Can't wait for Spring! Santa Barbara riding advice.

[XXtwindad]

Really chomping at the proverbial bit to tick some Bucket List rides off the list.
Epic Road Rides, which is a fantastic resource for travelling cyclists, pretty much declared Santa Barbara (and surrounding areas) a cycling paradise, ahead of many other notable contenders.
https://www.epicroadrides.com/

So, for those members familiar with the area (cgolvin? mhespeneide?) I'd love to get some more feedback. The main three loops I want to do involve

1) Solvang/Figeuroa Mountain Loop. (from Solvang)
2) Refugio Pass/West Camino Cielo Loop. (from SB)
3) Painted Cave/East Camino Cielo/Gibraltar Loop (from SB)

So, questions: I will be taking my Alliance gravel bike. Geared low. 31/36. 35c tires. That should be enough to handle any dirt/gravel and deal with the beastly climbs.

Question #1 Climb up (on the dirt) via West Camino Cielo and descend Refugio? Or vice versa?
Question #2 Climb up Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar? Descending a 20% grade seems a little hairy for me.
Question # 3 Go up the East side of Figueroa (via Happy Canyon) and descend West side? Or vice versa?
Question#4 Any MUST do rides of the three? If I had to prioritize?
Question # 5 Best month to cycle? I was thinking March or April.

Thanks so much!

[bart998]

I live in L.A. but did a Century event in Solvang last year. I was really disappointed by the extremely poor road conditions in some areas. I would definitely recommend a comfortable frame and 28mm or wider tires. The worst, by far, was Drum Canyon Rd. Beautiful climb, scary descent because of the pot holes everywhere.

[prototoast]

Gibraltar is a great climb. Camino Cielo triggered a fear of heights in me that I didn't know I had. Not as "epic" but Mountain Drive is a great ride, and along the coast to Ventura is also gorgeous.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by prototoast

Gibraltar is a great climb. Camino Cielo triggered a fear of heights in me that I didn't know I had. Not as "epic" but Mountain Drive is a great ride, and along the coast to Ventura is also gorgeous.

West or East Camino Cielo? Why the vertigo? Steep drop off?

[jkbrwn]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

West or East Camino Cielo? Why the vertigo? Steep drop off?

East Camino Cielo has a terrible road surface IMO and because of this I just didn't enjoy the descent at all. Had to take it super slow to feel safe, and I generally am not worried about descents at all. Painted Cave Rd was equally as bad but the novelty factor was good. It wasn't until I got down to N San Marcos Rd that I started to really enjoy that descent and by that point, I was almost at the bottom

Gibraltar Rd was obviously a fantastic climb, though. I did Gibraltar Up> E Camino > Painted Cafe > N San Marcos. Don't get me wrong, it was enjoyable but the aforementioned descent was so-so.

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

1) Solvang/Figeuroa Mountain Loop. (from Solvang)
2) Refugio Pass/West Camino Cielo Loop. (from SB)
3) Painted Cave/East Camino Cielo/Gibraltar Loop (from SB)

So, questions: I will be taking my Alliance gravel bike. Geared low. 31/36. 35c tires. That should be enough to handle any dirt/gravel and deal with the beastly climbs.

Question #1 Climb up (on the dirt) via West Camino Cielo and descend Refugio? Or vice versa?
Question #2 Climb up Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar? Descending a 20% grade seems a little hairy for me.
Question # 3 Go up the East side of Figueroa (via Happy Canyon) and descend West side? Or vice versa?
Question#4 Any MUST do rides of the three? If I had to prioritize?
Question # 5 Best month to cycle? I was thinking March or April.

In no particular order, bearing in mind that all my experience is on a road bike with at most 28 rear/25 front…

#1: I have never done West Camino Cielo / Refugio. My understanding is that the Refugio road surface is really bad; also, Refugio is likely the steepest climb of all you've listed. If I were doing that route I'd definitely climb Refugio since descending it, even on fat tires, will be no fun.

