My experience with Enigma

[DRZRM]

I gotta say, I'm struck by your investment in a "lifetime" warranty being no such thing. I have a 25-year-old Serotta Legend, and if it breaks, it would go quietly into a dumpster, I loved the bike, hell I love the bike, but I have gotten more than my money's worth from it. However, if I spent money with a builder who uses (or used) a lifetime guarantee in their sales promotion, then they should stick by their word.

If I'd ridden it for 10 hard years and it developed a crack, I'd take the deal and get a new one at cost, Chris Chance did that for me when I broke a 4 year old Wicked in 1993, no hard feelings at all.

But that bike has obviously been a problem from the start. Three...THREE! cracks at the welds, we all know properly built TI frames don't do that, TI tubes don't do that, and they didn't in this case. In 2016 the owner should have recognized that their original welder either overheated the tubes or didn't purge the oxygen in the tubes, or both, and been happy to get that frame off the road without a serious injury.

When the dropout came back cracked at a weld, he had another chance to address the problem. Folks buying custom titanium frames are generally forgoing the lightest possible bike for their dollar for the tradeoff of durability (along with a very nice ride if properly engineered).

The company owner missed the chance to make a problem in the company right, twice by trying to repair a clearly faulty frame, and a third time by pretending that riding in a city with potholes should lead to frame failure in a decade (actually in 5 years). I assume that they have rectified these issues, they enjoy a pretty good reputation from what I'd heard before today. These discussions are terrible for a company. This bike was obviously an issue from the start. I wouldn't have taken a new bike from them for anything but free.

Originally Posted by peanutgallery

Ten years of use, two freebie repairs and 600 for a new one? Enigma is doing right by you. Crack open that wallet and get another. You should have no complaints

Great time to pick up disc, thru axle and tire clearance

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by peanutgallery

I'd say this one is done, too

The builder has passed (rip), the company has changed hands and the current owner has provided a viable option. Take it and ride off into the sunset. If your principles paralyze that concept, then that'll cost you way more than the 600. But if that's important to you... you do you, it's only $. Most of us will be worm dirt in 30 to 40 years

Inevitably, yes. Looks to be the OP’s “raison d’etre.” Seems to be a skilled writer, though. It would be a shame if this was his sole contribution to the site.

[rallizes]

I just don’t understand closing threads in general

[echappist]

Originally Posted by DRZRM

The company owner missed the chance to make a problem in the company right, twice by trying to repair a clearly faulty frame, and a third time by pretending that riding in a city with potholes should lead to frame failure in a decade (actually in 5 years). I assume that they have rectified these issues, they enjoy a pretty good reputation from what I'd heard before today. These discussions are terrible for a company. This bike was obviously an issue from the start. I wouldn't have taken a new bike from them for anything but free.

One key lede that has been buried in this current initial post is the fact that the OP acknowledged that the tubes were not sourced from Enigma. Enigma only welded the tubes but did not source the tubes.

The OP provided the following photo in his thread across-the-hall: that of the tubes of which he was in possession.



Workmanship is necessary but insufficient element to making a quality frame: quality of the individual components sourced is also of importance. The fact that the original welder allegedly provided lifetime warranty on this frame aside, I would doubt that any frame builder would want to provide warranty of any sort on a product where s/he was not in control of the procurement process.

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by rallizes

thread was closed across the hall

Not generally a fan of them, either (with the exception of “cyclist killed/attacked by... and then I’d favor an actual moratorium). I think the thread would have been more palatable had it been written by a member with more history.

Theoretically, what’s to prevent someone with a gripe against Company X from utilizing the Paceline as a venue for their vendettas, and then disappearing?

Conversely, if anyone is considering buying an Enigma, but has since changed their mind as a result of reading this thread, then I’d have to say it served a purpose.

[Sam Walker]

Originally Posted by echappist

One key lede that has been buried in this current initial post is the fact that the OP acknowledged that the tubes were not sourced from Enigma. Enigma only welded the tubes but did not source the tubes.

The OP provided the following photo in his thread across-the-hall: that of the tubes of which he was in possession.



Workmanship is necessary but insufficient element to making a quality frame: quality of the individual components sourced is also of importance. The fact that the original welder allegedly provided lifetime warranty on this frame aside, I would doubt that any frame builder would want to provide warranty of any sort on a product where s/he was not in control of the procurement process.

