Going Tubular

#1 12-12-2003, 09:21 PM

As the new year rolls around, a friend of mine asked me if I was going to start riding tubulars next year. And, if I did, if I'd have to go to the shop every time I flatted out.

Hold it...(other than being indignant about his apparent view of my mechanical abilities...this is the question that's been stuck in the back of my mind since the forum went down. )

How hard can it be to glue a tire on a rim?

If you flat out, how difficult is roadside repair? (I can't see carrying more than one spare on an afternoon ride.)

What flat ratio do tubulars have to clinchers (sounds like a silly question, but just how delicate are tubulars? I haven't had a flat on my Continentals in something like 4000 miles...and I ride some mean streets around Detroit.)

How much repair material do you have to carry with you "just in case" (say to repair two flats). I'm not necessarily a weight weenie, but I like a uncluttered bike.

Thanks in advance for the enlightenment
Ginger

#2 12-12-2003, 09:23 PM

Style question:
Do I hafta ride with a frame pump if I'm riding tubulars, or can I stick with my Co2?

Ahneida Ride · #3 12-12-2003, 09:28 PM

Ginger,

Ride with me, I've got the trusty zefal on my Legend.

I think that is the only reason people ride with me.

jerk · #4 12-12-2003, 09:34 PM

hey-
it's easier to change a flat on a tubular than a clincher. rip the tire off, take your spare which is old and crappy and pre-stretched and has some crappy remnants of glue on it and put it on. inflate, don't corner too crazy on the rest of the ride....buy a new tire....stretch it for a little while....pull your spare off and put it back under your seat rails with an old toe-strap.... take your wheel....put a thin layer of glue on top of the old glue....clean off the old glue iif there is a ****ton...(use your own judgement)....inflate your new tire just enough so it sits with the base tape up, put some glue on the base tape.....go make a sandwich...eat the sandwich....complain to your wife about how glue makes you high....put some more glue on the rim, take your tiire deflate it just enough that it has some form and the base tape is facing in.....place the valve stem in the hole. push the tire at the valve stem against your chest and push the rest of the tirew on....even a retarded person like the jerk can do it. so can you....then go drink a six pack...and voila you are drunk and high on glue!

terry · #5 12-13-2003, 08:30 AM

it's not as intimidating as people would have you think. there is a learning curve (short) with little tricks and what not but it's very satisfying and the ride is still better than any clincher i've ever tried-i don't and won't put clinchers on my bikes, no matter what anyone says in my mind they are smoother, corner better, cheaper, more durable. one caveat-just buy good ones-never the cheapos-they don't last and the tubular feel is not there. for agood deals-conti sprinters for $33 at labicicletta-can't beat that deal with a stick.

#6 12-13-2003, 09:03 AM

Quality tubular tires are great to ride on. Cheap ones are not worth considering.

Gluing a tire on a rim is not hard at all, but it does take more time than installing a clincher. Ther first time you mount a pair of tubulars on a new set of wheels, it could take days instead of an hour.

Step 1. Prestretch tire on rim (30 minutes to do, wait 2 days).
Step 2. Remove tire, clean rim, put down a layer of glue on rim, wait a day.
Step 3. Put down another layer of glue on rim, wait a day.
Step 4. Put down another layer of glue on rim, a thin layer of glue on tire, wait 45 minutes.
Step 4. Stretch tire onto rim. Inflate to 30/40 psi. Straighten tire on rim.
Step 5. Inflate tire to 120psi. Wait 12 hours.
Step 6. Go ride.

The likelyhood of getting a flat on the road with a quality tubular is about the same as with a quality clincher, or less. But if you get a flat, you remove the old tire, strech on your spare, pump it up (CO2 is fine) and ride away. Total time to change a tire, less than 5 minutes.

The only gotcha in the process is that getting the old tire off. It can be difficult at times. It helps if you have a plastic tire lever to help you get the first part of the tire off. Once you get the tire off in one spot, the rest comes off without a problem.