#2: No question -- climb Old San Marcos & Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar. As @jkbrwn pointed out, the road surface on Painted Cave is lousy but at the speed you're climbing it that's not a problem. Gibraltar is a very nice climb but I like PC more. The road surface of the rolling section of Camino Cielo from PC to La Cumbre ain't great either, another reason to do it in that direction. The road surface on most of Gib is excellent so it's a very nice descent, just make sure that you stay well to the right since there are blind corners.

#3: I just did Fig in the "clockwise" direction (starting in Los Olivos) for the first time 2 weeks ago. It is a completely different climb -- many ramps of double digit grade whereas the bulk of the climb coming from Happy Canyon is long and steady (the steepest portion is the first part, before the dirt). It's a hard call because the road surface on the west (Los Olivos) side is pretty bad so I'd rather be going up it than down. If forced to choose, I'd probably opt for the Happy Canyon start and suffer the crappy descent. That said, if you've got the legs and the days are getting longer, why not do both? Start in Solvang, climb from Happy Valley, then after the descent (before Neverland Ranch), reverse course.

#4: For me, Painted Cave is the gem. My prioritization is OSM/PC/Gib, then Fig (a close second). If I had a third ride it would probably be to climb Gibraltar, not Refugio, but again that's not based on experience. Here's another one to consider, starting in Solvang/Buellton: Jalama Beach. It's not the epic climb but it's very pretty and relatively isolated. Alas, like many others, crappy road surface. Happy to provide a route if you're interested -- I think it was about 70 miles & just under 5k elevation starting in Buellton.

#5: March/April are good; early Spring and Fall would be my choices. Summer can be brutally hot and, with the exception of one tap near the top of Painted Cave, there are no water stops. It's not unusual to encounter early morning temperatures in the 30s in the Santa Ynez valley in late fall and winter with 30 degrees of temperature change over the course of the day, so you'll be stripping off layers as you climb.

Whew, that was a lot. Happy to answer additional questions.

[fkslksj]

Originally Posted by cgolvin

In no particular order, bearing in mind that all my experience is on a road bike with at most 28 rear/25 front…

#1: I have never done West Camino Cielo / Refugio. My understanding is that the Refugio road surface is really bad; also, Refugio is likely the steepest climb of all you've listed. If I were doing that route I'd definitely climb Refugio since descending it, even on fat tires, will be no fun.

#2: No question -- climb Old San Marcos & Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar. As @jkbrwn pointed out, the road surface on Painted Cave is lousy but at the speed you're climbing it that's not a problem. Gibraltar is a very nice climb but I like PC more. The road surface of the rolling section of Camino Cielo from PC to La Cumbre ain't great either, another reason to do it in that direction. The road surface on most of Gib is excellent so it's a very nice descent, just make sure that you stay well to the right since there are blind corners.

#3: I just did Fig in the "clockwise" direction (starting in Los Olivos) for the first time 2 weeks ago. It is a completely different climb -- many ramps of double digit grade whereas the bulk of the climb coming from Happy Canyon is long and steady (the steepest portion is the first part, before the dirt). It's a hard call because the road surface on the west (Los Olivos) side is pretty bad so I'd rather be going up it than down. If forced to choose, I'd probably opt for the Happy Canyon start and suffer the crappy descent. That said, if you've got the legs and the days are getting longer, why not do both? Start in Solvang, climb from Happy Valley, then after the descent (before Neverland Ranch), reverse course.

#4: For me, Painted Cave is the gem. My prioritization is OSM/PC/Gib, then Fig (a close second). If I had a third ride it would probably be to climb Gibraltar, not Refugio, but again that's not based on experience. Here's another one to consider, starting in Solvang/Buellton: Jalama Beach. It's not the epic climb but it's very pretty and relatively isolated. Alas, like many others, crappy road surface. Happy to provide a route if you're interested -- I think it was about 70 miles & just under 5k elevation starting in Buellton.

