Tandem build - half a rant, half questions

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by marciero

As far as rims go, Velocity Aileron would both be great choice if you are considering alloy. Low weight, 21mm internal width, tubeless design, available in 36 and 40 hole drillings. We have a set of 36 hole 650b on a tandem that have stood up heavy use, including loaded touring, on all kinds of terrain. I am sure that 36 hole would be plenty even for the 700c version, esp. in light of the 28mm depth.
The cliffhangers would also be a good choice if you want wider, but are heavier

I would agree with this altho Ailerons pretty light..36h and somewhat beefy spokes like Sapim Strong or Force. Also Blunt SS(lighter still)...

Hubs? See it's WI in 40h..

Any tubeless, proven alternative to the Velocity rims? We'll be up to 400 lbs when loaded, and ride the Alps, with long rough descents.

Not many 40h rims out there, let alone tubeless and Velocity are very nice rims..not sure why you are looking for an alternative..

Cliffhanger..get NMS..Non Machined Sidewall

https://www.velocityusa.com/product/...iff-hanger-622

[CNY rider]

Originally Posted by Gothard

Thank you for the advice, one an all. I (finally) had some time to browse the web. It seems that for my needs/wants/budget, I will go with White Industries hubs in 40 drilling, and alloy rims.

Any tubeless, proven alternative to the Velocity rims? We'll be up to 400 lbs when loaded, and ride the Alps, with long rough descents.

Tire-wise I really want to use Compass (Herse) models, but I am not sure they'll stand up to tandem weight. Panaracer and Schwalbe have some very strong tires. Any other ideas?

I think I will manage the braking with a Shimano setup, who still sell post mount calipers separately.

I ride a triple with my kids. Our weight with the bike is around 350 lbs.
I don't think it's a good application for Compass tires (as much as I love them on my other bikes).
I use a burly Continental tire....Top Contact or something like that. I'm at work and can't remember the exact name. With the weight of all of us, and having my kids on the bike, I sacrifice a little ride quality for a sturdy tire.

[Gothard]

Elder Tubercule,
I don't want anything else than Dyads, AFAIK, but I am making sure I am not missing on a better rim. It seems not.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Gothard

Elder Tubercule,
I don't want anything else than Dyads, AFAIK, but I am making sure I am not missing on a better rim. It seems not.

10-4...Dyads are great rims..I have built many but Dyads aren't tubeless compatible...

Any tubeless, proven alternative to the Velocity rims? We'll be up to 400 lbs when loaded, and ride the Alps, with long rough descents.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Wheelbuilder offers these:

Astral Leviathan Disc (wider than Dyad and tubeless)

[Gothard]

Ooh, Colonel,
Those look nice.

[marciero]

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

Wheelbuilder offers these:

Astral Leviathan Disc (wider than Dyad and tubeless)

Appears that their "disc-specific" rims are simply the rim brake version with non-machined sidewall, rather than a disc-specific design. Perhaps not a huge issue but a consideration

One thing to remember with deep profile rims is to carry spare tubes with long enough valve stems, or a valve extender-even if tubeless you will want tubes as a back-up.

Originally Posted by Gothard

..

Tire-wise I really want to use Compass (Herse) models, but I am not sure they'll stand up to tandem weight. Panaracer and Schwalbe have some very strong tires. Any other ideas?
...

I've had no tandem-specific issues with Compass, both with 700c and 650b tires in extra light versions in all kinds of riding, including loaded touring. I dont think they are any more prone to sidewall cuts, for example, than on a single bike. I also inquired and Hahn at Compass had no warnings or caveats about their tires for tandem use. That said, on a recent tour with our 700c tandem I swapped the 32 Compass EL tires for 35 Panaracer Pasela (folding version), strictly for additional puncture protection (or perceived protection) from the thicker tread. They are great, and actually ride really great.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Originally Posted by marciero

Appears that their disc-specific rims are simply non-machined sidewall rim brake rims, rather than a disc-specific design, not that that is a huge issue.

