Please recommend some rim brake wheels and/or brake pads. Also, a story.

[mass_biker]

+1 on the HED Ardennes “Black”. I have a few versions of these, from the low profile ones (RA) to the more aero 4s and 5s. The RAs tip the scales at <1500gm. Light enough for me, and these are my go-to wheels when my pals and I do our annual ride on Skyline (Baron - that’s your neck of the woods, right?).

These are the best braking alloy (or any) rims that I have ever ridden - in good weather and bad. Super reliable, and they look the business on a nice steel bike.

The 4s and 5s are a little more portly (aluminum braking surface + carbon “fairing”) but have similar characteristics (albeit more aero/harder to spin-up). FWIW, I am always nervous about cross winds (nervous Nellie descender + 145lbs soaking wet) but have found the profile of the more aero HEDs to be very stable in the windy stuff if that’s a consideration.

I appreciate the suggestion of folks on this post re: brake pad choice - that’s the next round of optimization I will pursue!

[carpediemracing]

Voting for Koolstop Salmons. I run those on alum and carbon, no issues, for about 18 years? I think I started with modern carbon rims in 2005. I briefly tried Swissstop Yellows. In the dry, when I couldn't get salmons, I used Koolstop black, and they were fine, they're just terrible in the wet. Been using the same sets of wheels since 2010 - HED Bastognes (aka Ardennes but slightly different metal), Jet 6/9, Stinger 6-7-9. The brake tracks on the carbon wheels look new except they have a little bit of red from the pads.

[glepore]

Boyd Altamonts with Campy Red pads.
I'd recommend A33's but they're nla.
Really, I've been very happy with the wet braking of my Lun Road 50's with Red pads as well, the textured track works.
Had to be frightening yesterday, it sucked here on the east side of the Blue Ridge. Sun, then gusts of 35 and shots of cold rain, then sun again. I did yardwork instead of riding.

[lorenbike]

Kool stop salmon pads with aluminum rims have always worked well for me. That includes some pretty rough gravel riding and year round commuting in the PNW for a few years, and now winter commuting in the northeast.

[tellyho]

Light Aluminum wheels with Swisstop BXP.

[gbcoupe]

Why not get some Ritchey Zeta's to match your Ritchey frame? I have them on two bikes and recently bought a 3rd set. Also have C24's on two bikes, can't go wrong there. As others have said, a clean aluminum brake track and decent pads should do the job.

I'll be riding Skyline in a couple weeks. Still undecided on what bike, but will probably be using Easton EA90's.

[oldpotatoe]

Hey Baron, aren't you a bike shop/industry guy? A vendor?

OBTW-BTLOS are great rims and wheels...Buy some spec-ed like ya want and build them..

If not carbon, Velocity Quill, with spoke type and count designed for you..with hubs that you can get at wholesale like DT or Bitex or whatever.

If you don't have a wheel builder at hand..give me a shout..I'll give ya an industry-bro discount.

cp51errc@gmail.com

[Mark Davison]

Some tips from years of commuting using rim brakes and aluminum rims in the PNW:

1. Koolstop Salmon pads have good friction in the wet.

2. Rims and pads have better performance if you keep them clean (free of oil and grease) and roughed up. You can achieve this by cleaning them with 3M green pads with alcohol. Finish up with a clean rag or paper towel. If you commute, keep a cleaning kit at work so you can clean up before you return home. Keep a kit on the bike so you can do an emergency clean up if traffic forces you to ride through an oily puddle.

3. If you buy new polished rims you need to rough them up with fine grit sandpaper or emery cloth before you use them.

4. No matter what rim/pad combination you have, you will need to squeeze the brakes to dry off the rims prior to serious braking. So remember to squeeze and dry before you brake for a corner on a descent, and before coming to an intersection where you might have to stop quickly.

5. Panic braking on a wet rim is especially dangerous--you apply strong brake force, nothing happens, you apply more brake force, then the rims dry off and your front wheel can lock up. If the road is slick the front wheel starts sliding and the front end washes out and down you go.

