Here we go...bicyclerollingresistance.com finally tests the Compass Bon Jon Pass

andrewsuzuki · #1 03-31-2018, 08:59 AM

https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...-jon-pass-2018

ultraman6970 · #2 03-31-2018, 09:03 AM

This means that soon everybody will be riding those in TT's at the pro circuit?

ripvanrando · #3 03-31-2018, 09:27 AM

Wow. Only 1.5 watts slower than Schwalbe......Marathons.

thwart · #4 03-31-2018, 09:29 AM

For those interested in the CliffsNotes version... fast rolling but terrible (their words) puncture protection.

FWIW, I ride a set of Barlow Pass tires and the tendency to flat has certainly not been my experience.

andrewsuzuki · #5 03-31-2018, 09:45 AM

"As my experience has been that the casing thickness doesn't make a huge difference in the rolling resistance tests" <- shots fired

I hope they test the Pasela next, as well as Compass' current closest non-Panaracer competitor, which is probably the Schwalbe G-One Speed Microskin?

andrewsuzuki · #6 03-31-2018, 09:49 AM

Also, I wonder why this is far off from TOUR's tests, which shows the Bon Jon as faster than the venerable GP 4000S II (on a smooth surface no less)?

https://janheine.wordpress.com/2018/...-in-the-world/

ripvanrando · #7 03-31-2018, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewsuzuki

Also, I wonder why this is far off from TOUR's tests, which shows the Bon Jon as faster than the venerable GP 4000S II (on a smooth surface no less)?

https://janheine.wordpress.com/2018/...-in-the-world/

You need the planing frame. Synergy.

ripvanrando · #8 03-31-2018, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewsuzuki

Also, I wonder why this is far off from TOUR's tests, which shows the Bon Jon as faster than the venerable GP 4000S II (on a smooth surface no less)?

https://janheine.wordpress.com/2018/...-in-the-world/

The Contis were faster on gravel but slower on smooth pavement than the Compass tire. Very odd.

Odd especially since the Bon Jon was about 10 watts slower than the Vittoria and the Continentals usually are just 2-3 watts slower than the Vittoria tires on pavement.

zross312 · #9 03-31-2018, 09:53 AM

I've never run Compass tires, but my understanding is that their suppleness, combined with low pressure, lets them deform more around a potentially puncturing object, thus preventing said object from penetrating. I think Jan's philosophy is also that preventing punctures has as much to do with technique as it does the tyre.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thwart

For those interested in the CliffsNotes version... fast rolling but terrible (their words) puncture protection.

FWIW, I ride a set of Barlow Pass tires and the tendency to flat has certainly not been my experience.

R3awak3n · #10 03-31-2018, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zross312

I've never run Compass tires, but my understanding is that their suppleness, combined with low pressure, lets them deform more around a potentially puncturing object, thus preventing said object from penetrating. I think Jan's philosophy is also that preventing punctures has as much to do with technique as it does the tyre.

that sounds exactly something Jan would say. sell a few more tires (I do love you Jan

)

compass tires are awesome, I don't care what any article says. Puncture resistance is not #1 for them and neither is for me. If you do ride in a place full of glass or other crap, maybe not the best choice but I rode mine in NYC, commuted on them and not many flats. They key is to set them up tubeless, but even before that I never had many flats.

I have had more flats on veloflex for example.

echelon_john · #11 03-31-2018, 11:00 AM

The article reads as though someone made a peepee in the author's breakfast cereal.

"So expensive"
"For such an expensive tire"
etc.

zross312 · #12 03-31-2018, 11:32 AM

Nice! I'm in LA, which has truly horrendus road quality, so it's good to hear that they can survive in an urban environment. What kind of lifespan did you get out of yours?

Quote:

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

that sounds exactly something Jan would say. sell a few more tires (I do love you Jan

)

compass tires are awesome, I don't care what any article says. Puncture resistance is not #1 for them and neither is for me. If you do ride in a place full of glass or other crap, maybe not the best choice but I rode mine in NYC, commuted on them and not many flats. They key is to set them up tubeless, but even before that I never had many flats.

I have had more flats on veloflex for example.

adub · #13 03-31-2018, 04:59 PM

No surprise here. A thin, supple tire has low rolling resistance and terrible puncture resistance.

These tires have a cult-like following for what reason I have no idea, especially for gravel??

andrewsuzuki · #14 03-31-2018, 06:23 PM

Y'all are saying low rolling resistance ... it's quite a bit higher than I thought it'd be. At similar tire drop, the GP 4000s II 25mm is ~13w at typical 80psi, while the Bon Jon is ~21w at typical 45psi. That's a huge 16 watt total difference.

First, why? Tread thickness is identical. As for sidewall thickness, the GP is .55mm; the Bon Jon is .6mm. Pretty close. There are faster tires than the GP like the Pro One tubeless that have an even thicker sidewall @ .9mm. What's holding Compass back? Rubber compound?

The main question of course is whether the difference in suspension losses on average pavement is enough to negate the hysteretic loss. There's no question the Bon Jons would be faster on gravel due to ability to run a lower pressure, but at what road quality do road racing tires overtake?

Mark McM · #15 03-31-2018, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewsuzuki

First, why? Tread thickness is identical. As for sidewall thickness, the GP is .55mm; the Bon Jon is .6mm. Pretty close. There are faster tires than the GP like the Pro One tubeless that have an even thicker sidewall @ .9mm. What's holding Compass back? Rubber compound?

Yes, it may very well be the tread compound. The predecessor to the GP4000s was the GP4000, which was dimensionally the same, but used a silica based tread compound. The GP4000 was a bit of a dog when it came to rolling resistance. When Continental replaced the tread compound with a new compound based on nano-sized carbon particles (which they called Black Chili), it had a dramatic reduction in rolling resistance, even lower than other tires with thinner treads made of traditional rubber.

The current lowest rolling resistance tires now all use nano particle carbon compounds, and include tires from Continental (Black Chili compound), Vittoria (Graphene+ compound) and Specialized (Gripton compound -developed by the same engineers that developed Continental's Black Chili).