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  #1351  
Old 11-06-2024, 01:42 PM
vespasianus vespasianus is offline
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Originally Posted by Gwerziou View Post
So in conclusion, you just want to get that Ekar derailleur pulley as absolutely close as possible to the cogs, right?
Yes, and the cage should be nowhere near touching anything.
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  #1352  
Old 11-06-2024, 02:29 PM
perdido perdido is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vespasianus View Post
I see the pics, but can anybody else?
Yes!! thank you, I will compare to my set up later today.
To be clear, the cage rubbing against the cog happens when shifting from the third largest cog on to the penultimate cog. Looks like your derailleur cage has some rub marks from the cassette?

Either way, I'm starting to believe that my derailleur might be bent. I can't see any other reason why it would shift OK with a 9-36 cassette and not with a 9-42.
(Hanger is straight, shifting problems are replicated when installing the 9-42 cassette on "road wheels").
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  #1353  
Old 11-06-2024, 08:27 PM
herb5998 herb5998 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwerziou View Post
So in conclusion, you just want to get that Ekar derailleur pulley as absolutely close as possible to the cogs, right?
Not exactly, 3mm is considered the maximum distance. That is checked when the RD is positioned on the 12th Cog, and space between upper pulley wheel and 13th cog.

When doing installs. I normally use 3mm as the starting point and adjust the b screw position until shifting is smooth and quiet. Sometimes, that means the spacing being more than 3mm, and others even closer.
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  #1354  
Old 11-07-2024, 05:53 AM
vespasianus vespasianus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herb5998 View Post
Not exactly, 3mm is considered the maximum distance. That is checked when the RD is positioned on the 12th Cog, and space between upper pulley wheel and 13th cog.

When doing installs. I normally use 3mm as the starting point and adjust the b screw position until shifting is smooth and quiet. Sometimes, that means the spacing being more than 3mm, and others even closer.
On my bikes, the closer the pulley wheel is to that cassette without making noise when shifting up or down, the better the shifting is. That is especially true going from the 13th cog to the 12th cog.
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  #1355  
Old 11-07-2024, 06:01 AM
vespasianus vespasianus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perdido View Post
Yes!! thank you, I will compare to my set up later today.
To be clear, the cage rubbing against the cog happens when shifting from the third largest cog on to the penultimate cog. Looks like your derailleur cage has some rub marks from the cassette?

Either way, I'm starting to believe that my derailleur might be bent. I can't see any other reason why it would shift OK with a 9-36 cassette and not with a 9-42.
(Hanger is straight, shifting problems are replicated when installing the 9-42 cassette on "road wheels").
I noticed that a bit as well and I think happened when I bent my derailleur hanger and had to ride home.

Currently, when my RD is in the third largest cog, the back of that cage is about 5mm below and in line with the 2nd cog.

The derailleur hanger bent when I tried taking a vanity shot of my bike, and a guest of wind blew it over. Landing on the drive side was enough to bend the hanger enough to cause problems.
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  #1356  
Old 11-07-2024, 03:07 PM
perdido perdido is offline
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I just ordered a new derailleur I found on sale.
I will report back if it keeps miss-shifting.
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  #1357  
Old 11-08-2024, 11:33 AM
makoti makoti is offline
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Let's talk lock rings.
I have a 10-44 cassette that came with the group. Lock ring obviously included.
I bought a 9-42 from a shop. It was a take off, and supposed to have everything. It looks like it has the lockring, but it looks very different than the one I already have. Smaller and slimmer, more integrated into the cassette. It seems to work, but I can't get my usual Campy cassette tool into it to torque it.

Are the lock rings different between cassettes? I can't see how the one for the 10-44 would even fit the 9-42
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  #1358  
Old 11-08-2024, 12:01 PM
nalax nalax is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makoti View Post
Let's talk lock rings.
I have a 10-44 cassette that came with the group. Lock ring obviously included.
I bought a 9-42 from a shop. It was a take off, and supposed to have everything. It looks like it has the lockring, but it looks very different than the one I already have. Smaller and slimmer, more integrated into the cassette. It seems to work, but I can't get my usual Campy cassette tool into it to torque it.

Are the lock rings different between cassettes? I can't see how the one for the 10-44 would even fit the 9-42
Interesting. I have two wheelsets with 9-42 cassettes. Both of the lock rings have Z9 on them. However a Google search also show a Z10 and Z11 Campagnolo lock ring for the N3W. What is shown on your two lock rings? BTW my Crombie works fine with the Z9 lock rings.
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  #1359  
Old 11-08-2024, 12:19 PM
makoti makoti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nalax View Post
Interesting. I have two wheelsets with 9-42 cassettes. Both of the lock rings have Z9 on them. However a Google search also show a Z10 and Z11 Campagnolo lock ring for the N3W. What is shown on your two lock rings? BTW my Crombie works fine with the Z9 lock rings.
So does mine! But to torque it down, I use a Park tool and a "standard" cassette removal tool (silver thing). It will not fit. Here is the 10-44. Deeper than the 9-42. Here is a link to the 9-42 with a picture of the lock ring. It is much different.

https://handsonbike.blogspot.com/202...-cassette.html

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...2/IMG_3131.JPG
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  #1360  
Old 11-08-2024, 07:33 PM
herb5998 herb5998 is offline
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The lock rings are specific to the smallest cog size, 9-36 and 9-42 have the Z9 marking, 10-44 and SRWL/S have 10t cogs (Z10), and 9/10/11/12s have 11t smallest cogs (Z11.
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  #1361  
Old 11-08-2024, 09:15 PM
makoti makoti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herb5998 View Post
The lock rings are specific to the smallest cog size, 9-36 and 9-42 have the Z9 marking, 10-44 and SRWL/S have 10t cogs (Z10), and 9/10/11/12s have 11t smallest cogs (Z11.
Ok. Makes sense. So why would the tool fit nicely in the 10, but not into the 9?
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  #1362  
Old 11-08-2024, 09:38 PM
herb5998 herb5998 is offline
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Not sure, could part of the lockring/tool interface be damaged?

I use a Crombie for removal and Socket Crombie for installation, no issues on any Campagnolo lockrings.
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  #1363  
Old 11-08-2024, 09:50 PM
makoti makoti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herb5998 View Post
Not sure, could part of the lockring/tool interface be damaged?

I use a Crombie for removal and Socket Crombie for installation, no issues on any Campagnolo lockrings.
Crombie here, too. It fits and works, but the other tool I have fits the 10, my 11 and 12 speed lockrings, but will not go into this one. I use it to torque the ring to spec.
Just odd.
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  #1364  
Old 11-11-2024, 11:55 AM
Gwerziou Gwerziou is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makoti View Post
Crombie here, too. It fits and works, but the other tool I have fits the 10, my 11 and 12 speed lockrings, but will not go into this one. I use it to torque the ring to spec.
Just odd.
I use the socket Crombie for 11, 12, and 13 speed Campy with no issues.
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  #1365  
Old 11-16-2024, 02:07 PM
perdido perdido is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perdido View Post
I just ordered a new derailleur I found on sale.
I will report back if it keeps miss-shifting.
No luck. Shifting is somewhat improved but still subpar. It hesitates at some point both going up and down the cassette.

I did install a new cable and liner from Jagwire (Road Elite sealed) and did check hanger alignment once again.

Last bullet is Max Smoothness cable set, but can't bring myself to pay that absurd amount of money (100 coins), especially when only 1/2 of the set is needed.
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