NYC Terrorist attack on Hudson River Greenway Bikepath

[93legendti]

Originally Posted by William

Not sure why we are getting into semantics here but the term applies imo.









William

Not legally. Sorry. This was terrorism.

http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=1230

Another poster brought it up:

Originally Posted by cachagua

It's only academic, I know, but what makes something "terrorism" and something else just garden-variety mayhem?

[jimcav]

on the side-tangents raised in this thread, but I for one am truly glad he didn't have a real gun for when his primary weapon failed him, as then there'd just be more dead. I don't know enough about legal gun rules to know if an immigrant 7 years in the USA could get one, but glad he did not. The lack of remorse is unfathomable to me. Especially since I'd assume the goal was to get gunned down as a martyr and go to heaven etc, having failed that, I would just think there would be some reflection on what he did and some remorse. Terrible thing for the familes involved--loved ones gone who played no part in any of this idiot's internally generated false "war" or ideals.

I also dislike the speculative reporting that was on last night--wish we had the capacity to await the results of investigation. I'm hoping they can do an in depth analysis of how a "happy uber driver" became this monster supposedly by the internet. really hoping there is a cyber-counter to such things soon.

[William]

Originally Posted by 93legendti

Not legally. Sorry. This was terrorism.

I'm not arguing that it wasn't.





William

[Mikej]

Edit: just sorry this **** happens, that's all.

[93legendti]

Originally Posted by jimcav

on the side-tangents raised in this thread, but I for one am truly glad he didn't have a real gun for when his primary weapon failed him, as then there'd just be more dead. I don't know enough about legal gun rules to know if an immigrant 7 years in the USA could get one, but glad he did not. The lack of remorse is unfathomable to me. Especially since I'd assume the goal was to get gunned down as a martyr and go to heaven etc, having failed that, I would just think there would be some reflection on what he did and some remorse. Terrible thing for the familes involved--loved ones gone who played no part in any of this idiot's internally generated false "war" or ideals.

I also dislike the speculative reporting that was on last night--wish we had the capacity to await the results of investigation. I'm hoping they can do an in depth analysis of how a "happy uber driver" became this monster supposedly by the internet. really hoping there is a cyber-counter to such things soon.

Good points. The toy guns were mocking those who try to turn a terrorist incident into a gun control debate as in San Bernardino. If one studies the history of terrorism, the terrorists rush to claim responsibility for acts of terror-unlike criminals or those committing “mayhem”, who don’t want to be caught. Terrorists want the notoriety. They want be a shahid. They want streets and plazas named after them.

[93legendti]

Originally Posted by William

I'm not arguing that it wasn't.




William

Sorry, I misread your post.

[William]

Originally Posted by jimcav

on the side-tangents raised in this thread, but I for one am truly glad he didn't have a real gun for when his primary weapon failed him, as then there'd just be more dead...

I don't disagree with you. I'm also glad he didn't have hatchets or knives with him. I've seen incidents of this in the Middle East where they use a vehicle to hit people and then jump out and go after others with edged weapons. It appears his plan was to get taken out by waving paint/pellet guns when he couldn't continue his rampage. I'm glad they were able to apprehend this perp quickly.







William

[William]

Originally Posted by 93legendti

Sorry, I misread your post.

No problem.





William

[shovelhd]

What I can't get out of my mind is how much worse this could have been. It's bad enough. But just think if he just woahed up at Chambers, Warren, etc., enough to get through each intersection. Unstopped, he could have gone all the way to Battery Park.

[redir]

Originally Posted by jimcav

I also dislike the speculative reporting that was on last night--wish we had the capacity to await the results of investigation. I'm hoping they can do an in depth analysis of how a "happy uber driver" became this monster supposedly by the internet. really hoping there is a cyber-counter to such things soon.

It's pretty much why I won't even respond in threads like this till days later when they usually get locked anyway. I worked in a news room, small town TV news, but we had an international incident one day and the so called 'reporting' from the big news networks was all about getting something first and fast and the facts don't matter till it's all cleaned up.

[cmg]

best thing that could happen is that he be put away quickly and quietly without a lot of press coverage. feel so sorry for the victims

[djg21]

Originally Posted by cachagua

It's only academic, I know, but what makes something "terrorism" and something else just garden-variety mayhem?

It is an academic question that has been discussed and written about extensively over the past decades, and which still is debated. Caleb Carr (military historian and author of The Alienist among other great historical novels) wrote an excellent book called Lessons of Terror: A History of Warfare Against Civilians. https://www.amazon.com/Lessons-Terro.../dp/0375760741. Carr defines terrorism “as deliberate warfare against civilians” as a political and military strategy. Some argue this definition too narrow because it doesn’t address attacks on military personnel or military installations. https://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=444680.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by cmg

best thing that could happen is that he be put away quickly and quietly without a lot of press coverage. feel so sorry for the victims

Wonder if this could become a federal case and he be faced with the death penalty? Does NY have the death penalty?

[KJMUNC]

Heard an interesting take on local news this AM from an eyewitness who was on the opposite side of the street as it happened. He was an older gentleman who grew up in London during terrorism in the 70's/80's and said he was surprised that most people just stood frozen in fear or filming with their phones and didn't run/take cover as the guy was running around with the gun (albeit only a fake one, but no-one knew that). His point was that in the reality of today's society where this is always a threat, especially in large cities with crowds, people need to be more aware of what to do if this happens and we should teach kids to run/hide if they hear gunfire or see something like this.

Not to minimize what happened, but it could've been significantly worse if that gun was real or the guy went on a full rampage after he got out of the truck.

[parris]

Spud NY does not have the death penalty. The state reenacted the death penalty in the mid-late 80's. It was then struck down in the spring of 2003 or 2004. I was in court on a capital case when the proceeding came to a halt when the judges law clerk came in with a note from the Appelete(sp) division striking down the law. He and all lawyers involved had to go into chambers to get clarification to see if the trial could continue with new jury instructions or if it would be declared a mistrial.