Squirt on hot waxed chains

[joevers]

Silca lube is better for this IMO. It's not too messy and comes off very easy with hot water, and back in the crock pot it goes. I wax a lot of customers chains at my shop and the ones that are training and racing heavily or don't live close by do the hot wax every 500-1000 miles and use Silca drip in between. Smoove and Squirt I'm sure are nice but are not very kind to the wax in our crock pot IME.

[Upcountry]

I have seven or eight chains that I wax in batches and rotate through my stable. I'd estimate that I put 300 miles on them between full strip and re-waxing, less if they've been on the gravel bike. With my eye on a few multi-day events that ended up getting cancelled, I started playing around with extending that distance. I've had pretty good results with the Silca Super Secret used on top of a waxed chain. I'll just wipe down the waxed chain with a microfiber cloth to remove the loose flakes and/or dirt, and then apply a good coating of the Super Secret and give it a few hours to absorb in and dry. This has worked well at giving me an extra few days of riding on the chain.

Additionally, I have been running a mix of MSW and cheap Parafin wax for years, as weaponsgrade and muttley mentioned doing... I bet I'm at 50/50 now. I can't imagine going back to wet lubes. I understand how fussy it seems if you're used to having one chain, that is on the bike, and that you clean and lube occasionally. But with that, I doubt that most of us clean those wet lube chains very well, nor very frequently. If you buy yourself an extra chain or two, and do them in batches, even with 10-12hours a week of riding, you're only waxing chains once a month, and you're three chains will last for several years. So I would say that you're most likely saving money in the end, with about 10 hours of extra "work" a year.

[weaponsgrade]

Originally Posted by Ken Robb

I have been so happy with chain lubes like Rock n' Roll, White Lightning, etc. for my riding on and off road in SoCal that I can't see why I would mess with hot wax. What am I missing?

There’s tons of opinions on it but the benefit for me after having been waxing for the past two years is not having to deal with oily rags or grease stains in the car.

[weaponsgrade]

Originally Posted by joevers

Silca lube is better for this IMO. It's not too messy and comes off very easy with hot water, and back in the crock pot it goes. I wax a lot of customers chains at my shop and the ones that are training and racing heavily or don't live close by do the hot wax every 500-1000 miles and use Silca drip in between. Smoove and Squirt I'm sure are nice but are not very kind to the wax in our crock pot IME.

Awesome, thanks for the data points. I think I’ll give Silca a try. Each of my gravel, road, and mtn bikes has two chains that I’ll rotate through. I seem to get the least mileage out of the mtn chain, followed by the gravel, and then the road though most of my rides lately have been either mtn or gravel. I’d say I’m averaging about 125 miles on the mtn and 200 miles on the gravel.

[jimoots]

Just chiming in that Silca Super Secret in the bottle is good for this.

I have recently tried the Super Secret tub, i.e.

1. Fully strip new chain of lube (I used the ZFC process - few minutes in turps, then agitated turps bath x 2, then agitated metho bath x 2)
2. Place chain in tub of SS
3. Allow to dry 24h

I've then just kept the chain clean with warm water and soap, topping up with super secret from a bottle. Has lasted 500km fine, with top-ups every 2-3 days (200km or so) unless it's a wet ride and I clean/top-up immediately.

The hardest part with the whole process is just the initial strip/clean (as well as cleaning my drivetrain, I was on NFS and synergetic previously). Everything else is pretty simple and day to day is significantly cleaner than dealing with an oil based lube.

I'd previously used squirt, the one challenge with Super Secret vs Squirt is that Super secret is 'slippery'. It pays to follow the super secret directions when topping up - not going overboard with the stuff and massaging into the chain with your fingers is key I have found.

[BdaGhisallo]

Originally Posted by weaponsgrade

There’s tons of opinions on it but the benefit for me after having been waxing for the past two years is not having to deal with oily rags or grease stains in the car.

Indeed. I have found the greatest benefit of waxing chains is how clean the bike stays. My bike simply doesn't ever get that dirty without the chain flinging wet oil around. A simple quick wash with soap and water is all it takes to get the drivetrain sparkling. I no longer need to brush and scrub is with degreaser to get the oil based gunk out after a ride in the rain.

My bike washing routine now takes all of 5 minutes. Over the course of a year, the time I save there easily outweighs the added time at the beginning to completely strip and prep a few chains for waxing.

Like others have said, I won't ever be going back to wet lube.

[LancasterPA]

Originally Posted by kytyree

I use Smoove after I put a newly waxed chain on to add just a bit to the connector link since I usually need to scrape off some wax to fit them to the chain.

I would use it if I needed to lube a chain but didn't have a fresh waxed spare but haven't actually needed to do so yet.

