The Search for a Carbon Bike that Feels like a Metal Bike

[fa63]

The new Cannondale SS Evo is one of the smoothest riding carbon bikes I have tried.

[veloduffer]

Of all the carbon frames that I've ridden, Parlee Z models were close to my titanium bikes. You could try a Z4 or Z5 pretty cheap on Ebay these days, but they are rim brake models.

[RyanH]

Originally Posted by mtechnica

Sounds like your mind is already made up on the aethos. Don't understand the crumpton fixation. don't understand the arbitrary weight goal. If you weigh 155lb and put out good watts 1-2lb doesn't matter. Also don't understand why a tetra isn't towards the top of your should try list. Don't want to try older small tube bikes because reasons. Don't understand picking a gravel bike for road use to begin with but it was an interesting idea, it just seems like the odds of it handling well and not being stiff AF are very low.

I'm on the fence for the Aethos and am only even considering it because I was surprised at how good the Crux is. I bought the Crux to experiment with wider tires (my T3 can only take 28mm actual) to better identify what I want my 2023 Rob English build to be (32mm tire road bike? 650b road bike?). So, the Crux was a platform to dabble with wider tires. It wasn't intended to be a keeper but holy smokes did it impress.

I am not writing off Calfee, I just never really looked into it. Right now, my mind is either on: custom Carl Strong Ti bike with long chainstays and slack HTA (going to be heavy) or Aethos. I started this thread in hopes that others know what I'm talking about and can suggest other options or direct me to stay with Ti.

Someone else above asked about tires, pressure and other things about me. I mentioned the tires and sizes in the OP but I run 28mm HOTN (turbo cottons) at 60/65 on the Crux (29.5mm measured) and 25mm Turbo Cottons (27.5mm measured) at 70/75 on the Litespeed (also have 28mm Pro Tour Veloflex tubs on Bontrager XXX wheels). I'm 155-160lbs, 5'9" and FTP around 320-330w. I ride an aggressive fit (usually bikes with 520-530mm stack and 380ish reach with a 140 stem) and like to ride fast.

I should add, for those that don't know me, I'm a moderator on WeightWeenies and a bit of a bike whore (connoisseur?). I have documented builds on around 29 bikes:

https://weightweenies.starbike.com/f...&submit=Search

On average, each of those builds has seen at least 500-1K miles so that I can get a full view of how they ride. I do a lot of A to B rides to make sure my impressions are not just in my head. I'm basically an unpaid bike reviewer at times. I stopped buying bikes when I managed to purchase my T3 back in end of 2019 and it's been a blissful two years of not dabbling with bikes, but here I am again, scratching that itch again.

[rnhood]

I purchased my S-works Tarmac after my dealer gave it to me to try out for 3 days. I am sure Spec dealers still do this…I think. Of course it’s near impossible to find an Atheos in stock but, I would ask your dealer to order one so you can try it. Even if you decide against it, your dealer will likely have it sold in a week or less. Both the Atheos and Crux are hot tickets now, and in demand. It’s low risk on his part. But the chance of you not liking it a lot is probably somewhere between little and none.

[RyanH]

Last week I asked my Specialized dealer (Incycle) if I could demo one and they said they're not doing that due to limited availability and COVID. Womp womp.

I should probably call the Specialized store in Santa Monica.

[NHAero]

Some more peanut gallery thoughts;
- what size is your Crux? The small sizes have really long trail and slack HTA, so that may be what you like in descending. The 49 is 72mm and 70.5 HTA. I would hate how that bike feels on pavement, but I grew up on quick handling bikes and that's what I like.
- Dave Kirk's analogy of the baseball bat breaks down for me, because in the case of the bat, the human is in direct contact with the shock transmitted by the device via the hands. On a bike, the wheels and tires intercede - even the cranks and pedals and shoes, in your specific case of your feet.
- You are a very capable weight weenie (I always like to read how you build your bikes) and I wonder if the solution is a custom Ti frame by someone who will get excited by your goal of 6.8 kg. Maybe a Seven Evergreen XX?

You should be able to spot a carbon frame a pound and still hit 15 pounds, I'd think.

Keep us posted please!

[lavi]

Great thread with great contributors!

OP, I've read the thread here on your Litespeed (good thread!). I've also read your thread on WW regarding the Crux project. I was stoked to see that project as it spoke to me for a few reasons: 1) Spec has been killing it lately. 2) I think riding 650b/42 on the road is a good thing. I have a few bikes where I switch back and forth b/t 700c and 650b. I may not have the same high end velocity on 650/42, but I certainly have a great timing doing it.

When I first read this thread, I hadn't just yet put together you and the WW thread, I thought "Aethos".

However, my opinion is that this, while a worthy topic, will land with it splitting hairs. What you feel with your Litespeed and Crux (or possibly an Aethos) will remain ever so slightly different. Not that you're really looking to do it, or maybe you are...but the difference will never be fully reconciled.

