Adjusting approach to conventional road riding

[bigbill]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

I just got back from a ride and was actually thinking about this. All sorts of people passed me and you can't really generalized. I had ppl on big trucks give me a ton of space and people in subarus not giving me space at all. New plan, thank everyone that gives me space. Maybe that will make people know how appreciative I am and have em keep doing it

My first weekend in Paris, TX, I was riding on a rural Farm to Market road and stopped at a T to look at my Garmin. A guy rolled up in a diesel Dodge Ram pickup and asked if I was ok or needed a ride somewhere. I told him I was ok, just checking a map to see which was to go. He said if I was turning left to let him know so he could get his dogs.

[SpeedyChix]

Originally Posted by Kirk007

Clean, the Dinotte rear and Amber front are a level above other blinkies.

But I definitely am picking rides/routes/times with aggressive driver avoiance in mind.

We've become more selective about time of day that we ride, tend to head to gravel or back roads.

Added the Dinotte front and rear and they are brighter/bolder than most and quite effective. Even on the paved main roads, drivers seem to respond and respect us with the lights going. Noted improvement. We give waves and thumbs up when we get wide or full lane passes.

For those who say "but they're so expensive": if it helps save your life they're a bargain.

[Hellgate]

Originally Posted by bigbill

My first weekend in Paris, TX, I was riding on a rural Farm to Market road and stopped at a T to look at my Garmin. A guy rolled up in a diesel Dodge Ram pickup and asked if I was ok or needed a ride somewhere. I told him I was ok, just checking a map to see which was to go. He said if I was turning left to let him know so he could get his dogs.

Good to hear. Years ago, 14/15 or so, when I was in the Army National Guard, we'd train at Camp Maxy. I'd throw my Davidson in one of the trucks for our convoy from Dallas to Paris. I'd usually manage to get in one or two 25 mile rides over drill weekend. I never had any issues with cars. Nice roads up there too.

In Austin I've not had a problem in a month or so. A drunk WASP, 60 YO, beeotch, pulled up next to me at a light and started yelling at me. I asked, "Isn't it early to be drinking?" She got more pissed so I pulled the phone out and asked, "Shall I can the police so we can discuss this further?" She punched it and drove off in her clapped out Expedition...people...

[cmbicycles]

Originally Posted by jumphigher

I didnt read this whole thread but understand you're feelings very well, OP. I moved from Portland about a year ago to Richmond. Had plenty of problems over the years there with aggressive drivers on my daily 30-60 mile training rides.
Things have been better here, generally most people are very accomodating, but.. there's the occasional assh*ole that purposly comes really close, or is obviously tring to force me into the ditch. The roads where I ride are really narrow, and people drive fast, so I also worry about an unskilled driver simply hitting me by accident. I've had some close calls, and get regular use of my middle finger, as well.

I'm planning on eventually giving up road riding, it's just too dangerous, imo. I dont tell my wife most of the incidences, she like yours, isnt too crazy about my riding the roads with cars either. Also she rides with me sometimes, so we'll probably switch to trails eventually.

And now I'm off to my 40 mile 6am ride..

Try to ride the loop out at West Creek 6-8 times or so... boring, but on weekends its a nice place to ride/run. Not sure where in Richmond you are, but I also find the riding out in Goochland/Rockville areas pretty good. Of course there are still certain times of day I won't ride anywhere, but that's my take.

[weisan]

I approached this two ways and they have drastically reduced the angst and stress involved with road riding.


First - the route.

I have become very picky and intentional when it comes to where I ride. I don't even bother with riding on urban area or highways anymore, even if they have big shoulders. I just don't. I know this may not be practical for some people depending on where they live. I am out in the country in less than 2-3 miles from the house so that makes things easier. I don't mind doing the same route for the umpteen times because it's better than risking the alternative of riding in high-traffic, noisy and hazardous areas.




Second - I started attaching a small rearview mirror that I rigged up with Velcro strap somewhere around the bend on the left side of my handlebar. It's relatively small and inconspicuous. And what it does is, it allows me to see the cars coming up behind me 1/2 mile away. As they approach and get closer where I know they can see me clearly and have enough time to react, I will stick my hand out quickly and then pull back way before they pass. 100% of the time...yes, this has not failed yet, not even once, I observed that the car would either move to the left and create a space before they pass or stay behind until it's safe to pass and there are no incoming traffic from the opposite lane. It's almost a natural reaction. They are responding to a human being who is requesting that they acknowledge his presence and please allow him some space and safety. It doesn't matter who they are...rednecks, big diesel truck, bus, truck pulling trailer, sports car, whatever you can think of, as soon as they see my hand out, they all started to move to the left. And after they pass, I would give them a wave to say "thank you" and I will make sure I do it when they can see me from their rear mirror. Because I really want to thank them in person if possible for being so understanding and humane. Ever since I instituted this safety feature to my riding, I have never encountered another instance of cars coming up too close to me. And I prefer this to the ones attached to helmets.