#5: March/April are good; early Spring and Fall would be my choices. Summer can be brutally hot and, with the exception of one tap near the top of Painted Cave, there are no water stops. It's not unusual to encounter early morning temperatures in the 30s in the Santa Ynez valley in late fall and winter with 30 degrees of temperature change over the course of the day, so you'll be stripping off layers as you climb.

Whew, that was a lot. Happy to answer additional questions.

Everything cgolvin said rings true ^^^

Road surface on Refugio is indeed terrible. I've descended on my motorcycle and wouldn't do so again.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by cgolvin

In no particular order, bearing in mind that all my experience is on a road bike with at most 28 rear/25 front…

#1: I have never done West Camino Cielo / Refugio. My understanding is that the Refugio road surface is really bad; also, Refugio is likely the steepest climb of all you've listed. If I were doing that route I'd definitely climb Refugio since descending it, even on fat tires, will be no fun.

#2: No question -- climb Old San Marcos & Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar. As @jkbrwn pointed out, the road surface on Painted Cave is lousy but at the speed you're climbing it that's not a problem. Gibraltar is a very nice climb but I like PC more. The road surface of the rolling section of Camino Cielo from PC to La Cumbre ain't great either, another reason to do it in that direction. The road surface on most of Gib is excellent so it's a very nice descent, just make sure that you stay well to the right since there are blind corners.

#3: I just did Fig in the "clockwise" direction (starting in Los Olivos) for the first time 2 weeks ago. It is a completely different climb -- many ramps of double digit grade whereas the bulk of the climb coming from Happy Canyon is long and steady (the steepest portion is the first part, before the dirt). It's a hard call because the road surface on the west (Los Olivos) side is pretty bad so I'd rather be going up it than down. If forced to choose, I'd probably opt for the Happy Canyon start and suffer the crappy descent. That said, if you've got the legs and the days are getting longer, why not do both? Start in Solvang, climb from Happy Valley, then after the descent (before Neverland Ranch), reverse course.

#4: For me, Painted Cave is the gem. My prioritization is OSM/PC/Gib, then Fig (a close second). If I had a third ride it would probably be to climb Gibraltar, not Refugio, but again that's not based on experience. Here's another one to consider, starting in Solvang/Buellton: Jalama Beach. It's not the epic climb but it's very pretty and relatively isolated. Alas, like many others, crappy road surface. Happy to provide a route if you're interested -- I think it was about 70 miles & just under 5k elevation starting in Buellton.

#5: March/April are good; early Spring and Fall would be my choices. Summer can be brutally hot and, with the exception of one tap near the top of Painted Cave, there are no water stops. It's not unusual to encounter early morning temperatures in the 30s in the Santa Ynez valley in late fall and winter with 30 degrees of temperature change over the course of the day, so you'll be stripping off layers as you climb.

Whew, that was a lot. Happy to answer additional questions.

Thanks so much for your insightful advice! Much appreciated!

I guess the takeaway is: bring wider tires, lower gearing, and make sure your brakes work - whatever their flavor may be.

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

Thanks so much for your insightful advice! Much appreciated!

Happy to help. The routes are all pretty straightforward but if you want .gpx files I've got 'em.

I don't recall where you came down during the related thread, but just in case … there's an In 'n Out Burger pretty close to the base of Old San Marcos Road, so you could make that your launch point for OSM->PC->Gib, return on 192 and top off the ride with a double-double. Or not.

[mhespenheide]

Originally Posted by XXtwindad

Really chomping at the proverbial bit to tick some Bucket List rides off the list.
Epic Road Rides, which is a fantastic resource for travelling cyclists, pretty much declared Santa Barbara (and surrounding areas) a cycling paradise, ahead of many other notable contenders.
https://www.epicroadrides.com/

So, for those members familiar with the area (cgolvin? mhespeneide?) I'd love to get some more feedback. The main three loops I want to do involve

1) Solvang/Figeuroa Mountain Loop. (from Solvang)
2) Refugio Pass/West Camino Cielo Loop. (from SB)
3) Painted Cave/East Camino Cielo/Gibraltar Loop (from SB)

So, questions: I will be taking my Alliance gravel bike. Geared low. 31/36. 35c tires. That should be enough to handle any dirt/gravel and deal with the beastly climbs.

