race sponsorship protocol for own events

[kiwisimon]

When I raced and our team sponsor was sponsoring an event, we were not in line to get sponsored prizes.
Generally we were encouraged to make things friendly and as welcoming as possible offering help to the newbies and taking the long pulls onto the wind for those not at the pointy end. .

Is that a thing still or are sponsored riders up to win their own event's prizes?

Had a mate ask me how it works in the states and I don't know. cheers.

[earlfoss]

During the years I organized races, team members were not allowed to collect prizes. There was team support for this and never was an issue.

[prototoast]

In the case of L39ion, the goal of putting on your own race is to stack the deck in your favor and take home all the prize money.

[Coffee Rider]

When I was on club's that put on races, we didn't have a policy about it, but we also weren't exactly cleaning up in terms of the results. I do like the idea of club members trying to make the race environment welcoming and being more like hosts than just some other people competing for the peanuts that are generally prizes in bike races.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by prototoast

In the case of L39ion, the goal of putting on your own race is to stack the deck in your favor and take home all the prize money.

post of the day

[proxient]

Originally Posted by prototoast

In the case of L39ion, the goal of putting on your own race is to stack the deck in your favor and take home all the prize money.

The classic "Cinzano Technique"

[carpediemracing]

I have literally not heard of this rule for probably 20+ years. But reading the post, I realized that, yes, it used to be a thing.

When I promoted races (1993-2015, and helping from then until 2021, and helping in 2022), one of the main goals was to do well in the races I promoted (if it was the right kind of race - for hilly races or whatever, I didn't go for it), both in terms of team as well as individually. There was no rules about not getting prize money, and in fact we all hoped we could get some of it. However the real goal was winning a trophy (top 3 overall in a 4-7 week series) because it was something tangible. Later it became the GC (jersey + trophy). For a bit, when I got fancy, it was shoe covers, shorts, jersey, and a helmet. I won the lot in the first year but when it was the cool Mavic helmet I was nowhere in the running.



I did do raffles, typically donated swag from bike companies (aka the local rep). For regular raffle stuff it was open to everyone except me (and co-promoter, which I usually had). I usually had a kid from the crowd pick tickets. Worked well, everyone hung around and it was fun. Team members won very infrequently, if ever. I remember one non-team Junior got the wheel set plus won the Juniors and Cat 3-4 overall, so went home with a LOT of stuff, both money and product. He later went on to be on the National team on the track, so his incredible sprint was actually incredible.

One year I went out and bought "cool electronic stuff" like an Xbox and some other cool stuff, spent about $500? $1000? I don't remember, and in fact I don't remember buying the stuff, I might have sent a kid that knew more about that kind of stuff rather than go myself. For those I wanted them to be open only to non-promoting people, which got some light hearted protests from my helpers.

That stuff was very low key. I gave a lot of raffle tickets out (supposed to be one per racer, but really anyone that hung around to the end typically got some). And because many racers left, they'd give their tickets to a buddy that was staying.

Key was it was really fun. Like it was pretty much my favorite part of promoting, it was like a big party. It's like giving presents. It's nice receiving presents, but it's *really* nice giving them.

Having said all that, I have to say that in the actual races that I did, I didn't have as many competitors as I might have. A lot of racers, friends or former teammates or simply supporters of my promotion efforts, would work for me in the races. I figured that out one year when I found myself racing "well" in my own Series and then struggled a bit to surf the front in subsequent races. I realized that in my own races the guys were giving me spots, pulling me to the front, etc. In some of the final Bethel races you'll see other team riders pulling me to the front, or in the post race comments, ask if I won (versus whoever I beat). In regular races, not so much, although it still happened.

Those "on the bike" friendships forged through many years of club riding plus just experiencing racing together, those are hard bonds to break. One racer, who I raced with just a few years in the early 1990s, he started racing again after many years off. He rolled up to me during a race in 2015 and asked if I wanted to be brought to the front or to be led out. Not my teammate, but we went through a lot of experiences together when we were younger, and he knew what I wanted to do in races.

Even now I see that kind of support. When I put together a kit order for myself a little while ago, I got scattered requests from riders from 20+ years ago for kits. So my kit for my small team (me, myself, and I) will have riders in CA, TX, NJ, and CT. All that race are racing for local teams (including in CT - they're racing for other teams) but they will wear the kit when appropriate. Actually, I just remembered I need to bill them for the kits still. lol.

[redir]

I have put on a few races with my team too. This was in the 2000's - 2015's era and we did not have such a rule. The guys on the sponsored team wanted USCF points just like anyone else so when the start gun went off the race was on. We always had good prize money for the pro's and even the lower cats and masters, swag was available for the juniors.

[unterhausen]

I'm curious how one might stack a race in order that your team might win all the prizes. Or is there something about L39ion that makes people question what they are doing?

Promoters of bike events do pretty well for themselves nowadays, or they go out of business. Sponsors seem willing to pay for that.

[earlfoss]

The worst part about Legion's behavior was that non-team members who won money either received delayed payouts or didn't receive at all. A rider used social media to call them out, and they made her out to be the bad person. I give Legion another season or two before the program falls apart.