No. The tubes were sourced from Enigma, or wherever they get them from. The frame was built in-house. I simply turned up for a photo op one day. That OP was unclear because I was having a little fun with words, which is sure to be my downfall one day.

[Hellgate]

Why it cracked truly is an enigma.

Frames brake, life happens, move on.

I've cracked BB on an SL Pinarello. I had it repaired and it cracked again, sold it. I cracked a BB on a Schwinn Madison track bike. Had that one repaired and sold it. I cracked a Bianchi Tenex frame, trashed that one. However, I never broke any of the GT mountain bikes.

OP, go find a new and shiny bike you love and have fun!

[XXtwindad]

Originally Posted by echappist

One key lede that has been buried in this current initial post is the fact that the OP acknowledged that the tubes were not sourced from Enigma. Enigma only welded the tubes but did not source the tubes.

The OP provided the following photo in his thread across-the-hall: that of the tubes of which he was in possession.



Workmanship is necessary but insufficient element to making a quality frame: quality of the individual components sourced is also of importance. The fact that the original welder allegedly provided lifetime warranty on this frame aside, I would doubt that any frame builder would want to provide warranty of any sort on a product where s/he was not in control of the procurement process.

That certainly might change the equation. Where were the tubes from? So, according to the shuttered thread, the OP purchased some tubes and had Enigma weld them?

Edit: OK. Question answered.

[Sam Walker]

Originally Posted by peanutgallery

I'd say this one is done, too

The builder has passed (rip), the company has changed hands

Also no. Mark Reilly



moved on to his own company, but Enigma still has its founder.

[rallizes]

Originally Posted by echappist

One key lede that has been buried in this current initial post is the fact that the OP acknowledged that the tubes were not sourced from Enigma. Enigma only welded the tubes but did not source the tubes.

The OP provided the following photo in his thread across-the-hall: that of the tubes of which he was in possession.



Workmanship is necessary but insufficient element to making a quality frame: quality of the individual components sourced is also of importance. The fact that the original welder allegedly provided lifetime warranty on this frame aside, I would doubt that any frame builder would want to provide warranty of any sort on a product where s/he was not in control of the procurement process.

I don't believe that is correct

[tuscanyswe]

Originally Posted by echappist

One key lede that has been buried in this current initial post is the fact that the OP acknowledged that the tubes were not sourced from Enigma. Enigma only welded the tubes but did not source the tubes.

The OP provided the following photo in his thread across-the-hall: that of the tubes of which he was in possession.



Workmanship is necessary but insufficient element to making a quality frame: quality of the individual components sourced is also of importance. The fact that the original welder allegedly provided lifetime warranty on this frame aside, I would doubt that any frame builder would want to provide warranty of any sort on a product where s/he was not in control of the procurement process.

Edit never mind seems that the above post is incorrect and that the tubes were sources and supplied for like usual by enigma themselves.

[Sam Walker]

Originally Posted by Hellgate

Frames brake, life happens, move on... go find a new and shiny bike you love and have fun!

Not all of us have limitless funds to just "move on" to the next shiny thing. I will, however, endeavour to continue to have fun.

[jkbrwn]

Was wondering if you'd posted this on LFGSS. You'll get more traction there than here given enigma are UK based. If my Seven cracked like this I'd absolutely expect a new frame and I totally understand why you're pissed. Enigma are totally in the wrong in every imaginable way IMO. Especially at the year five mark.

[echappist]

Originally Posted by Sam Walker

No. The tubes were sourced from Enigma, or wherever they get them from. The frame was built in-house. I simply turned up for a photo op one day. That OP was unclear because I was having a little fun with words, which is sure to be my downfall one day.

"The beginning" as written in your post ATH indicates the first relevant event in your purchase/contracting with Enigma. And in this case, what those words conveyed was that you were in possession of the tubes before you reached out to Enigma. If other event(s) of relevance preceded your procurement of the tubes, why write it this way?

You, being a Brit, are presumably much more well versed in British history than I. So perhaps you don't need me to remind you that "having fun with words" when prosecuting your case is not as important as conveying the relevant facts accurately and clearly, whether on some internet forum or in a court of law. Some really witty dude was apparently unaware of this when he prosecuted a trial, and though his drôle repartees drew laughter, they were not persuasive.

[rallizes]

@jkbrwn

That’s just about the polar opposite take of Richard Sachs btw

I prefer yours