[SDJ]

This sounds really weird to me as I have always read the C24s should be some of the best braking wheels out there.

I myself have ridden them and together with Zonda found them to have good braking in all conditions (of course in heavy rain we know of the normal limitations but shouldn’t be that extreme at 10%)

What I have discovered (through MY laziness, cheapness or stupidity…not changing often enough when ridden seldomly) is that old break pads dry out and that leads to very reduced braking power even in the dry but could then become extreme in the wet.

So please consider changing/upgrading your pads (and maybe cables and housing if older?) before you replace those (normally) great wheels

[fourflys]

I'm very interested in this discussion as well as my new to me Anderson has C24s as I understand it.. while I don't really ride in the rain here in the Bay Area (why would I?), that will probably change a bit when I move to the PNW in a couple years.. of course, I could just make the Anderson my sunny weather bike since it looks to be a work of art..

[BdaGhisallo]

I am still a rim brake devotee and the best braking performance I have ever had in the wet (and dry) was with Enve's 2nd gen rims with the textured brake tracks. Combine those with Swissstop Black Prince pads and you will stop better than with any other combo.

2nd best were the Mavic Ceramic rims, but only the ones they made in the 1990s. When they resurrected the product in the 2010s they somehow lost the magic.

3rd best are the Bontrager Aeolus XXX wheels with the lasered brake track combined with SS Black Prince pads.


I rode aluminum rims for many years and I was never that impressed with the braking in the wet. These three options are the best braking combos I've experienced.

[ridethecliche]

Imho... if this is your only rim brake bike, then get some lightish al wheels for it (like the spec alpinist) and throw some kool stop salmons on it and call it a day.

You have other go fast bikes so might as well embrace the rim brake getup for what they are!

Otherwise, do any of your fancy carbon rim brake wheels have textured brake tracks or the like?

[cgolvin]

Originally Posted by Baron Blubba

Wheels are Dura Ace C24 9000. Carbon with an aluminum brake faring

I'm confused -- I thought that C24s were aluminum brake track with carbon faring, but maybe there are multiple models. I had a set of C35 tubulars with Campy red pads and found the braking, especially in emergency situations, lacking.

Unlike @BdaGhisallo, my experience is that the best carbon rims I've tried do not stop as well as an aluminum track; granted, I have not tried the rim/brake combo that he praises. I have a new set of BTLOS rims paired with black SwissStop pads and, while the braking is much better than those Shimanos, I have a lot more confidence in the aluminum brake track of my HED Belgium+ rims and choose those wheels if there is a chance of precipitation.

[ridethecliche]

Originally Posted by cgolvin

I'm confused -- I thought that C24s were aluminum brake track with carbon faring, but maybe there are multiple models. I had a set of C35 tubulars with Campy red pads and found the braking, especially in emergency situations, lacking.

Unlike @BdaGhisallo, my experience is that the best carbon rims I've tried do not stop as well as an aluminum track; granted, I have not tried the rim/brake combo that he praises. I have a new set of BTLOS rims paired with black SwissStop pads and, while the braking is much better than those Shimanos, I have a lot more confidence in the aluminum brake track of my HED Belgium+ rims and choose those wheels if there is a chance of precipitation.

I think he got that backwards, but Al brake tracks should have been totally fine so I'm wondering if he just didn't have great pads... like the salmons recommended in this thread.

[fourflys]

Originally Posted by ridethecliche

I think he got that backwards, but Al brake tracks should have been totally fine so I'm wondering if he just didn't have great pads... like the salmons recommended in this thread.

I've been reading up on the C24s and am plesently surprised there is no weight limit since they are pretty lightweight and minimal spokes.. (not sure if I have 7900 or 9000 wheels coming, assume 9000s since 11sp SRAM)

I have read a lot that folks suggest these are dry weather wheels though.. not because of the braking, but due to the carbon/aluminum interface.. thoughts from folks that have experience with these?