Road discs for a chicken-$H!T rider

[avalonracing]

It's only a matter of time before manufacturers are pushing high-end ceramic brakes (racecar tech) and if you aren't riding that you might as well be on (gasp) a steel bike with aluminum wheels.

[cribbit]

Someone should make an airbrake (parachute, streamer, etc) for long descents.

[Kontact]

Originally Posted by cribbit

Someone should make an airbrake (parachute, streamer, etc) for long descents.

Unzip your jersey and sit up.

[kevinvc]

I am also not a particularly confident / aggressive descender. My road bike has aluminum clinchers and rim brakes. I try to modulate without riding the brakes too hard. I have never had an issue on dry roads of not having enough stopping power. One concern I would have if I switched to disks on the road is that the extra stopping power could make it really easy to lock up, which is a more likely occurrence than over-heating. The closest I ever came to blowing a curve and winding up in a world of trouble was because I braked too hard on an s-curve and had the tires lock and skid. Discs would have just made that even worse.

What's helped me is using a wider tire with lower pressure. My perception is that the extra contact surface makes it hold the road better. As others have said, I've found that the more often I do this kind of riding, the better I get at relaxing and cornering more smoothly.

I'm still not a need for speed kind of rider, and I often enjoy the climb more than the descent, but I'm definitely better and more confident at it than I was a few years ago.

Good luck.

[JimmyTango]

Originally Posted by kevinvc

I have never had an issue on dry roads of not having enough stopping power. One concern I would have if I switched to disks on the road is that the extra stopping power could make it really easy to lock up, which is a more likely occurrence than over-heating. The closest I ever came to blowing a curve and winding up in a world of trouble was because I braked too hard on an s-curve and had the tires lock and skid. Discs would have just made that even worse.



Good luck.

Have you ever ridden a bike with good discs (hydro)? I ask because I hear this refrain about "ultimate stopping power" from rim brakes being enough, and therefore discs being too much, but in my experience hydro discs aren't better because of stopping power, but because of the added control. I've ridden MTB, CX, and road bikes all with rim and with disc brakes and in all three disciplines the rim brakes provide plenty of stopping power (more than enough to lock up any wheel on any surface) but the hydro discs are far superior** thanks to the modulation and sensitivity that they allow. The ability to control exactly how much braking force is applied is a huge part of cornering in the dirt and on the road, and the better you can control the brakes, the better you can control your speed, the less likely you are of locking up and losing traction.

I'd say to the OP that in my experience, hydro discs can only help you feel like a more confident descender. Sure, you have to learn proper cornering technique and line selection, but the added control that discs provide definitely make it easier to control the controllables.


**far superior when compared to my experience with mini V or canti brakes, and with calipers on carbon rims and in any kind of wet conditions... maybe only slightly superior when compared to good calipers on alloy rims in the dry, but still superior even in this context to me because of the lever feel.

[likebikes]

Originally Posted by cribbit

Someone should make an airbrake (parachute, streamer, etc) for long descents.

plenty of tandems (esp. those used for touring use) have 3 brakes- front, rear, and a drum brake controlled by a friction shifter.

[doomridesout]

I have a "road" bike with R685 disc that feels sublime with 32c tires going up and down big hills. I recommend something like that. I have to admit I'm eyeballing the Canyon Endurace...

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by JimmyTango

Have you ever ridden a bike with good discs (hydro)? I ask because I hear this refrain about "ultimate stopping power" from rim brakes being enough, and therefore discs being too much, but in my experience hydro discs aren't better because of stopping power, but because of the added control. I've ridden MTB, CX, and road bikes all with rim and with disc brakes and in all three disciplines the rim brakes provide plenty of stopping power (more than enough to lock up any wheel on any surface) but the hydro discs are far superior** thanks to the modulation and sensitivity that they allow. The ability to control exactly how much braking force is applied is a huge part of cornering in the dirt and on the road, and the better you can control the brakes, the better you can control your speed, the less likely you are of locking up and losing traction.

