Future of Rim Brakes

[Frankwurst]

I like rim brakes but I also like steel frames, curved forks, leather saddles, friction shifting, mudguards, old cars and the Blues. That's the short list.

[reuben]

Originally Posted by Frankwurst

I like rim brakes but I also like steel frames, curved forks, leather saddles, friction shifting, mudguards, old cars and the Blues. That's the short list.

Soul brother.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by Black Dog

To be fair, rim brakes don't wear out easily. Folks that are worried should put a set of good rim brakes in a box in case they ever need them in the future. I doubt that they will ever use them to replace a set a brakes. I would also suspect that pads will always be made. There are just so many rims brakes in the world and there will be a market for good pads for decades to come. I am a rim brake user and don't have too many concerns, long term. High end rims on the other hand.....

It's not the calipers that are the issue. Its the shifters, frames, forks and wheels that are required to hang the calipers on. The calipers are the easy part.

The choice between rim and disc brakes isn't as simple choosing between calipers. Rim brakes and disc brakes exist in separate eco-systems, and each require its own different frames, forks, wheels (and usually brifters). If any one of these becomes unavailable in one of the eco-systems, the entire eco-system becomes unviable.

[tepextate]

As someone who's getting a custom rim brake frame made, this thread is making me nervous.

I'm just banking on the fact that, as others have said, there will be enough demand for rim brake parts for at least a cottage industry to remain.

What I'm curious about is whether or not the next generation of group sets will still come with a rim brake variant. Would hate for whatever groupset I select for this bike to be the "best" and final groupset it ever sees.

[unterhausen]

Originally Posted by thirdgenbird

If bike makers quit selling rim brake bikes, shimano could easily reduce SKUs by eliminating cable brake integrated levers. It won’t be nearly as easy for a small company to fill this void.

Given the industry is moving to hydraulic even on relatively inexpensive bikes, I imagine that the shortage of cable brake levers is going to last past the pandemic.

It's weird seeing a sub-$1000 bike with hydraulic brakes.

[dbh]

As an exclusive rim brake user, I'm not too worried. I had a hydro disk SSCX rig, but got rid of it, as I thought the setup was too fiddly for my taste. The fact is you can get new Shimano 8 speed downtube new in 2021. Talk about absolute tech. Yes, I'm sure in ten or fifteen years time, we may not be able to find all new mech rim brake groups from all three major groupset manufacturers at low, mid, and high pricepoints, but I have no doubt that the important consumables will still be available new. You'll certainly have no trouble finding what you need on the used market for decades to come (just look at the price 10 speed Campy still fetches here and on ebay).

[sg8357]

Originally Posted by tepextate

As someone who's getting a custom rim brake frame made, this thread is making me nervous.

Order a 60cm from Ellis, if you can't find rim brake parts, I'll take it off your hands.

Suntour parts are always in stock, at the secret warehouse.

[Black Dog]

As a campy user I feel fairly confident that spares will be around for a long time. However if there comes a day that I have to go to hydros then I will and I will still love riding even though I will complain about the change.

[thirdgenbird]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

Given the industry is moving to hydraulic even on relatively inexpensive bikes, I imagine that the shortage of cable brake levers is going to last past the pandemic.

It's weird seeing a sub-$1000 bike with hydraulic brakes.

I bought a sub $500 Momentum (Giant sub brand) commuter bike that came with hydraulic discs.

Originally Posted by Black Dog

As a campy user I feel fairly confident that spares will be around for a long time. However if there comes a day that I have to go to hydros then I will and I will still love riding even though I will complain about the change.

Agreed.

[sevencyclist]

Originally Posted by Team Murray

I have both and I created an apples-to-apples comparison for C64 rim versus C64 disc. Here is my review I sent to the team principle of Team Novo Nordisk.


I wanted to give you some feedback on the C64 disc versus the C64 rim brake. I built both bikes to almost the same exact spec.

Disc vs. Rim brake
Frames: C64 disc vs. C64 rim
Groupset: Both are using SRAM Red 11sp etap.
Brakes: SRAM flat mount HRD vs. Dura Ace direct mount
Wheelset: Campy Shamal Ultra DB vs. Campy Shamal Mille (ceramic coating)
Post and Seat: same, C64 post and Fizik Arione CX
Bars: FSA Metron Trimax 4D, 44cm
Stem: Colnago integrated cable stem (120mm -8d) vs. Easton EA90 (120mm -10d)
Pedals: same Look Keo HM
Tires: Same, Vittoria Corsa Graphene 700x28
Weight (with cages) 17.5lbs vs 16.6lbs
The DB C64 is about 500g more due to the heavier levers, having rotors, and differences in weight in the braking calipers.

The feel.
The DB C64 feels more solid/heavier in the front end due the lever weight and rotor. It also feels "more solid/heavier" also because the levers are just bigger/chunkier than normal levers.

Braking is better, but, with aluminum rims, I did not have an issue. My rim brake C64 already had the best rim braking possible (direct mount DA calipers, ceramic coated Campy rims, and non-compressible brake housing). I can see if I was comparing it to a rim brake bike with carbon wheels, the disc brakes would be a huge improvement.

Either way, both bikes are great. The frames are identical in feel. 500g difference doesn't really matter to me. What actually matters to me is that the rim brake levers are smaller/thinner and fit my hands better.






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Great thanks to Team Murray, I was able to hop on his amazing machines and experience the rims and discs in person today. The C64s were set up identically and I definitely felt the difference. Now I know what I want!

Really appreciate it!

[David in Maine]

Originally Posted by sevencyclist

Now I know what I want!

Don't leave us hanging!

[Team Murray]

In my opinion,

Keep in mind, to support a rim brake groupset, the groupset OEMs need to have:

• mechanical cable actuated levers

• electronic cable actuated levers (optional)

• rim brake calipers

The watershed mark for rim brake bikes will be decided by Shimano. Since Shimano is the OEM group supplier for 90% of road bikes (my guess-timate). The day Shimano sees that there is no future in rim brakes and no longer offer rim brake groups, then rim brake bikes will have gone the way of the DoDo bird.

You can kind of see this in the SRAM line. In years, they have not released improved caliper brakes for years (i.e., for Red Aerolink or Force). They also no longer actively market rim brake Red or Force.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

Keeping up an obsolete bike requires some ingenuity and the occasional expenditure of $. People that ride vintage are quite familiar with what it takes. If you ruin a fork on an obsolete bike, the used market may help you out but you might have to pay. Probably at least $600 painted in the case of a cantilever 27" fork. I would convert that bike to 700c if possible.

I used bar end and 10 speed for a while, although I kept hitting my knees on them. In 10 years, all of us will be riding microshift on our rim brake bikes. Or there will be kits to convert hydraulic to cable pull.

Oh please, Richard Schwinn could make this fork for less than 1/2 of that.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by unterhausen

Given the industry is moving to hydraulic even on relatively inexpensive bikes, I imagine that the shortage of cable brake levers is going to last past the pandemic.

It's weird seeing a sub-$1000 bike with hydraulic brakes.

My grand daughters both have Cleary bikes, a 26inch and 24inch and both with hydro disc brakes.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Oh please, Richard Schwinn could make this fork for less than 1/2 of that.

Are you sure? The Waterford Price List shows their steel forks costing between $375 & $775, depending on options (paint might be additional).