The Guardian article: How US helmet laws are used against cyclists of colour...

[cabbagelookin]

I wasn't aware of the helmet laws in these jurisdictions. Anyone have any personal experiences of the targeted enforcement covered in the article?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...olour-homeless

[Kirk007]

I live across the Sound but spent decades commuting in Seattle. I think thse calling for repeal of the helmet law are conflating two different issues - the saftey issues around wearing a helmet and the social justice issues arising out of police enforcement. There is also probably a statistical issue here wherein I would guess that a much larger percentage of cyclists not wearing helmets are low income/homeless so there may be a bias in the numbers.

Activists call for repeal of the helmet law though seems to be the wrong approach - it doesn't solve the enforcement issue, it just makes it go away while exacerbating safety issues (assuming you believe that helmets increase safety for cyclists). There's a lot of progressive outrage in Seattle right now particularly with police and city government. I used to consider myself liberal and progressive but to me, the vocal component of that community in Seattle has lost it's way.

[prototoast]

Helmets are great, I always ride with a helmet, and think everyone else should too, but I don't think there is a compelling public policy reason to penalize people who are not wearing one. If policymakers think that it would be good to get more people to wear helmets, they can do it by offering free or subsidized helmets for low-income populations, they can do public health campaigns to alert people to the benefits of helmet, but they don't need to penalize people, particularly as we know enforcement will always be uneven.

In many ways, it is analogous to "war on drugs"--I've never used recreational drugs, I think they are bad for people's health, we have imprisoned millions of people are non-violent drug crimes, and also I attended an elitist ivy League University where the future Doctors, lawyers, politicians, etc regularly used illegal drugs with impunity.

I'm not a total libertarian, I do think there is a role for government to play in public health and safety, but in the absence of clear harm to others, I believe government should rely on the carrot far more than the stick. Otherwise the stick will be deployed against our least powerful, most vulnerable population overwhelmingly.

[pasadena]

If not a helmet law, it will be "view obstruction by gps or air freshner", "window tint", "expired tag", "unsafe lane change", "smell narcotics", "not to code" or a multitude of other "probable cause" reasons.

If the police want to stop someone, they will find a reason.
Enforcement and legislation are two different things.

[Wattvagen]

disgusting behavior by police.

issuing a citation to a cyclist who was just hit by a car and is homeless is an abuse of power and a scumbag move. who does that?

[cabbagelookin]

Agree with all of the above. The last couple of years have seen me increasingly exposed to regulatory and legislative bodies. To Kirk007 and Prototoast's points, the (completely unfounded) rationale for some of the proposed legislation that I've been asked to comment on are so incredibly misguided, it kind of blows my mind.

The final paragraph seems pretty intuitive to those of us in the community, I imagine, but I'm learning that common sense seems to be in short supply at the legislative level:
“Before there is law, there should be investment and bicycle infrastructure in the communities that need the investments the most,” Brown said. “We can advocate rightly for the use of helmets without sending people to jail, giving them fines and potentially harming them for not doing so.”

[cabbagelookin]

Originally Posted by Kirk007

I live across the Sound but spent decades commuting in Seattle. I think thse calling for repeal of the helmet law are conflating two different issues - the saftey issues around wearing a helmet and the social justice issues arising out of police enforcement. There is also probably a statistical issue here wherein I would guess that a much larger percentage of cyclists not wearing helmets are low income/homeless so there may be a bias in the numbers.

Activists call for repeal of the helmet law though seems to be the wrong approach - it doesn't solve the enforcement issue, it just makes it go away while exacerbating safety issues (assuming you believe that helmets increase safety for cyclists). There's a lot of progressive outrage in Seattle right now particularly with police and city government. I used to consider myself liberal and progressive but to me, the vocal component of that community in Seattle has lost it's way.

I work in animal health, and the well-meaning advocates for animal welfare are often completely misaligned with real-world use-cases or the needs of most of the population.

[Ozz]

Can't speak to what happens in Seattle, but across the pond in Bellevue, there are numerous helmet giveaway events....including ones sponsored by Bellevue PD....to make sure anyone who wants a helmet, has one. I am sure mostly focused at kids, but still good.

This does not help the enforcement bias or people who just don't want a helmet, but maybe helps "normalize" the wearing of a helmet for everyone.

[EB]

Helmet laws are bad for cyclists and cycling.

Rather than summarizing the arguments, of which discriminatory enforcement is just one of many problems, I'll just pass on this link to Streetsblog, discussing the NTSB endorsement of helmet laws last year: https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/01/...-laws-are-bad/

[Latestart]

Originally Posted by pasadena

If not a helmet law, it will be "view obstruction by gps or air freshner", "window tint", "expired tag", "unsafe lane change", "smell narcotics", "not to code" or a multitude of other "probable cause" reasons.

If the police want to stop someone, they will find a reason.
Enforcement and legislation are two different things.

This reality is *really* hard to explain to people who haven't lived it. In LA when I was growing up, if you were under 30 and in certain parts of town, you would be stopped with absolute regularity, no matter what.

Example - stopped in Beverly Hills, papers checked for 30 minutes, finding nothing wrong given the following advice "We would prefer if YOU didn't drive in Beverly Hills". I was 22 at the time. This was in mid-1980's. I could give at least 5 more personal examples, but you get the point.

[Blown Reek]

Originally Posted by Wattvagen

issuing a citation to a cyclist who was just hit by a car and is homeless is an abuse of power and a scumbag move. who does that?

Originally Posted by Wattvagen

police

.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by prototoast

Helmets are great, I always ride with a helmet, and think everyone else should too, but I don't think there is a compelling public policy reason to penalize people who are not wearing one. If policymakers think that it would be good to get more people to wear helmets, they can do it by offering free or subsidized helmets for low-income populations, they can do public health campaigns to alert people to the benefits of helmet, but they don't need to penalize people, particularly as we know enforcement will always be uneven.

In many ways, it is analogous to "war on drugs"--I've never used recreational drugs, I think they are bad for people's health, we have imprisoned billions of people are non-violent drug crimes, and also I attended an elitist ivy League University where the future Doctors, lawyers, politicians, etc regularly used illegal drugs with impunity.

I'm not a total libertarian, I do think there is a role for government to play in public health and safety, but in the absence of clear harm to others, I believe government should rely on the carrot far more than the stick. Otherwise the stick will be deployed against our least powerful, most vulnerable population overwhelmingly.

Although I vehemently disagree with you on walking, I find most of your opinions to be thoughtful and well-reasoned. This one included.

[tomato coupe]

Originally Posted by prototoast

In many ways, it is analogous to "war on drugs"--I've never used recreational drugs, I think they are bad for people's health, we have imprisoned billions of people are non-violent drug crimes ...

Billions of people?

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by tomato coupe

Billions of people?

Sorry, I was using speech-to-text. I meant to say millions.

[ariw]

https://www.tampabay.com/news/public...black/2225966/