After installing the spare, you do not have the luxury of riding like a maniac. While the tire will be fine for riding, descending the alps through a series of switchbacks at full speed will get you into trouble! The tire is secure, but it is not as secure as a properly glued tire.

When you get home, take off the spare and glue it on properly. I have ridden a spare without properly doing the re-glue for a month. Not recommened, but I did not have a problem either.

Unlike most people, my spare tire is always a new (or semi-new), but pre-stretched/glued tire. The way I figure it, if I do flat, I want to have new rubber on the road, not an old tire. I can count on one hand how often I have had to change a tire on the road and I have been riding tubulars on and off since '74. But if I am going on a very long ride, I will also include a patch kit. Patching a tubular tire on the road is not fun, but it can be done in less than 30 minutes if necessary. In all my years of riding, it has never happened that I have had two flats on tubulars on the same ride, but I assume it could happen.

I always fix my tires if they flat unless they are old. It takes less than 30 minutes to patch a tubular.

I am currently using Continental Competition tubulars. They are a dependable tire that rides very well. They are a PITA to mount when they are new. But after they are stretched, they are a joy to use. One of the nice things about them is that they do not lose air presssure like some of the other tubulars. Most tubulars use latex tubes, which are great, but they lose air pressure very quickly. At least with the conti's, the pressure holds for a number of days.

In today's world, tubulars are a luxury item. You need the luxury of time and the econmic means to purchase quality tires and mount them. If you have little money and little time for the rituals of mounting tubulars, you are best to stay away. But if you can afford the time and money to set up a bike with quality tubular tires, you will be rewarded with a great ride, grins and easy on road tire changes.

A good web posting on the subject can be found at :
http://www.bsn.com/Cycling/tubulars.html

A tubular and clincher rider.

dnovo · #7 12-13-2003, 09:11 AM

Thank you for the first simple, comprehensive primer on how to change out a tubie. I might try it now, as I have been lusting after a set of the new 202s for my TT ride.

But having said that, and having to change more than one clincher flat, it still seems like more work and more time. I don't claim to be Mr. Lightning at changing a clincher, but, stop, yank the wheel, pull out my Quick Lever, pop off the punctured tube, find out what caused it (usually a pinch, sometimes a bit of glass) check the inside of the rim, put in a new tube, seat the tube and then put the rim of the clincher back on with the same Quick lever, inflate, put the wheel back on and off you go. Seems like the same or perhaps less time than the temporary fix you describe with the tubie, and no need to ride gingerly with an unglued replacement tubie.

Am I wrong? Dave N.

#8 12-13-2003, 09:19 AM

But that's because I'm Ginger...

That doesn't sound too bad so far. I only ask about the two flat issue because I have had to change two flats on the bike on more than one ocasion (road debris on a busy road, no avoidance at speed))

I suppose the first time I changed a flat on the road it would have to be a new spare...

This is all good information.

See? This is why I missed the forum!

#9 12-13-2003, 10:10 AM

Fixing a flat is different. One is not easier than the other.

Personally I can change a tubular faster than I can fix a clincher. But I have seen some people change a clincher very quickly as well. It really depends on the tire/rim combination of the clincher. Some are very easy, others are not so easy. But the same can be said about tubular tires. If the tubular has not been prestretched, you are going be saying some not very nice things on the side of the road.

When the weather is cool or cold, changing a tubular is going to be easier than changing a clincher. I hate messing with tire irons when my hands are cold. On a warm day, it is much less of an issue.

One of the advantages of changing a tubular is that you are changing the tire and tube together. If a clicher tire is destroyed, typically most riders are stuck, where the tubular rider is on his/her way.

The tubular/clicher debate has been going on for a long time. You have people on either side. At times it gets 'religious', where people argue their personal tire beliefs as though it is the holy grail.

I have wheels mounted with both types of tires and appreciate the virtues of both. Neither is the 'right' way, only different ways of cycling. There are times that I want to ride the tubs, other times when I want to ride the clinchers.

