Rivendell saved for now...

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

Dude, stop beating this stupid drum at me and I'll go away, the thread continues, everybody's happy.

Oh, I think you should stay. I'm just saying that just because you don't like another's opinion it doesn't make it unhealthy or that it was made in bad faith.

And the thread and story will go on without either of us because it's a bike story, and it's a good one.

And heaven forbid if come this February and Rivendell asks for money again. At this point it's believable that it just may happen.

[54ny77]

Any biz that goes online and asks for a handout is f'd, regardless of how many people like it or not.

It's a bummer to watch unfold, just like it was with Serotta.

Sounds like Riv/GP helped invent or foster the creation of the "gravel" bike category via 650b? If so, that's amazing. Never knew that. But the 800lb gorillas are circling that product wagon for sure, along with plenty of other participants.

I never heard of Rivendell or GP before this thread so it's at least generated some eyeballs to their site. Clicks add value. If there's ultimately something there that interests me, I'd be happy to buy it. And I've read a bunch of blog entries

I hope for the employees sake the owner knows when to get outta the way so the biz can continue. That pet project of bar end shifters sucking up precious capital and time, well....that doesn't sound too brilliant in this day and age. Especially when GP says (via the blog) he's gonna get em done come hell or high water and doesn't care if people buy em. But then he goes out asking for money to support the biz? Uhhh....something's not fully aligned there, the messaging is completely at odds as well as being in the public domain.

Just because they've survived thus far doesn't mean future success is assured. There's a lot of smart people on this forum who help businesses realize they're walking dead, but the leader just denies it.

Witness, again, what happened to Serotta.

[bthornt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eArlm3ukbVs

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by bthornt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eArlm3ukbVs

We come to fight with axes and soap! And all will leave clean shaven.

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by 54ny77

Any biz that goes online and asks for a handout is f'd, regardless of how many people like it or not.

It's a bummer to watch unfold, just like it was with Serotta.

Sounds like Riv/GP helped invent or foster the creation of the "gravel" bike category via 650b? If so, that's amazing. Never knew that. But the 800lb gorillas are circling that product wagon for sure, along with plenty of other participants.

I never heard of Rivendell or GP before this thread so it's at least generated some eyeballs to their site. Clicks add value. If there's ultimately something there that interests me, I'd be happy to buy it. And I've read a bunch of blog entries

I hope for the employees sake the owner knows when to get outta the way so the biz can continue. That pet project of bar end shifters sucking up precious capital and time, well....that doesn't sound too brilliant in this day and age. Especially when GP says (via the blog) he's gonna get em done come hell or high water and doesn't care if people buy em. But then he goes out asking for money to support the biz? Uhhh....something's not fully aligned there, the messaging is completely at odds as well as being in the public domain.

Just because they've survived thus far doesn't mean future success is assured. There's a lot of smart people on this forum who help businesses realize they're walking dead, but the leader just denies it.

Witness, again, what happened to Serotta.

^Truth. And it's not like it's going to get any easier in 2019.

[Louis]

Originally Posted by bthornt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eArlm3ukbVs

Mad skillz !!!

[parris]

54ny77 I could be wrong on a bit of this but it looks like gravel bikes take ques from a good number of bicycle types that came before. Early military bikes, cyclocross bikes, mountain bikes, touring bikes, elements of earlier road bikes etc.

My first real memory of what we could probably classify as a "gravel bike" would point back for me at least to the Serotta Slicker of the mid 80's. The next bike along these lines that I remember seeing would be Dave Kirks MRB model. There are sure to be many other builders/manufacturers that make/made similar bicycles for a long time.

We all have the luxury of standing on the development work from many builders and cyclists that have come before us. Anyone that can add to the builders and such to fill in what are sure to be large holes I'd really look forward to the info.

I've looked at the Rivendell site on and off for years but have never been who their gear is aimed at so I don't have any skin in this particular game. Hopefully if they've got decent gear and prices that bring value I hope they have success. The market and possible customers will vote with their wallets.

[belopsky]

https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!...ch/g8WMy6V_I_w

[54ny77]

Agree on all fronts. It pains me to see small businesses fail, esp those based in the USA. I hope these guys succeed. Those are real jobs and people behind the www dressing, however eccentric (or even out of touch with reality) the front man is, and they all have to fight against big bike co's who want to devour their little slice of the market (gravel bikes, for example).

Funny thing is, I still think of a gravel bike as a glorified cyclocross bike!

Originally Posted by parris

54ny77 I could be wrong on a bit of this but it looks like gravel bikes take ques from a good number of bicycle types that came before. Early military bikes, cyclocross bikes, mountain bikes, touring bikes, elements of earlier road bikes etc.

My first real memory of what we could probably classify as a "gravel bike" would point back for me at least to the Serotta Slicker of the mid 80's. The next bike along these lines that I remember seeing would be Dave Kirks MRB model. There are sure to be many other builders/manufacturers that make/made similar bicycles for a long time.

We all have the luxury of standing on the development work from many builders and cyclists that have come before us. Anyone that can add to the builders and such to fill in what are sure to be large holes I'd really look forward to the info.

I've looked at the Rivendell site on and off for years but have never been who their gear is aimed at so I don't have any skin in this particular game. Hopefully if they've got decent gear and prices that bring value I hope they have success. The market and possible customers will vote with their wallets.

[happycampyer]

Originally Posted by 54ny77

<snip>

Funny thing is, I still think of a gravel bike as a glorified cyclocross bike!

After riding my Firefly?!?

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by belopsky

https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!...ch/g8WMy6V_I_w

I feel for some if the folks on that forum. There's the emotional side, sure, I get that but a business is just that and like our households, we have to stay solvent and pay the bils.

If we ourselves choose to ignore opportunities and make choices that don't bring in enough to pay our bills, that is on us.

But when you're a business and do these things and come up short and then publically ask for money be ready for the scrutiny, in public. And understand that even to some fans it's off putting. Ask for money again and it only invites more questions.

Passion and emotion are good things but you have to pay the Bill's and have a solid plan to do so.

[merckx]

This was the first gravel bicycle that I was aware of. RIP Jobst.

[merckx]

What a bunch of maroons. IIRC, this was around 1982 or so. I think the guy on the left punted the all-road bike a little further down the road.

Road cycling was once super cool, and super fringe until the early 80's when, no fault of his own, LeMond appeared on our Sony Trinitrons and pulled the sport out of the closet. The sport has gone sideways ever since. I think Grant is doing his best to get a rope around this mess to give us some perspective once again. He has a good heart, but just needs some sound guidance, and the fortitude to allow others' to hold the steering wheel.

[54ny77]

That ain't no gravel bike. That there is a lightweight lunar rover with two wheels ready for RedBull to parachute down from earth orbit, whereupon Ned Overend will untie then ride it down Mt. Everest.

Originally Posted by happycampyer

After riding my Firefly?!?

[charliedid]

Well sure,

But just riding on gravel doesn't define a category of bikes. I think you could do worse than to point to the Rock N' Road bikes Bruce Gordon was making as the birth of the modern gravel bike.

Edit: I'm sure others were doing similar and I know Albert Eisentraut was making similar bikes.