Campy 12 speed chain - peen or quick link?

[Dave]

[QUOTE=Yerma;2582879]

Originally Posted by Dave

I'm also using a KMC CL552 link on my campy 12 chain. Works fine, but the width across the pins is wider than the rest of the chain. All modern links have flush pins, so they don't protrude.

A sram axs link is too narrow.[/QUOT

I wonder if there is some variation on the KMC pin width? Since it doesn’t have flush pins 0.5mm on one side or the other would be enough to explain why some aren’t having the clearance issues.

A CL 552 should have flush pins. IIRC, the width is 5.38mm.

[weiwentg]

Originally Posted by mcteague

Except when the Park peening tool breaks, happened to me on first use, and the Campy version costs a LOT. The link just makes things easier.

Tim

Not related, but I bought a Park grease gun. I got it jammed somehow and emailed Park. They said it's probably a clogged nozzle, just stick a paperclip or staple through the hole end, and if that doesn't un-jam it, we'll send you a new one. Perhaps the rep I emailed was in a generous mood. However, I have to suspect they could be willing to send you a new peening tool if you relayed your experience to them.

I could say this is an argument for quick links, but I have a hard time seeing how a well made tool should break on first use.

[mcteague]

Originally Posted by weiwentg

Not related, but I bought a Park grease gun. I got it jammed somehow and emailed Park. They said it's probably a clogged nozzle, just stick a paperclip or staple through the hole end, and if that doesn't un-jam it, we'll send you a new one. Perhaps the rep I emailed was in a generous mood. However, I have to suspect they could be willing to send you a new peening tool if you relayed your experience to them.

I could say this is an argument for quick links, but I have a hard time seeing how a well made tool should break on first use.

I’m sure they would have but I lost all confidence in the tool. Plus I didn’t want to wait the extra time and went with the quick link.

Tim

[Yerma]

[QUOTE=Dave;2583083]

Originally Posted by Yerma

A CL 552 should have flush pins. IIRC, the width is 5.38mm.

Using the CL 552. Only the side that’s fixed is flush. It appears that since the rollers are thinner on the C12, it allows the KMC chain link plates to move inward making the pin sit proud and catch the pulley plate.

[Jeff N.]

Originally Posted by weiwentg

Not related, but I bought a Park grease gun. I got it jammed somehow and emailed Park. They said it's probably a clogged nozzle, just stick a paperclip or staple through the hole end, and if that doesn't un-jam it, we'll send you a new one. Perhaps the rep I emailed was in a generous mood. However, I have to suspect they could be willing to send you a new peening tool if you relayed your experience to them.

I could say this is an argument for quick links, but I have a hard time seeing how a well made tool should break on first use.

I personally think that, as far as tool overall quality goes, Park tools are marginal at best...but when they're pretty much the only game in town, there ain't much choice. I've had chain tools break, hex wrenches go round....made out of pot metal, practically.

[Dave]

[QUOTE=Yerma;2583141]

Originally Posted by Dave

Using the CL 552. Only the side that’s fixed is flush. It appears that since the rollers are thinner on the C12, it allows the KMC chain link plates to move inward making the pin sit proud and catch the pulley plate.

The width across the rollers is not an issue, nor is the narrower width across the inner plates. The pin has a groove in it, so the outer plate cannot move in or out. The fact that the inner plate width is narrower just leaves more side clearance between the inner and outer plates.

I've had no problems with this link on my Chorus 12 RD. I did orient the link as SRAM instructs, with the fixed flush pin on the outside and forward, when the link is on the top section of chain.

[jzinckgra]

Originally Posted by Yerma

Tim, I’ve tried the kmc on a new record 12 group and the pins on the quick link

Hit the upper pulley derailleur plate. Did you have to modify anything on yours?

I'm running 11 speed with kmc and noticed my plate was gouged. So the kmc is wider than campy chain? I never bothered with campy chain cause the kmc with quicklink is just easier to deal with. I can't seem to get part number for the inner cage plate for my derailleur. It's record, 2018.

[pjbaz]

Originally Posted by bfd

Doesn’t Shimano use chain pins too? I know they have a master link, but the pins are still available:
Personally, I just get a KMC with the master link and be done with it!

And just last Saturday I experienced my first major failure when the 11-speed Ultegra chain I installed this spring with the Shimano pin partially let go, caught my fd and destroyed it and the fd clamp which, of course, was cf and proprietary. Adding insult to the whole thing? It was my second ride (it survived a fast 32 mile group ride with 2,500 feet of climbing 5 days earlier) with the new grouppo ... so obviously that pin was not properly in there (yes, MY fault).

