purge at CyclingTips

[GregL]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

$45k-86k is like 2-4x the expected salary for a J-school degree with that level of experience. It’s not a high paying field, candidate quality is very poor. About the same as teachers and education MS.

In school districts that value the quality of their teachers, the starting salary for a teacher with an MS is closer to $70K. And I can assure you that the candidate quality at that pay point is excellent in my little corner of the world.

Greg

[spoonrobot]

Originally Posted by GregL

In school districts that value the quality of their teachers, the starting salary for a teacher with an MS is closer to $70K. And I can assure you that the candidate quality at that pay point is excellent in my little corner of the world.

Greg

What district is that? Based on a quick google off your location the tax payers are basically throwing that $70k in the toilet.

$70k for an MS wouldn’t rate for anything involving real work with finance, science, or mathematics.

My entry level job in 2006 off a BS in Econ paid more than that.

[AngryScientist]

Originally Posted by rice rocket

Positions are posted!

$50k/yr for undergraduate degree plus 4 years experience, yeah no thanks.
]

I dont really know much about these fields, but is the expectation that these are full time jobs? If not and a motivated young person could do this job in addition to other writing gigs, it could be a good living, right?

[rice rocket]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

I dont really know much about these fields, but is the expectation that these are full time jobs? If not and a motivated young person could do this job in addition to other writing gigs, it could be a good living, right?

I'm not positive, but I don't think anyone who left (or James Huang) wrote for anyone else. They could've been Starbucks baristas on the side, I wouldn't know that though.

[spoonrobot]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

I dont really know much about these fields, but is the expectation that these are full time jobs? If not and a motivated young person could do this job in addition to other writing gigs, it could be a good living, right?

The expectation is they are FT, but someone in their 20s/30s would be able to knock this out as a part-time gig, excepting the travel season. This stuff isn't hard and the industry as a whole suffers from creatives malaise where doing more than a handful of tasks a week is met with intense resistance.

"You want me to shoot a 5 minute video, take a dozen photos of a product, AND read three press releases???"

*dies*

[alexihnen]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

I dont really know much about these fields, but is the expectation that these are full time jobs? If not and a motivated young person could do this job in addition to other writing gigs, it could be a good living, right?

The job description is multiple full-time jobs. Honesty, when they ask for endless energy and enthusiasm and you’re responsible for all the writing, videos, photos, etc., etc., etc., and so on… Someone will take the job, no doubt, but that doesn’t make it a job with reasonable expectations.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

$45k-86k is like 2-4x the expected salary for a J-school degree with that level of experience. It’s not a high paying field, candidate quality is very poor. About the same as teachers and education MS.

https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes273023.htm

$50k is roughly the national median salary for print journalists. This seems like a reasonable salary for someone interested. I suspect the biggest reason they'd have trouble filling this position is not the salaries, but after all the public layoffs, I think many people would be very hesitant to take a job with them.

[72gmc]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

The expectation is they are FT, but someone in their 20s/30s would be able to knock this out as a part-time gig, excepting the travel season. This stuff isn't hard and the industry as a whole suffers from creatives malaise where doing more than a handful of tasks a week is met with intense resistance.

"You want me to shoot a 5 minute video, take a dozen photos of a product, AND read three press releases???"

*dies*

Have you actually worked in this field, or graduated from journalism school? You’re making a lot of statements about the level of effort and quality of people that do not align to my real world experience.

[GregL]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

What district is that? Based on a quick google off your location the tax payers are basically throwing that $70k in the toilet.

$70k for an MS wouldn’t rate for anything involving real work with finance, science, or mathematics.

My entry level job in 2006 off a BS in Econ paid more than that.

What point are you trying to make? If you look up the contracts for any of the larger, suburban SYR school districts, you can see the starting pay rates for teachers with master's degrees. The voters in those districts apparently disagree with your assessment on the value of teachers' salaries.

Yes, you can certainly earn more in other fields including finance and STEM careers. Teachers don't choose their career fields to get rich. They nearly all become teachers to pass on knowledge to a new generation. And I can assure you that it's very real work. If you don't think education for our youth is real work and important to our future, there's really no point in continuing to have a polite discussion.

Greg

[spoonrobot]

Originally Posted by 72gmc

Have you actually worked in this field, or graduated from journalism school? You’re making a lot of statements about the level of effort and quality of people that do not align to my real world experience.

Yes/No I got a real education because the income cap for hobby jobs seemed really low.

Real world experience is fun like that, isn't it?

[buckfifty]

Seems like Abby Mickey is also leaving CT as well

[72gmc]

Spoonrobot, I think you’re conflating what is often a crappy job with the profession and the people who do it.

In my experience, journalism has poor performers and empty vessels like any other field. It’s also chock full of the kind of people who contribute well beyond their comp because that’s what they do. I saw a few of the former and far more of the latter. I also worked just as hard on my degree as friends in other fields (but not as long as friends in certain fields).

Journalism’s problem is that it only pays well for a few roles. It teaches high ethical standards and then challenges those standards from all directions, too often with weapons-grade stupidity or duplicity (or both) from management. People leave because they don’t want to sell out, or they’re tired of watching the ad sales manager climb out of an Acura NSX.

If it had paid, I probably wouldn’t have left. I’ve done well hiring people with journalism degrees since I left.

[weiwentg]

Anyway, about the jobs posted. By reports, Outside has not communicated with the staff still at Cyclingtips at all. And yet, here they are posting for new tech editor jobs, except that they recently laid off tech editors or similar positions at CT and Velonews.

I don't like this. I just cancelled my CT sub. Earlier in the year, I considered subscribing to Outside+ so I could get access to the VN articles. However, they made CT lay off Dane Cash last year, with no clear reason. They also made CT take down its article about Peter Sagan and his NFT folly. That gave me enough reason to not trust Outside.

It stings that Robin Thurston appears not to know the value of the media companies he bought, and yet he is setting out to hire a bunch of new staff for them in what I guess is an attempt to remake them. Maybe it will turn out better than Outside Inc's NFT marketplace. It probably won't.

[mstateglfr]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

What district is that? Based on a quick google off your location the tax payers are basically throwing that $70k in the toilet.

$70k for an MS wouldn’t rate for anything involving real work with finance, science, or mathematics.

My entry level job in 2006 off a BS in Econ paid more than that.

Another poster asked what your point is and I also don't follow. Why is $70k thrown in the toilet for a teacher with an MS in ED?

Cool that your econ degree got you more than $70k out of college in 2006. Really not sure what that has to do with journalism jobs, education jobs, or these job postings.

[reuben]

Outside has been buying and degrading a variety of publications for several years. That doesn't seem like the greatest business model, but that's just my personal opinion.