’t know because they are exceedingly rare and hardly anyone on the planet rides these forks.

[Likes2ridefar]

Will also add I still don’t buy it. How is it better? I don’t doubt you but struggle to understand after so many frames and materials I ultimately find the tire and pressure impacts it more and can adjust to equate whatever ride quality I’m after.

A steel fork is heavier and not as stiff. Both very important qualities I’ve found from my riding experience.

The fanciest steel forks I’ve used on a road bike are made for me If crown jewel, a second hand IF, a vicious cycles made for me, a serotta csi, and probably missing a few others.

None of those compare to a modern quality carbon fork IMO.

[mhespenheide]

Originally Posted by Likes2ridefar

Will also add I still don’t buy it. How is it better? I don’t doubt you but struggle to understand after so many frames and materials I ultimately find the tire and pressure impacts it more and can adjust to equate whatever ride quality I’m after.

A steel fork is heavier and not as stiff. Both very important qualities I’ve found from my riding experience.

The fanciest steel forks I’ve used on a road bike are made for me If crown jewel, a second hand IF, a vicious cycles made for me, a serotta csi, and probably missing a few others.

None of those compare to a modern quality carbon fork IMO.

I don't have the amount of experience that you or @Kirk007 have with the highest-end bikes, or the number of different bikes. But I can say that I have two modern carbon frames and forks that fit 32mm tires (Felt F1PR and Cannondale Synapse) and two frames with steel forks that fit 32mm tires (vintage Bianchi and a Lemond with a custom steel fork). The steel forks ride differently. They are not as stiff, but do a better job of handling some aspects of bumps and rough pavement. And for those bikes, I don't think the weight penalty is objectionable.

That's my opinion. If you value stiffness and low weight in a fork, it sounds like carbon is the right choice for you. Totally valid. I'm not about to go put a steel fork on my Felt or Synapse and they're each a great bike in their own right...

In this thread, though, Tom Ritchey is on record during interviews saying that he thinks that steel forks ride better but that production forks need to meet standards that cause steel forks to be overly heavy, overbuilt, and lose the positive qualities that I addressed above. Devotees of his bikes who also like good steel forks would love to have the option to buy one with a steel fork that follows Tom's designs... but we can't get one.

[Kirk007]

[QUOTE=Likes2ridefar;3091253]Will also add I still don’t buy it. How is it better? I don’t doubt you but struggle to understand after so many frames and materials I ultimately find the tire and pressure impacts it more and can adjust to equate whatever ride quality I’m after. [Quote]

I find some carbon forks, like Enve, so stiff as to lack all subtlety and finesse. They are the weakest part in my opinion of two bikes I own. Like riding a lead pipe at the front end only lighter (well maybe not that bad...).

To me carbon forks have two positives: they are lighter, typically, and as others have pointed out have mass production benefits.
I could say the same about many carbon frames particularly when they are built to compensate for the addition of disc brakes (another feature which I've come to the conclusion is an unnecessary and undesirable feature on road bikes - dang I'm sounding like a stuck in the past retrogrouch but it's an opinion formed after more than a few of each variety).

The Reynolds Ouzo pro was a nice fork as is the Wound Up and Ritchey. Seven Matador is pretty nice for gravel fork. I'm sure the Falz is a nice fork and sometimes you don't have much choice as other build decisions dictate choices, so I'm not anti-carbon - still have two bikes of that flavor with no intention of selling - I just think a good steel fork just provides me a more enjoyable ride experience and the additional weight matters only when lifting the bike up off the ground for some reason, in other words it really does not matter to me at all.

With a good steel fork and a good supple tire I see little reason to run larger than a 25-28mm tire on a road bike. I suspect that much of the attraction to the average rider on 30+mm tires on a road bike has much to do with counteracting the stiffer is better manta that's pervasive in the industry. Fat road tires like the Rene Herse 32s are nice enough but I still prefer something like a 25mm Veloflex tubular for paved roads. Sure you can adjust pressure to a point but it typically comes at a cost of tire size and weight.

To each their own - we have a lot of good choices these days that allow a lot of flexibility to get a great riding bike. And yeah some of those have carbon forks, I've got a couple.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dvnzzz]

Originally Posted by mhespenheide

In this thread, though, Tom Ritchey is on record during interviews saying that he thinks that steel forks ride better but that production forks need to meet standards that cause steel forks to be overly heavy, overbuilt, and lose the positive qualities that I addressed above. Devotees of his bikes who also like good steel forks would love to have the option to buy one with a steel fork that follows Tom's designs... but we can't get one.

Where does he say that steel forks have to be overbuilt? I thought TR said carbon forks are overly built to compensate for their fragility, resulting in overly stiff carbon forks?

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by dvnzzz

Where does he say that steel forks have to be overbuilt? I thought TR said carbon forks are overly built to compensate for their fragility, resulting in overly stiff carbon forks?

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=281547

[Peter P.]

Originally Posted by dvnzzz

A half-hearted attempt at a 50th anniversary? Nice classic paint scheme, love the decals, but why not go one step further and just build a steel fork? The Road Logics (IMO), have always looked off due to the carbon fork.

I know they did offer the heritage paint schemes with the Commando, sunset fade, and classic red, white and blue some time back on the Road Logic, but thought its a missed opportunity since it's the 50th anniversary.

Really adore the 40th anniversary brazed Classic, so I was sort of excited when I saw a sneak peek on Instagram. Kinda missing my old Road Logic with the 1-inch threadless fork now...

https://us.ritcheylogic.com/us_en/ro...rsary-frameset

I have to agree with a lot of what you said; it is kind of a half-hearted attempt indeed. The price is incredibly affordable, however.

I too, would love a steel fork on that bike but the young 'uns haven't grown up with steel forks, so they just won't sell. It's all marketing.

I'd consider having a custom fork made but no one makes a fork crown which would provide a similar, seamless transition from the crown to the integrated headset cup. And I like the original logo. I agree with your comments about the color choices.

Originally Posted by Michael D

Yeah a good riding one might fail the stress tests a cf fork will breeze through so they're rare on modern production bici

Kind of ironic since steel fork failures were never a chronic issue that needed to be addressed. I've ridden Tange #2 forks, Columbus, and Reynolds. Never complained about a lack of stiffness.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by mhespenheide

In this thread, though, Tom Ritchey is on record during interviews saying that he thinks that steel forks ride better but that production forks need to meet standards that cause steel forks to be overly heavy, overbuilt, and lose the positive qualities that I addressed above. Devotees of his bikes who also like good steel forks would love to have the option to buy one with a steel fork that follows Tom's designs... but we can't get one.

Tom Ritchey is also on record selling those seatposts with the 1 bolt clamps for the saddle rails that are the most annoying things in the world.

He's an interesting character, and I like some of his products, but we don't have to adhere to his word as if it were gospel.