Question #1 Climb up (on the dirt) via West Camino Cielo and descend Refugio? Or vice versa?
Question #2 Climb up Painted Cave and descend Gibraltar? Descending a 20% grade seems a little hairy for me.
Question # 3 Go up the East side of Figueroa (via Happy Canyon) and descend West side? Or vice versa?
Question#4 Any MUST do rides of the three? If I had to prioritize?
Question # 5 Best month to cycle? I was thinking March or April.

Thanks so much!

1. Refugio is in really bad shape. Really bad. I used to ride it a few times a year using an old Ritchey Ultra that I joke is my "flat-bar gravel bike", but it has ~2" slicks on it and I was happy to have them. With that, Refugio can be fun, but it was meaningful to me because it let me start in Los Olivos, ride to the beach, and back. I climbed from Refugio pass up to the high point on West Camino Cielo twice and it's a worthwhile sufferfest, but I'm embarrassed to admit that I never did the whole route through to connect to 154. So I can't comment on that.

2. Yes. Descending Painted Cave is, in my opinion, just not that much fun. It's so steep and has a number of 180-degree hairpins that you have to slow way down for. I did like climbing Painted Cave, riding East Camino Cielo, and descending Gibraltar. Or climbing Gibraltar and riding east to the end of the pavement and returning the same route.

3. I usually didn't do the full Fig loop; I only did the full loop a few times per year. I usually went up and came down the same "side". Those were regular rides for me. If doing the full loop, I personally prefer to climb out of Los Olivos up the NW side and descend via Happy Canyon. Similar to #2 -- descending Happy Canyon is more "flowy" and simply more fun.

4. The must-do, in my opinion, is Old San Marcos/Painted Cave to East Camino Cielo and down Gibraltar. The climb is brutal but survivable, and the ridgeline views from the top of East Camino Cielo can't be beat. As you swing from one side of the ridge to another, you get views of the backcountry mountains on one side and views of the Pacific on the other. (I kind of hate admitting that since Fig was my "home" loop, but there you go.)

5. As long as you're not doing the giant loops (like Refugio/West Camino Cielo/East Camino Cielo/Gibraltar), most months are fine. I'd recommend other than July-August-September or even early October as those are the hottest months. But even June and early July are do-able if you start early. Late March through April are probably prime.

That Alliance should do you fine, except maybe for a full ride through of West Camino Cielo. A lot of the pavement in the area is downright bad, but I rode a road bike with 32's 95% of the time or more. People here on this forum will claim that anything over 28's is overkill for roads, but I was happy to have 32's.

If you want rec's for other rides in the Santa Ynez valley or food recommendations, let me know. As I've said before, I'm kind of bummed that the area is getting "Paceline-discovered" right after I moved away. But it's a fantastic area for riding, and a little oasis of sanity in Southern California.

Now, if anyone from Boston or the Northeast wants to explore some nearly deserted roads (paved and gravel) up on the MA/NH border, drop me a line...

[lavi]

I bet it'll be nice for sure!

Now, not to be contrarian, or crap on your plans, or thread hijack....I'd just do a day trip to SB and hit some version of Gibraltar. You'd find me camping at Leo Carrillo St Park where Mulholland hits PCH. The canyon riding in Malibu, atmo, is the premiere place to ride. So many choices and route options. (Latigo, Stunt, Decker, Encinal, Yerba Buena, the length of Mulholland, Piuma, and on and on). Long, short, and everything in between. Yes, I have a crush on that area.

This little ditty was my road bible when I spent time in Malibu.

[cgolvin]

I love these rides in SB but @lavi is talking about my back yard and you know how easy it is to take your back yard for granted.

I always have at least 20 miles of “junk” (if you can call riding along the ocean that) to get to the start of any climbing, and I usually eclipse 100 ft/mi. Starting at Leo Carrillo you could very easily double that ratio.