I do find it interesting that with these two bikes of yours, you are still feeling like the Ti has the more "comfy" ride. That something about Ti does a better job with those hard hits that make your feet hurt. It's also liberating (for me) as it lets me know that I'm on a good path with my current Ti bike...and now maybe stop drooling over the Crux. My bike ended up being a Crux....but....bonus....custom to me and done in Ti.

On to the salient stuff after rambling. I had a Aethos S-Works. It was a fantastic bike. Cannot say a bad thing about it. Did it ride like a nice metal bike? Nope. What I mainly felt with the Aethos was its light, flickable handling, and it's instantaneous carbon get up and go (aka bb stiffness. In a good way.) In the end, I sold it as I wanted something with the versatility you were seeking with your Crux. I wanted a bike to roll 700/32,35 as it's main form with options for 650b raditude. Ok. Maybe not the exact same reasoning as you...but pretty close. I now have a Hampsten Ti Strada Bianca. It has the zing and lovely ride of Ti. However, as it was built by folks that know what the heck they are doing, it also has very good immediacy (power transfer and stiffness).


Lastly, keep your Litespeed thread going here. Please also post up your Crux to have that convo here as well. Many of us, myself included, dig the 2022 Crux.

[lavi]

Originally Posted by RyanH

Right now, my mind is either on: custom Carl Strong Ti bike with long chainstays and slack HTA (going to be heavy) or Aethos. I started this thread in hopes that others know what I'm talking about and can suggest other options or direct me to stay with Ti.

I certainly feel and know what you are talking about!

I think this is your answer: custom Ti!

If you have anywhere near the result I did, you will be giggling for many years.

[veloduffer]

Since the OP is thinking about a Carl Strong ti, he should talk to Carl who also makes custom carbon bikes under the Pursuit brand. That’s about as an informed opinion as you can get. Plus, the cost is about the same as a production Atheos and Crux but you get custom.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[fa63]

Knowing what I know about Ryan through his posts on here and WW, think custom Ti only works if it is something like the Seven 622 XX optimized for weight. Otherwise, I think an Aethos is probably a better option, or custom carbon. Or the new Cannondale SS Evo.

Originally Posted by lavi

I think this is your answer: custom Ti!

[nmrt]

i have always asked the question that the OP is asking. But as D. Kirk points out, metal bikes have their own unique feel. If you like that metal ride feel or the feel of carbon bikes, is a different matter. But in my mind, they ride very different. I have now given up on looking for a carbon bike that rides like my Ti bike. And I have begun to enjoy the carbon ride for what it is. Since, like the OP, i get beat up by carbon bikes (no matter which one i have tried), i only ride them for shorter rides.

Anyway, based on the poetry that the journalists were waxing on the aethos, i enamored by it, had to try it out. it was the s-works aethos and i rented it for a day with about 5000 or so feet of climbing.

in short, no, the aethos did not replicate the feel of my metal Ti bikes. None whatsoever. But it was the smoothest carbon bike I have ever ridden.

The other carbon bike that felt smooth to me was a Serotta Meivici.

[tuscanyswe]

Id go for a lugged carbon like a parlee or colnago or similar.

Had a z3 that i liked a lot. Also looked a bit like steel tubing size wise which helps with that "retro feel"

[shoota]

Funny you bring this up. I recently came into a Parlee Z3 and after I rode it I described it to my friends as "light as carbon, smooth as steel". I had only ever ridden off the shelf carbon road bikes from Trek, Scott, and Cannondale before the Parlee and the difference is like night and day.

[benb]

Hmm.. I think I get what the OP is talking about.

My Trek Domane is a pillow for your butt and hands but beats the living daylights out of your feet.

I don't have a Ti bike ATM but I do have a Steel one and it does make sense. I had a Ti Serotta but it's been 10 years since I had it.

I don't necessarily think it's the material, but it's what the material the can or cannot be used for.

Carbon gets used for making massive BB areas and chainstays and there's an attempt to remove all flex. Maybe some flex in the BB helps with the feet. Modern carbon bikes intended for comfort seem to try to build the flex into the top of the bike and remove it all from the bottom of the bike.

FWIW I use the same shoes on both bikes and gave up on carbon soles, my shoes are not super stiff.

The solution to me might be not ride one of the carbon bikes or look for one without the massive BB area and give up some of that "amazing lateral stiffness" in pedaling. Maybe that's what people like about the Parlee being mentioned? I've had 3 Carbon bikes, the first one did not yet have the massive oversized BB area yet and definitely had more of the feeling of the metal bikes in that area of the bike.

[drewskey]

TIME frames are the only carbon frame that I’ve thumped and it thumped me back.

They really do have a different process than every other bike manufacturer.