Same here. I tried Squirt but found it attracted grit and road grim, so switched to Smoove and like the result. My issue with Smoove is the nozzle clogs very easily (don’t touch the chain and hold upright when finished and squeeze the bottle). I’ve used it as a lube for 200k+ gravel events and it seems to work.

[JWB475]

Originally Posted by joevers

Silca lube is better for this IMO. It's not too messy and comes off very easy with hot water, and back in the crock pot it goes. I wax a lot of customers chains at my shop and the ones that are training and racing heavily or don't live close by do the hot wax every 500-1000 miles and use Silca drip in between. Smoove and Squirt I'm sure are nice but are not very kind to the wax in our crock pot IME.

Same here, I have a few chains in rotation w/Molten Speed Wax hot wax, and will periodically add some Silca Super Secret Chain lube to them, rub it in with my fingers and call it good. So far it has been working great and has been extending the life of my waxed chains. If I have a race coming up I will usually throw on a new chain...

[joshatsilca]

I'll post the ZeroFrictionCycling data here for all to see in terms of all the various brands mentioned here. We have also been doing quite a lot of testing on using SuperSecret over top of our hot melt and are finding that hot waxing every 1000km with SuperSecret 'top offs' every 200-250km, are providing equivalent wear performance to hot waxing every 300km. Plus, the SuperSecret really keeps things quiet!!

[Ronsonic]

Originally Posted by NHAero

I don't do hot waxing but I've been using Squirt and it keeps my chains clean and they seem to wear noticeably more slowly than when I used the various other lubes I've used. I'm pretty frequent with lubing - the MTB gets it after every ride, the road bikes more like every three rides. Even so, the first 4 oz bottle lasted me 2 years over several bikes - money well worth spending.

MTB gets Squirt every ride and it works great since I don't ride in wet with it. Bad for the trails, the bike and my mood. Road bikes get oil since I will take them into a rain.

[dscurt]

I’ve had good results with Gulf Wax, rotating/waxing every 250-350Km once the rollers and pins start looking bare.

I’d like to hear the experience of others that have used Gulf as well as industry specific wax, any preference or perceived improvement?

I’m also curious who waxes Campagnolo. Switching over from Shimano and I’ve had good luck reusing the original quick link quite a few times. Seems Sram’s Eagle Link is the answer for waxing those tight tolerance Record groups.

[JMacII]

Originally Posted by dscurt

I’ve had good results with Gulf Wax, rotating/waxing every 250-350Km once the rollers and pins start looking bare.

I’d like to hear the experience of others that have used Gulf as well as industry specific wax, any preference or perceived improvement?

I’m also curious who waxes Campagnolo. Switching over from Shimano and I’ve had good luck reusing the original quick link quite a few times. Seems Sram’s Eagle Link is the answer for waxing those tight tolerance Record groups.

+1. What’s the best way to make a Campy 11 or 12 speed chain removable?

[joosttx]

Originally Posted by joshatsilca

I'll post the ZeroFrictionCycling data here for all to see in terms of all the various brands mentioned here. We have also been doing quite a lot of testing on using SuperSecret over top of our hot melt and are finding that hot waxing every 1000km with SuperSecret 'top offs' every 200-250km, are providing equivalent wear performance to hot waxing every 300km. Plus, the SuperSecret really keeps things quiet!!

On the melt wax. I tried AB wax and was disappointed with it compared to Molten.although data isn’t comparing “feeling” it’s nice to see the data aligned with my impressions.

[weiwentg]

Originally Posted by weaponsgrade

I've read that Squirt can be used as a "top off" for hot waxed chains between waxing intervals. I'm assuming that means I can use Squirt between hot chain wax intervals WITHOUT having to go through the whole initial process of degreasing and striping the chain clean again when I do another hot wax. Correct? I'm looking for a way to keep the chain lubricated on trips without having to take my slow cooker with me or pack an extra waxed chain.

One really minor point since we bumped the thread. I don’t know that Squirt has any molybdenum or tungsten disulfide. Those act as friction modifiers. The older formulation of MSW used MoS2. Silca uses WS2, and I think that MSW is switching to WS2 and also ditching PTFE.

If you used a WS2-based melt wax, I think it’s probably better to use a drip wax containing WS2. I am pretty sure Silca isn’t the only party making such a drip wax.

If you were using straight paraffin, then yeah, it doesn’t matter. Also, nothing is really going to explode, it’s just that WS2 is said to impregnate the surface of the metal and make it really slippery, so I would just match the friction modifiers because I’m me.

[weiwentg]

Originally Posted by joshatsilca

…

About that graph, I’d been wondering about the Shimano chain grease. I knew Kerin was testing it so that he could tell people that there was now hard third party evidence that chain grease is bad (Friction Facts or Ceramicspeed published friction data on chain grease, though, and it is high friction).

It’s interesting that the chain grease showed low wear, but that he had to terminate the test due to chain suck. I know he adds dry contamination in block 2. I wonder if that was the cause?