As an added gift from the fires, we now have a section of Mullholland (“The Snake”) that is closed to cars. It’s delightful.

So why not do both? I’ll be happy to shepherd you around, Covid restrictions permitting.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by mhespenheide

1. Refugio is in really bad shape. Really bad. I used to ride it a few times a year using an old Ritchey Ultra that I joke is my "flat-bar gravel bike", but it has ~2" slicks on it and I was happy to have them. With that, Refugio can be fun, but it was meaningful to me because it let me start in Los Olivos, ride to the beach, and back. I climbed from Refugio pass up to the high point on West Camino Cielo twice and it's a worthwhile sufferfest, but I'm embarrassed to admit that I never did the whole route through to connect to 154. So I can't comment on that.

2. Yes. Descending Painted Cave is, in my opinion, just not that much fun. It's so steep and has a number of 180-degree hairpins that you have to slow way down for. I did like climbing Painted Cave, riding East Camino Cielo, and descending Gibraltar. Or climbing Gibraltar and riding east to the end of the pavement and returning the same route.

3. I usually didn't do the full Fig loop; I only did the full loop a few times per year. I usually went up and came down the same "side". Those were regular rides for me. If doing the full loop, I personally prefer to climb out of Los Olivos up the NW side and descend via Happy Canyon. Similar to #2 -- descending Happy Canyon is more "flowy" and simply more fun.

4. The must-do, in my opinion, is Old San Marcos/Painted Cave to East Camino Cielo and down Gibraltar. The climb is brutal but survivable, and the ridgeline views from the top of East Camino Cielo can't be beat. As you swing from one side of the ridge to another, you get views of the backcountry mountains on one side and views of the Pacific on the other. (I kind of hate admitting that since Fig was my "home" loop, but there you go.)

5. As long as you're not doing the giant loops (like Refugio/West Camino Cielo/East Camino Cielo/Gibraltar), most months are fine. I'd recommend other than July-August-September or even early October as those are the hottest months. But even June and early July are do-able if you start early. Late March through April are probably prime.

That Alliance should do you fine, except maybe for a full ride through of West Camino Cielo. A lot of the pavement in the area is downright bad, but I rode a road bike with 32's 95% of the time or more. People here on this forum will claim that anything over 28's is overkill for roads, but I was happy to have 32's.

If you want rec's for other rides in the Santa Ynez valley or food recommendations, let me know. As I've said before, I'm kind of bummed that the area is getting "Paceline-discovered" right after I moved away. But it's a fantastic area for riding, and a little oasis of sanity in Southern California.

Now, if anyone from Boston or the Northeast wants to explore some nearly deserted roads (paved and gravel) up on the MA/NH border, drop me a line...

Thanks so much, Mark. Really appreciate your feedback. Looks like you're echoing the feedback of others. The Painted Cave/Cielo/Gibraltar Loop is the one to tick off before all the others.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by lavi

I bet it'll be nice for sure!

Now, not to be contrarian, or crap on your plans, or thread hijack....I'd just do a day trip to SB and hit some version of Gibraltar. You'd find me camping at Leo Carrillo St Park where Mulholland hits PCH. The canyon riding in Malibu, atmo, is the premiere place to ride. So many choices and route options. (Latigo, Stunt, Decker, Encinal, Yerba Buena, the length of Mulholland, Piuma, and on and on). Long, short, and everything in between. Yes, I have a crush on that area.

This little ditty was my road bible when I spent time in Malibu.

The Santa Monica Mountains you say?
Brady's book is great. I've done Latigo Canyon and Dirt Mullholland a few times. They're immaculate. Can't wait for Spring. So much fun riding ahead...

[lavi]

Ugh. Killing me softly.

And the fact that the snake is closed for cars?!? Triple Bonus.

If only I didn't have a 7 mo old in the house, I'd pack up the F150 and head 1k miles to cycling nirvana.

@xxtwindad: Out of curiosity, where are you traveling from?