When I am out on a solo ride through the hills, I take the tubs. I like the feel of the road and, at least for me, if I do flat, I know I can change a tire very quickly. When I am out on a group ride, I will take either the tubs or the clichers. On a supported century ride, I will take the clichers; because if I do flat, the support staff will fix them for me!

The feel of the tubular tire is indeed different than the feel of a quality clincher. Some people will never feel the difference, others will praise it as being the best thing around. I am in the middle, but do prefer the 'ride' quality of a tub. It is kind of like changing your tires on your car. You may or may or not detect any difference, and if you do detect a difference, it may or may not matter very much.

The bottom line is that 99.9% of wheels are mounted with clincher tires. And more than 99.999% of the worlds population will never ride a Serotta. But there is a small percentage of cyclists that appreciate the ride of a tubular tire and/or a Serotta. If you choose to use them, you may like them or you may not.

I like them. My life, at times, is very, very busy and time for myself is a luxury. When I am out for a ride through the hills, I try to maximize the experience in many small ways. One of those ways is riding on tubs. It just completes the experience. Nothing better than a big smile as you ride through the hills.

flydhest · #10 12-13-2003, 01:06 PM

I'm pro-tubular (and I vote) and would make the following minor additions.

First, "oldman" said stretching the rim takes 30 minutes to do and then you wait. I'd say he's being a bit generous on the first part. You can mount a new tire in a commercial break if you are a TV watcher. New tires are a bit of a bear to pull on, but I think 30 minutes is a bit of an over-statement. I have always wondered if there is a problem stretching tubulars on clincher rims. I have only one set of tubulars and so to stretch means not to ride.

I would like to reinforce the point made about replacing tubulars replaces tires and tubes. More often than it ought to happen, I've seen people replace tubes in clinchers and have the second go flat. I have flatted on tubulars once, but I have also had a tire sidewall get a cut longer than you could boot. In this case, you're SOL with a clincher, but still have a spare with a tubular.

I consider myself reasonably fast at changing tires of both kinds, and hands down, a tubular on the side of the road is faster. Of course, if it takes me 10 minutes to change a tire, it's because it's a nice day, so even if the tubular is half the time, it's not much time with either . . . unless you're chasing back on a group.

I think the "ride gingerly" afterward should be qualified. This just means don't take a curvy descent at 45 mile an hour. Most other riding isn't really affected. You have glue on the rim, glue on the spare, and lots of pressure holding the tire on.

MA, I think CO2 cartridges go well with tubulars. Particularly since tubulars can take (and are safer at) higher pressures.

93KgBike · #11 02-22-2019, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93KgBike

All the stretching and gluing and waiting for tubulars is not made up for by the marginally superior weight/acceleration/float/etc. I might feel on the very best $$$$ tub. Flatting on the road requires fixing the new tire and then doing it all over again, properly, once I get home. And riding with dirty sticky fingers is distracting.

All the mess and mess and mess of tubeless is not made up for by the uh, well, let's see... by the, um, hmm.... Flatting in the woods requires probably using the emergency innertube in my bag anyway. And then making a big sticky mess getting the tire fixed once I get back home.

Clinchers are simple, they work great and feel as good as tubulars for the short portion of my rides where, "my tires feel so," is even a thought I might have.

I haven't had a flat in years on my commuter clincher Schwalbe Marathon Supreme's. They wear down to slicks before they flat. I have the rare road flat on the various brands on my road bikes, but once it's fixed, it's done.

Tubulars are great, but they peaked in the late 70's or 80's imho, because clinchers and inner tubes (and clincher wheels) have gotten so good and are factors easier to use for DIYers.

But I'll probably switch back to them when the kids go off to college.

redir · #12 02-22-2019, 03:41 PM

If you glue them on real good they are a PIA to take off on the side of the road. I liek to glue them on good but there is a point where it's strong enough to stay on the rim when cornering and easy enough to rip off... at a risk of course. I glue them on good and use tire levers.