They win so much because they have almost no competition aside from when Rally shows up. They almost solely have the lack of domestic pro teams to thank for their success.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

I'm curious how one might stack a race in order that your team might win all the prizes. Or is there something about L39ion that makes people question what they are doing?

I dont think they did anything unique to stack the deck in their favor since they've been clobbering every team in every crit for a few years now... but they pushed to oust the USA crits director, pulled out of the series and urged other teams to do the same while setting up their own race(s) with bigger payouts that were slow to materialize. It doesnt matter if this is "just how it is" in US racing, if they are claiming to do it better they gotta show up with that ready.

I dont think there was some nefarious plan at work here, and I really like what those guys are doing to try to keep the dying crit scene alive, but the optics and timing are awful poor.

[HenryA]

I always thought of it as a bike race. Like where the fastest and smartest probably won, but had to actually go out and duke it out. I can’t imagine why “throwing” a race by acting as pack fill and tour guides would be desirable for anyone involved.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

I'm curious how one might stack a race in order that your team might win all the prizes. Or is there something about L39ion that makes people question what they are doing?

Promoters of bike events do pretty well for themselves nowadays, or they go out of business. Sponsors seem willing to pay for that.

Invited teams were limited to six riders each, but L39ion had two teams entered that were working together. So effectively they had 12 riders on their team against six on every other.

[HenryA]

Originally Posted by carpediemracing

I have literally not heard of this rule for probably 20+ years. But reading the post, I realized that, yes, it used to be a thing.

When I promoted races (1993-2015, and helping from then until 2021, and helping in 2022), one of the main goals was to do well in the races I promoted (if it was the right kind of race - for hilly races or whatever, I didn't go for it), both in terms of team as well as individually. There was no rules about not getting prize money, and in fact we all hoped we could get some of it. However the real goal was winning a trophy (top 3 overall in a 4-7 week series) because it was something tangible. Later it became the GC (jersey + trophy). For a bit, when I got fancy, it was shoe covers, shorts, jersey, and a helmet. I won the lot in the first year but when it was the cool Mavic helmet I was nowhere in the running.



I did do raffles, typically donated swag from bike companies (aka the local rep). For regular raffle stuff it was open to everyone except me (and co-promoter, which I usually had). I usually had a kid from the crowd pick tickets. Worked well, everyone hung around and it was fun. Team members won very infrequently, if ever. I remember one non-team Junior got the wheel set plus won the Juniors and Cat 3-4 overall, so went home with a LOT of stuff, both money and product. He later went on to be on the National team on the track, so his incredible sprint was actually incredible.

One year I went out and bought "cool electronic stuff" like an Xbox and some other cool stuff, spent about $500? $1000? I don't remember, and in fact I don't remember buying the stuff, I might have sent a kid that knew more about that kind of stuff rather than go myself. For those I wanted them to be open only to non-promoting people, which got some light hearted protests from my helpers.

That stuff was very low key. I gave a lot of raffle tickets out (supposed to be one per racer, but really anyone that hung around to the end typically got some). And because many racers left, they'd give their tickets to a buddy that was staying.

Key was it was really fun. Like it was pretty much my favorite part of promoting, it was like a big party. It's like giving presents. It's nice receiving presents, but it's *really* nice giving them.

Having said all that, I have to say that in the actual races that I did, I didn't have as many competitors as I might have. A lot of racers, friends or former teammates or simply supporters of my promotion efforts, would work for me in the races. I figured that out one year when I found myself racing "well" in my own Series and then struggled a bit to surf the front in subsequent races. I realized that in my own races the guys were giving me spots, pulling me to the front, etc. In some of the final Bethel races you'll see other team riders pulling me to the front, or in the post race comments, ask if I won (versus whoever I beat). In regular races, not so much, although it still happened.

Those "on the bike" friendships forged through many years of club riding plus just experiencing racing together, those are hard bonds to break. One racer, who I raced with just a few years in the early 1990s, he started racing again after many years off. He rolled up to me during a race in 2015 and asked if I wanted to be brought to the front or to be led out. Not my teammate, but we went through a lot of experiences together when we were younger, and he knew what I wanted to do in races.

Even now I see that kind of support. When I put together a kit order for myself a little while ago, I got scattered requests from riders from 20+ years ago for kits. So my kit for my small team (me, myself, and I) will have riders in CA, TX, NJ, and CT. All that race are racing for local teams (including in CT - they're racing for other teams) but they will wear the kit when appropriate. Actually, I just remembered I need to bill them for the kits still. lol.

Sorry for the huge re-quote but its worth reading again.

This is what cycling needs to reinvigorate local racing and thereby regional racing. A broad base of promoters and participants all showing a high level of sportsmanship.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by HenryA

A broad base of promoters and participants all showing a high level of sportsmanship.

The promotors are all, or already have been, aging out. As someone that's had hands in promoting a successful local CX race every year, people get tired of doing it for 10+ years. No one is coming in behind them to pick up the baton, and i believe USAC dropped the requirement for registered clubs to promote races.

I am hoping the the explosion of NICA also brings some new race promotors in - I really think that it will bring XC racing back to popularity and thats the future of US cycling, people just do not want to race on the road anymore and even fewer towns/cities/etc want to support bike racing.