I'd say to the OP that in my experience, hydro discs can only help you feel like a more confident descender. Sure, you have to learn proper cornering technique and line selection, but the added control that discs provide definitely make it easier to control the controllables.


**far superior when compared to my experience with mini V or canti brakes, and with calipers on carbon rims and in any kind of wet conditions... maybe only slightly superior when compared to good calipers on alloy rims in the dry, but still superior even in this context to me because of the lever feel.

This I do not believe. Rim brakes modulate just fine and in a panic situation, the more powerful brake (with less hand force at the lever) is the one that will be more prone to lock up.

[JimmyTango]

Originally Posted by MikeD

This I do not believe. Rim brakes modulate just fine and in a panic situation, the more powerful brake (with less hand force at the lever) is the one that will be more prone to lock up.

I guess I should qualify that when I say “modulate” I don’t just mean “touchier” or simply more sensitive... I mean easier to modulate. Like, more control over how much (or how little) force you’re squeezing out of the brake. I know on my bikes I have to be more careful on my rim brakes to not go from “hard braking” to “locked up” because it is a more finicky threshold than hard braking on my discs.

Have you found hydro discs to be grabbier than rim brakes?

[John H.]

I think your concerns are valid, and I think that speed control is one of the main benefits of disc brakes.
They do a better job "speed checking" than a rim brake, and it wheels better because the pull is not on the rim.

Originally Posted by sfscott

While liking to descend, I am by no means good/confident at it, especially when one throws in steep pitches, cars and lots of switchbacks.

I tend to be on the brakes a lot, and with carbon wheels (tubular) am always conscious of heat buildup, irrational(?) fears of glue giving up, etc,

I'm planning to be in the Rockies a lot in the summer, want to bring out a bike but was wondering if, for my middle-aged, novice skills, discs would be a good option.

And yes, I know this is a campy v. shimano topic with a bit of "learn to descend better, dude" thrown in, but actually want some thoughtful feedback. Have not gotten into gravel but could be a new thing once I learn the area better. Figuring I'm on the road or on the MTB.

[simonov]

Originally Posted by JimmyTango

Have you found hydro discs to be grabbier than rim brakes?

I have with Shimano R685 compared with a variety of rim brake + wheel combinations.

[JimmyTango]

Originally Posted by simonov

I have with Shimano R685 compared with a variety of rim brake + wheel combinations.

Hmm, ok interesting. My experience with rim and brake combos, in terms of purely being prone to "unintended skidding" have been (from most likely to lock-up when I'm just trying to stop at the top of the list to easiest to control at the bottom):

1. Old school shimano V brakes on ceramic rims on 26" MTB tires
2. TRP 8.4 mini V brakes on alloy rims on CX tires
3. BB7 mechanical discs on a CX bike
4. Force caliper brakes on carbon rims with ****ty pads road tires
5. Frog-leg canti brakes on alloy rims with CX tires
6. Force caliper brakes on carbon rims with nice black prince pads road tires
7. Force caliper brakes on alloy rims road tires
8. Force CX1 discs (160mm rotors) on CX tires
9. Shimano XT discs (180mm rotors) on 27.5x2.3 tires

I'd say the scariest for me was trying to descend twisty roads on my road race bike with carbon clinchers and brake pads that were too hard... I would brake hard into corners but had a really hard time controlling the difference between just dragging my brakes and pulling on the levers so hard that I would initiate a skid. This was mostly remideid by getting softer pads, but it has never been a problem with hydro discs for me. YMMV and all that I guess.

All I know is: I can lock-up and skid any bike I'm on with no problems, so to me the added feel of hydro discs (I think it is more about the way fluid translates lever power more than than the actual discs dong the braking, maybe hydro rim brakes are equally as awesome), along with not having to worry about melting rims (obviously not an advantage if running alloy rims) make me pretty set on a disc for my next road bike. They just make me feel more in control.