All in, I figure it was about $145 or so.

My other 11 speed setup had a Shimano quick link, and this one will be repaired using a quick link.

[Yerma]

[QUOTE=Dave;2583200]

Originally Posted by Yerma

The width across the rollers is not an issue, nor is the narrower width across the inner plates. The pin has a groove in it, so the outer plate cannot move in or out. The fact that the inner plate width is narrower just leaves more side clearance between the inner and outer plates.

I've had no problems with this link on my Chorus 12 RD. I did orient the link as SRAM instructs, with the fixed flush pin on the outside and forward, when the link is on the top section of chain.

Thanks for the information. Are you using the KMC or the SRAM link? I’ll double check that I have oriented the KMC link as you describe.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by jzinckgra

I'm running 11 speed with kmc and noticed my plate was gouged. So the kmc is wider than campy chain? I never bothered with campy chain cause the kmc with quicklink is just easier to deal with. I can't seem to get part number for the inner cage plate for my derailleur. It's record, 2018.

https://www.campagnolo.com/media/fil...018_part_A.pdf

Page 15 BUT it's the cage assembly, not just the inner cage plate.

[Dave]

[QUOTE=Yerma;2583309]

Originally Posted by Dave

Thanks for the information. Are you using the KMC or the SRAM link? I’ll double check that I have oriented the KMC link as you describe.

I use the CL 552 KMC link. A sram axs link is too narrow, but a SRAM eagle link should work the chain is only a few thousandths of an inch wider than a Campy chain.

[Yerma]

Strange, I tried both orientations and the CL552 still brushes the inside of the pulley cages. I’m sure it would quickly create a shallow groove in the alloy and quiet down after a few rides but it’s piqued my curiosity as to why you and others are not having the same issue. The link is clearly wider than the C12 and additionally it has much more lateral play due to the Campy inner link being narrower. It may be this additional play that is making it rub.
On a side note if anyone wants a Park 4.3 chain tool I have a virtually new one for $50. I’ve not had any past problems with Park tools save a torque wrench which the repaired and recalibrated under warranty. YMMV.

[PsiSquared]

Sorry. I'm a bit late to the party.

I'm moving up to Campy Chorus 12spd over the next month, and I'm stuck on what chain to use. I wax my chains (the crock pot method, not the liquid wax in a bottle stuff), so my life would be easier with a chain that quickly splits and rejoins. I've been happy with KMC chains and Missing Links on my current Campy Record 10 speed drivetrain, but I'm a bit worried by the differing opinions and experiences I've read with KMC 12 Spd bits on Campy 12 drive trains.

The worry I have with using a Campy chain is that, well, it would have to be split quasi-frequently. What is the limit on how many times you can split and rejoin a Campy 12 spd chain? Another downside to the Campy chain route is the cost of all the pins. The pins are about $14-15, aren't they?

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by PsiSquared

Sorry. I'm a bit late to the party.

I'm moving up to Campy Chorus 12spd over the next month, and I'm stuck on what chain to use. I wax my chains (the crock pot method, not the liquid wax in a bottle stuff), so my life would be easier with a chain that quickly splits and rejoins. I've been happy with KMC chains and Missing Links on my current Campy Record 10 speed drivetrain, but I'm a bit worried by the differing opinions and experiences I've read with KMC 12 Spd bits on Campy 12 drive trains.

The worry I have with using a Campy chain is that, well, it would have to be split quasi-frequently. What is the limit on how many times you can split and rejoin a Campy 12 spd chain? Another downside to the Campy chain route is the cost of all the pins. The pins are about $14-15, aren't they?

Once again, unlike older chains, where you can push a pin out and then push a pin back in..if you push out a Campag pin, then rejoin at that place, even using a 'new' pin, you run the risk of breaking a chain there. Campag chains are designed to have that supplied pin shoved into a 'virgin' outer plate only. WHY, chain pin replacement 'kits' from Campag include a wee section of virgin chain links. So..use a KMC or other, snap link.

Campag 'kit' below

[makoti]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Once again, unlike older chains, where you can push a pin out and then push a pin back in..if you push out a Campag pin, then rejoin at that place, even using a 'new' pin, you run the risk of breaking a chain there. Campag chains are designed to have that supplied pin shoved into a 'virgin' outer plate only. WHY, chain pin replacement 'kits' from Campag include a wee section of virgin chain links. So..use a KMC or other, snap link.

Campag 'kit' below

So are you saying that, even using an official Campy pin, you are better off using a quick link on a 12? Getting 12 for the travel bike, and it's either QL's or buy the Abby tool.