Wax vs "oil based" lubricants and use applications

[jimoots]

Originally Posted by Bob Ross

Crock pots? Heat guns? Caustic chemicals?

Chains and cassettes are consumables. They're like the 9-volt batteries in your smoke alarms, you're supposed to replace them at regular intervals. Life's too short to spend time mucking about with bags of boiling wax just to save ~$35/year.

It's a bit more than $35 a year if you're doing the time on the bike. Cassettes are getting frightfully expensive, with waxing you're potentially getting 10,000km out of a chain before it hits the wear marker and then multiply that out for the cassette. And if you're on an AXS groupset, the powermeter is integrated with the chainrings... again, frightfully expensive stuff.

The watt savings are also relatively significant if you take racing seriously. As significant as a nice race tyre.

Not for everyone but also it's not entirely irrational.

[drewskey]

Originally Posted by jimmy-moots

... with waxing you're potentially getting 10,000km out of a chain before it hits the wear marker and then multiply that out for the cassette.

Yeah you could get even more than that too, so that 25$ bottle of Silca Super Secret is worth its weight in gold.

https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/lubetesting/

[joosttx]

I probably have over a 1000 miles on this chain. I wax it and supplement with Squirt which it starts making noise. Needless to say its not the most regimented protocol. Anyway, I got curious about the wear question and bought a digital chain wear tool. I took the measurement tonight and I have to say I am very impressed how well the chain is holding up after a 1000 or so miles for MTB riding.

[Dave]

At the minimum, that digital gauge needs to be zeroed against a new chain of the same model. If checked in several places, you'll find more deviation on a new chain than that picture shows, just by moving the gauge to a different section of chain.


That type of measurement adds roller wear to actual pitch elongation and roller wear, mainly on the ID, can be quite large.

A 12 inch precision rule, placed on the edge of a pin will cover the pin at the opposite end. When that covered pin gets close to 1/2 exposed, you have a true 0.5% increase in pitch.

[joosttx]

Originally Posted by Dave

At the minimum, that digital gauge needs to be zeroed against a new chain of the same model. If checked in several places, you'll find more deviation on a new chain than that picture shows, just by moving the gauge to a different section of chain.


That type of measurement adds roller wear to actual pitch elongation and roller wear, mainly on the ID, can be quite large.

A 12 inch precision rule, placed on the edge of a pin will cover the pin at the opposite end. When that covered pin gets close to 1/2 exposed, you have a true 0.5% increase in pitch.

Yeah, I have several chains of the same model. I looked at a chain I probably have 50 miles of of use, it’s reading exactly the same. I took measurements on several parts of the chain too. It’s a new tool so I was playing with it and surprised at the first result.

Isn’t roller wear and pitch enlongation signs of chain wear? Does it really matter what the wear is as long as the wear doesn’t mask the other wear?

[Dave]

Everything measured by the digital gauge is wear of some sort, but only the increase in the length between the pins is a change in pitch. Campy recommends a similar measurement because their chains tend to show little elongation, even when the rollers are shot and the side to side slop is huge. Extreme roller wear will cause new-chain skip too.

I avoid new-chain skip by using 3-4 chains in a rotation with each cassette.

[one60]

curious if the chain needs to be mounted and under tension? I recall a suggestion that the measurement be taken on the top rather than the bottom (maybe the CyclingTips piece?).

in a sport/industry rife with 'standards', is there a best practice?

[weaponsgrade]

I'm using waxed chains across all my riding: mtn, road, gravel. It's been great not having to deal with greasy rags. I've got two chains for each bike that I rotate through. When time comes for a rewaxing, I boil the chain in water, dry it off, and put it back into the slow cooker.

[charliedid]

I decided to try some SILCA Synergetic wet lube. It showed up the other day and I have only just applied it to a bike. One thing I noticed immediately is that it has that satisfying wet lube slickness and has that audible change from chattery chain to quiet and slick.

I've been using NFS for a couple years and that is something that always struck me. I don't know if it's lack of a certain ingredient or what but it never did that. It never wet from chattery to slick smooth quiet you get from many wet lubes. It was certainly easy to keep things clean but I never felt like it was doing what I expected even if it was. Ignorance can be bliss and all that. Not saying it's a bad lube.

Curious how the Silca holds up over time.

[robertbb]

Zero Friction Cycling has a good comparison of all these things.

I'm trying Tungsten Gold at the moment... ZFC classifies it as a "next gen" wax based drip lube.

It works well and lasts a long time, but it's not as clean as my immersion-waxed chains were (I found a local supplier of food grade paraffin and used that in a hot pot for a while but it became tedious)

[charliedid]

Originally Posted by robertbb

Zero Friction Cycling has a good comparison of all these things.

I'm trying Tungsten Gold at the moment... ZFC classifies it as a "next gen" wax based drip lube.

It works well and lasts a long time, but it's not as clean as my immersion-waxed chains were (I found a local supplier of food grade paraffin and used that in a hot pot for a while but it became tedious)

Who makes?

[Charles M]

This is a bit like "What material makes the best Bike Frame"...

There's a BIG difference in the quality of lubes in these categories...

[robertbb]

Originally Posted by charliedid

Who makes?

Tungsten? It's by Tru-Tension.

https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/p...-weather-lube/

[zennmotion]

Originally Posted by charliedid

I decided to try some SILCA Synergetic wet lube. It showed up the other day and I have only just applied it to a bike. One thing I noticed immediately is that it has that satisfying wet lube slickness and has that audible change from chattery chain to quiet and slick.

I've been using NFS for a couple years and that is something that always struck me. I don't know if it's lack of a certain ingredient or what but it never did that. It never wet from chattery to slick smooth quiet you get from many wet lubes. It was certainly easy to keep things clean but I never felt like it was doing what I expected even if it was. Ignorance can be bliss and all that. Not saying it's a bad lube.

Curious how the Silca holds up over time.

I used to get that wet lube experience from chain saw bar lube thinned with a little OMS- did it for years and I thought the mess went along with the quiet. I stopped that messy nonsense and I've been on NFS for several years now, first the regular that came as a sample with my custom frame, then the odorless plus version that was a little lighter, now with the blue devil heavier version that's made for offroad and mud (wish I had it during my CX racing days when I used to spray my drivetrain with cooking spray over the lube to shed the mud, it worked but what a mess!), and I've just received new Beta version of the discontinued ne plus ultra (that's not yet for sale) and, a couple of hundred miles, I really like it as both lighter and even cleaner than the original. Sorry guys but waxing chains strikes me as a little OCD and precious-- insert eyeroll here.

[jimoots]

Originally Posted by zennmotion

I used to get that wet lube experience from chain saw bar lube thinned with a little OMS- did it for years and I thought the mess went along with the quiet. I've been on NFS for several years now, first the regular that came as a sample with my custom frame, then the odorless plus version that was a little lighter, now with the blue devil heavier version that's made for offroad and mud (wish I had it during my CX racing days when I used to spray my drivetrain with cooking spray over the lube to shed the mud, it worked but what a mess!), and I've just received new Beta version of the discontinued plus (that's not yet for sale) and, a couple of hundred miles, I really like it as both lighter and even cleaner than the original. Sorry guys but waxing chains strikes me as a little OCD and precious-- insert eyeroll here.

I'm trying NFS at the moment, it seems to be very clean. And is quiet. I think I like it.

Probably a little less maintenance than a wax based drip lube.... the waxy stuff I've used is a lot more painful to apply and remove.

I'm going to give Super Secret a shot and then from there will probably go to a immersion wax.