True, but that's also the case for the Dyad which is a touch narrower, a touch heavier, less aero and not tubeless.

[GregL]

Originally Posted by marciero

That said, on a recent tour with our 700c tandem I swapped the 32 Compass EL tires for 35 Panaracer Pasela (folding version), strictly for additional puncture protection (or perceived protection) from the thicker tread. They are great, and actually ride really great.

We use the Panaracer T-Serv tires as our "go-to" tandem training tire with similar results. The T-Servs have a slightly stronger sidewall than the Paselas. They are very reliable and IMO ride very well for such a sturdy tire.

Greg

[marciero]

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

True, but that's also the case for the Dyad which is a touch narrower, a touch heavier, less aero and not tubeless.

Was comparing more with Aileron (and perhaps Belgium though those are 32 hole max.) I've not heard of these rims but they do have the Rolf Prima imprimatur.

[Gothard]

Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd

Wheelbuilder offers these:

Astral Leviathan Disc (wider than Dyad and tubeless)

Aaand it falls on its face… The guys at wheelbulder want 120$ to post a pair to me in Switzerland.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Originally Posted by Gothard

Aaand it falls on its face… The guys at wheelbulder want 120$ to post a pair to me in Switzerland.

$17.37 to my house. I'm happy to be a middle man for you if it helps.

There is a Rolf Prima dealer in Switzerland. Perhaps they can order them for you.

[Pegoready]

Originally Posted by pdmtong

Actually, the ever-changing has stopped changing. The road world has settled on flat mount. Did you request post? it seems odd to me they built it with post given that flat has been here for almost two years now. or maybe its because flat mounts cant handle the rotor size needed for tandems?

To anyone saying this frame/fork should have been built for flat mounts, I disagree. Flat Mount calipers are native to 140 mm rotors and you can get adapters for 160 mm rotors. But for bigger rotor sizes, there is no good way to make Flat Mount brakes work. Most tandems get 203 mm rotors and should get MTB style post mount brakes.

Because those mounts are ISO, you will just need a simple ISO-to-Post adapter for whatever rotor size you want. They're front/rear specific:

https://www.competitivecyclist.com/s...brake-adaptors

The ISO mounts are smart because there is no threading so if you mess up the threads it's on an $8 adapter not a $8000 frame.

You should be able to mix your SRAM road levers with SRAM hydraulic MTB post mount brakes.

[David Tollefson]

Originally Posted by Pegoready

To anyone saying this frame/fork should have been built for flat mounts, I disagree. Flat Mount calipers are native to 140 mm rotors and you can get adapters for 160 mm rotors. But for bigger rotor sizes, there is no good way to make Flat Mount brakes work. Most tandems get 203 mm rotors and should get MTB style post mount brakes.

Because those mounts are ISO, you will just need a simple ISO-to-Post adapter for whatever rotor size you want. They're front/rear specific:

https://www.competitivecyclist.com/s...brake-adaptors

The ISO mounts are smart because there is no threading so if you mess up the threads it's on an $8 adapter not a $8000 frame.

You should be able to mix your SRAM road levers with SRAM hydraulic MTB post mount brakes.

^^ voice of reason. Thank you.

[pdmtong]

Originally Posted by Pegoready

To anyone saying this frame/fork should have been built for flat mounts, I disagree. Flat Mount calipers are native to 140 mm rotors and you can get adapters for 160 mm rotors. But for bigger rotor sizes, there is no good way to make Flat Mount brakes work. Most tandems get 203 mm rotors and should get MTB style post mount brakes.

Because those mounts are ISO, you will just need a simple ISO-to-Post adapter for whatever rotor size you want. They're front/rear specific:

https://www.competitivecyclist.com/s...brake-adaptors

The ISO mounts are smart because there is no threading so if you mess up the threads it's on an $8 adapter not a $8000 frame.

You should be able to mix your SRAM road levers with SRAM hydraulic MTB post mount brakes.

exactly...I was thinking should have been flat BUT flat only is native 140 with adapter for 160...and I would want 203/180 on a tandem