Fueling a relevant argument

[Bentley]

This is a piece I got via email from Above Category... more logs on the fire.

https://abovecategorycycling.com/blo...Q1BHTEVVIn0%3D

Best

[Bentley]

Mods... in the wrong place... just noticed, sorry

[AngryScientist]

moved.

[StephenCL]

Yeah,

I’ll weigh in on this literally. I have been on the fence with this topic now for over a year. I ordered an brand new Firefly last year, and I went with Disc brakes for it.

Yes, they stop well, and they allowed me to cut some insane turns on the Cols in the French Alps, I went deeper into turns at speed then I ever have before. Folks that know me know how much I love descending and for that, discs are amazing. However, that’s where the goodness ends. Literally, there is not another single positive factor regarding disc brakes. Here are the negatives:

1) weight — I am running Bora One Tubulars with discs, so I have it about as light as I can. I figure between rotors, calipers etc, discs add a good 1-1.5 lbs to a bike fitted with equal level rim brakes and more compared to an EE set up. It’s real weight with a chunk of it being rotational weight.

2) spin up — I can tell you without question that disc wheels WILL NOT spin up as fast as a good set of light tubular climbing wheels, or even a set of great alloy hoops like the Shamal. With more mass in the wheels, the moment of inertia is much higher. It’s real, and anyone can feel it. If they deny it, they are lying.

3) asthetics — hydraulic fluid requires a place to camp out. For most unfortunately, that is a bulbous edifice at the top of the brake hoods. While, I kind of dig the Cinelli Spinaci bar type extensions it creates on my hoods, it looks terrible.

4) end user serviceability — for this I will come back to my epic trip to France last summer. Many people in our group had rented top of the line Pinarello Dogma F10’s with Discs. Unfortunately, 4 of them had warped discs that made the entire week pretty miserable. For the average bike rider, discs are a real problem. They can’t really be serviced by the casual user. They require a bike shop. Maybe that is why the industry is pushing them so hard? I don’t know, but after almost 40 years tuning and building bikes, I can tell you there is NOTHING user friendly about owning and maintaining the current iteration of disc brakes. From the bleeding of the system to caring for the the pads during transport, to warped rotors, for the average consumer, disc brakes are a nightmare. Heaven forbid the owner actually touches the disc...

So, I will keep the firefly because it is gorgeous and it loves to go downhill. However, I won’t be investing in any more disc bikes until they can fix some inherent issues.

Just my .02.

Stephen

[thwart]

Originally Posted by StephenCL

Yeah,

I’ll weigh in on this literally. I have been on the fence with this topic now for over a year. I ordered an brand new Firefly last year, and I went with Disc brakes for it.

Yes, they stop well, and they allowed me to cut some insane turns on the Cols in the French Alps, I went deeper into turns at speed then I ever have before. Folks that know me know how much I love descending and for that, discs are amazing. However, that’s where the goodness ends. Literally, there is not another single positive factor regarding disc brakes. Here are the negatives:

1) weight — I am running Bora One Tubulars with discs, so I have it about as light as I can. I figure between rotors, calipers etc, discs add a good 1-1.5 lbs to a bike fitted with equal level rim brakes and more compared to an EE set up. It’s real weight with a chunk of it being rotational weight.

2) spin up — I can tell you without question that disc wheels WILL NOT spin up as fast as a good set of light tubular climbing wheels, or even a set of great alloy hoops like the Shamal. With more mass in the wheels, the moment of inertia is much higher. It’s real, and anyone can feel it. If they deny it, they are lying.

3) asthetics — hydraulic fluid requires a place to camp out. For most unfortunately, that is a bulbous edifice at the top of the brake hoods. While, I kind of dig the Cinelli Spinaci bar type extensions it creates on my hoods, it looks terrible.

4) end user serviceability — for this I will come back to my epic trip to France last summer. Many people in our group had rented top of the line Pinarello Dogma F10’s with Discs. Unfortunately, 4 of them had warped discs that made the entire week pretty miserable. For the average bike rider, discs are a real problem. They can’t really be serviced by the casual user. They require a bike shop. Maybe that is why the industry is pushing them so hard? I don’t know, but after almost 40 years tuning and building bikes, I can tell you there is NOTHING user friendly about owning and maintaining the current iteration of disc brakes. From the bleeding of the system to caring for the the pads during transport, to warped rotors, for the average consumer, disc brakes are a nightmare. Heaven forbid the owner actually touches the disc...

So, I will keep the firefly because it is gorgeous and it loves to go downhill. However, I won’t be investing in any more disc bikes until they can fix some inherent issues.

Just my .02.

Stephen

Filed away under 'reasons not to buy a road bike with discs, at least for now'...

[Clean39T]

...

[weisan]

Originally Posted by Clean39T

Merge with 'reasons not to ride road tubeless', 'carbon bikes are fragile', 'powermeters are for the mentally-weak', 'ceramic bearings are hype', and '25mm tires are enough' ----- and you'll have a solid argument for not needing anything new in the cycling world for a good long time

no, no, no, Clean pal....you have derived at the wrong conclusion.

According to my calculator, the following inputs:

no disc brakes + no road tubeless, no carbon bikes + no powermeters + no ceramic bearings + no 25mm tires

= Eddy Merckx!!! hahahahah....

[Clean39T]

Originally Posted by weisan

no, no, no, Clean pal....you have derived at the wrong conclusion.

According to my calculator, the following inputs:

no disc brakes + no road tubeless, no carbon bikes + no powermeters + no ceramic bearings + no 25mm tires

= Eddy Merckx!!! hahahahah....

You forgot '42x23 is an adequate climbing gear' and 'brifters cause carpal tunnel' ....

[weisan]

Originally Posted by Clean39T

You forgot '42x23 is an adequate climbing gear' and 'brifters cause carpal tunnel' ....

You are...a GENIUS!

Helmets are optional. So is cleats.

But I suspect Mr. Merckx might be open to accepting an Apple Watch.

[StephenCL]

Originally Posted by Clean39T

You forgot '42x23 is an adequate climbing gear' and 'brifters cause carpal tunnel' ....

Yeah, that cassette is so small that the hub flange is larger than the last row of cogs...

I have photos of my 1991 Schwinn Paramount. It sports a 42 front ring and a 25 rear cog. I used that gear set to climb over the Alpine loop in Utah almost every weekend...no wonder my knees have issues now...

Stephen

[Clean39T]

...

[dbnm]

film vs digital.

yawn.

[johnniecakes]

Again already? Ride what you like, but ride!

[denapista]

EE brakes, Campy SR brakes have been all of the braking I felt I needed on road, minus one descent! I went down Tuna in SM mountains and that was the only time I felt like Disc brakes would have been cool to have.

I just don't see the benefits of adding so much rotational weight and unnecessary weight to the overall bike, for something you truly don't need. To me the biggest aspect of braking on a road bike is modulation. I've yet to feel that with Disc brakes.

On and Off is not a trait of braking I'd subscribe to with a road bike. Now if we're talking about a bike that involves riding on loose/steep dirt, then yeah.. Disc brakes are heaven sent.

[makoti]

Originally Posted by Clean39T

You forgot '42x23 is an adequate climbing gear' and 'brifters cause carpal tunnel' ....

Don't forget "Two bottles? Why on earth would you need TWO bottles?"