Mt. bikes,carbon vs aluminum

[skiezo]

My son stole my hardtail mt bike and has really been into riding. His house backs up to michaux state forest where there are thousands of mile of trails for every level of rider.
I am going to buy him and his girl some full suspension bikes as a christmas/masters graduation gift.
Is there that much difference in weight,ride quality or durability between carbon and aluminum?
I am looking at santa cruz or specialized for him and a juliana for her as they seem to be some of the better bikes out there. I will be looking for nos over the late fall early winter.
Any other bikes I should be looking at as well? 29er for him and 27.5 for her.
Thanks Brian

[crownjewelwl]

Originally Posted by skiezo

My son stole my hardtail mt bike and has really been into riding. His house backs up to michaux state forest where there are thousands of mile of trails for every level of rider.
I am going to buy him and his girl some full suspension bikes as a christmas/masters graduation gift.
Is there that much difference in weight,ride quality or durability between carbon and aluminum?
I am looking at santa cruz or specialized for him and a juliana for her as they seem to be some of the better bikes out there. I will be looking for nos over the late fall early winter.
Any other bikes I should be looking at as well? 29er for him and 27.5 for her.
Thanks Brian

really comes down to weight...on a full suss bike, you're not gonna "feel" the frame as much

and comes down to budget...if i had to choose between alu frame with nicer components and carbon with lesser components, i would choose the carbon frame

juliana is just marketing...you can easily find a 27.5 bike for her that isn't a "women's" bike

that's a nice gift...MTB is life

[PaMtbRider]

Good luck with finding nos this fall. Most local shops are sold out of bikes and can't keep them in stock when they get a shipment. It would be hard to go wrong with a carbon Santa Cruz Tallboy for riding at Michaux. Buy them better frames, and if they want / need to they can upgrade components later.

[Jaybee]

Never ridden within 1000 miles of Michaux, but i'm guessing rocky, rooty, twisty? I'd go short travel not too slack 29er. If your son's girlfriend is 5'4" or taller, I'd go 29er for her too. Not sure how much you want to spend, but if you are in the XC/trail FS category I think an alloy bike is just fine, and contrary to crownjewl, I'd rather have an alloy frame with a good fork and shock than crappy suspension on a carbon frame. MTB carbon is pretty overbuilt, you usually aren't saving a ton of weight by going carbon until you are spending $5k plus.

I'm going to refer everyone who asks "what mountain bike should I buy?" to this Eli Bingham post; he nailed it. For those who think that list is too spendy, I'd either go downrange on the models he listed or look at Marin. The Rift Zone and Hawk Hill (if you must go 27.5) are really well spec'd for the money you spend, and the geo is solid.

Your bigger issue will be actually finding stock. From what I understand, I wouldn't expect the bike supply chain to get back to normal until next spring at the earliest.

[vqdriver]

This will be dictated by budget and availability.
But given the choice I gotta pick carbon. More benefit to mtb imo.
And altho I agree that good suspension trumps all, once you're past the lowest tiers of crap suspension, ive found you gain tons of adjustments not performance

[Ken Robb]

Which material is more likely to survive crashes?

[benb]

I'm skeptical of Carbon *for me*.

Most of the time I don't think the weight of the bike is doing much of anything in the woods.

Downhill it's not that important, heavier bikes with more suspension/better brakes/whatever win downhill.

Uphill if you're racing maybe it matters.. but a heavier bike with a better dialed suspension would still win.

If you have to dab on one bike going uphill and not on another any difference in weight is totally gone.

Yah.. if you're expert/pro class XC with crazy good technical skills it matters.

My aluminum frame has taken an absolute beating over the years from impact damage. I'm just skeptical carbon would do as well with all that impact damage. If you're a big spender and constantly change out for the latest and greatest bikes this might not matter except for your resale.

Also MTBs are just way way expensive..

Totally different opinion for me with respect to road bikes.. you're never having to "dab" going uphill on a road bike and the uphills are longer and downhill is almost meaningless.

[JAGI410]

I had 2 Carbon FS bikes (SC Tallboy, Salsa Horsethief) before going to an aluminum Ibis Ripmo AF. 1 lb difference. Big deal. A lot cheaper bike that can handle a lot more abuse, and it allows me to ride with more confidence as I'm not worried about hurting carbon.

I see no reason to go carbon unless you're chasing grams or have cash to burn. There's so many great aluminum options these days.

[Jaybee]

Originally Posted by Ken Robb

Which material is more likely to survive crashes?

IME (and I've got more experience than I'd like to admit crashing on MTBs), both alloy and carbon are usually fine. Unless you're talking about an XC race whippet, a carbon MTB is really overbuilt and robust.

Also, most MTB crashes don't have a bunch of kinetic energy behind them. Your overall speeds are lower compared to road, and usually when stuff gets techy most of us are going really slow and it's more of an awkward tip over than a full-on yard sale.

[JAGI410]

In case you haven't seen the carbon vs aluminum frame torture test, this is cool:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5eMMf11uhM&t=11s

[benb]

Originally Posted by JAGI410

I had 2 Carbon FS bikes (SC Tallboy, Salsa Horsethief) before going to an aluminum Ibis Ripmo AF. 1 lb difference. Big deal. A lot cheaper bike that can handle a lot more abuse, and it allows me to ride with more confidence as I'm not worried about hurting carbon.

I see no reason to go carbon unless you're chasing grams or have cash to burn. There's so many great aluminum options these days.

And that 1lb weight difference is a smaller % change than a 16lb carbon road bike vs a 17lb aluminum/Ti one.

[skiezo]

Thanks for all the reply's. I will probably go with a good pre owned when I find the right deal. So either CF or alum will be fine I'm sure.

[vqdriver]

to elaborate on my post above, the benefits of carbon are greater in mtb not just because of weight savings (altho that can be a benefit for sure) it's because it freed up designers with suspension design. if you compare the diff mfgs, there's vastly different approaches to the rear suspension that required reinforcements and pivots in very specific areas while also changing tube shapes and dimensions, all without turning the whole thing into a boat anchor. so is it weight savings? sure, but not in the sense that a carbon equivalent weighs less than its al counterpart. more so in that it avoided ballooning frame weights with more elaborate designs while they chased their suspension systems.
ultimately the OP may be limited by available stock, but let's not dismiss carbon mtb as weight weenies only. it was almost necessary for modern suspension design.

[Hilltopperny]

I have had a few different mountain bikes in the past year and will say Santa Cruz makes a nice bike. There is a bit of a weight savings, but a good aluminum bike still rides great and I think the weight is negligible to be honest for most full suspension and even some hardtails.

My buddies Knolly is lightweight and rides fantastic. I had a carbon Bad Habit that was tons of fun, but the aluminum Knolly actually felt a bit lighter. I also had an aluminum Stache after demoing a carbon version and it did not feel any different to me while riding or really on a scale.

I did find swapping from an aluminum Mukluk to a carbon Mukluk made huge difference for me. The carbon Mukluk rides smoother and is significantly lighter which is more enjoyable for the riding I like to do. Climbing icy and snow covered hills was a world of difference for me!

[skiezo]

Found a 2018 Guerrilla Gravity The Smash for the kid.
Built in Colorado alum frame 160mm front 145mm rear and a quality build.
This was the last year of the MITUSA alum frames.
Now they offer a MITUSA CF frame that are priced very well.
If looking for a FS bike I would definitely look into these guys. Very unique modular design.
https://ridegg.com/