This is an advice that I only give out to people who are seriously interested in making their rides safer. It's field-tested and it really works. If you want to come and criticize this idea, I prefer that you just shut your mouth and don't say anything, just F.O. especially if you haven't try it yourself, you have no right to criticize. We are talking about personal safety and peace of mind so it's worth the extra trouble and suffering a bit on the "style" points or aerodynamics.

Oh, and that behavior that I see some of my riding buddies do...in "asserting your rights" by riding further out the road and thereby making it unsafe for cars to pass....that's the absolute worst thing you can do to anger and irritate drivers. They don't respond to that well. It's counter-productive. It doesn't work. It's dumb.

Lastly, this is a two-way street. Many times, I have either pull to the side or slow down and let others pass because I don't want to endanger them or put the driver in a difficult situation. This can't be just about us, we are sharing the road...so, share.

[mcteague]

My approach these days is to pick times with the least traffic, this means after 9AM on weekdays or early on weekends. I stick to smaller roads when I can and avoid any long stretches of straight road. This is when drivers feel they can check their phones and not go off the road. No matter how stupid they are, chances are phone checking is at a minimum on curvy roads. I now sport a CygoLite Hotshot Pro rear light. I also wear a white helmet and mostly light colored jerseys. I never understand why cyclists wear black ones!

Where I live there are no real gravel roads of any length and my mt bike days are behind me so road riding it is. I am under no illusion this makes me completely safe but every little bit helps.

Tim

[oldpotatoe]

[QUOTE=weisan;2395599]

This is an advice that I only give out to people who are seriously interested in making their rides safer. It's field-tested and it really works. If you want to come and criticize this idea, I prefer that you just shut your mouth and don't say anything, just F.O. especially if you haven't try it yourself, you have no right to criticize. We are talking about personal safety and peace of mind so it's worth the extra trouble and suffering a bit on the "style" points or aerodynamics.

The truth is, this is a community of many voices.

So much for the 'one big happy family with lotsa points of view' forum concept..get off the wrong side of the bike this morning -'pal'??

[ducati2]

Wow....That’s one of the most amazing things I have read on Paceline, and that’s saying something!

[FlashUNC]

Originally Posted by weisan

I approached this two ways and they have drastically reduced the angst and stress involved with road riding.


First - the route.

I have become very picky and intentional when it comes to where I ride. I don't even bother with riding on urban area or highways anymore, even if they have big shoulders. I just don't. I know this may not be practical for some people depending on where they live. I am out in the country in less than 2-3 miles from the house so that makes things easier. I don't mind doing the same route for the umpteen times because it's better than risking the alternative of riding in high-traffic, noisy and hazardous areas.


Second - I started attaching a small rearview mirror that I rigged up with Velcro strap somewhere around the bend on the left side of my handlebar. It's relatively small and inconspicuous. And what it does is, it allows me to see the cars coming up behind me 1/2 mile away. As they approach and get closer where I know they can see me clearly and have enough time to react, I will stick my hand out quickly and then pull back way before they pass. 100% of the time...yes, this has not failed yet, not even once, I observed that the car would either move to the left and create a space before they pass or stay behind until it's safe to pass and there are no incoming traffic from the opposite lane. It's almost a natural reaction. They are responding to a human being who is requesting that they acknowledge his presence and please allow him some space and safety. It doesn't matter who they are...rednecks, big diesel truck, bus, truck pulling trailer, sports car, whatever you can think of, as soon as they see my hand out, they all started to move to the left. And after they pass, I would give them a wave to say "thank you" and I will make sure I do it when they can see me from their rear mirror. Because I really want to thank them in person if possible for being so understanding and humane. Ever since I instituted this safety feature to my riding, I have never encountered another instance of cars coming up too close to me. And I prefer this to the ones attached to helmets.

This is an advice that I only give out to people who are seriously interested in making their rides safer. It's field-tested and it really works. If you want to come and criticize this idea, I prefer that you just shut your mouth and don't say anything, just F.O. especially if you haven't try it yourself, you have no right to criticize. We are talking about personal safety and peace of mind so it's worth the extra trouble and suffering a bit on the "style" points or aerodynamics.

Oh, and that behavior that I see some of my riding buddies do...in "asserting your rights" by riding further out the road and thereby making it unsafe for cars to pass....that's the absolute worst thing you can do to anger and irritate drivers. They don't respond to that well. It's counter-productive. It doesn't work. It's dumb.

Lastly, this is a two-way street. Many times, I have either pull to the side or slow down and let others pass because I don't want to endanger them or put the driver in a difficult situation. This can't be just about us, we are sharing the road...so, share.

I'd rather assert my rights and have someone see me and be annoyed than not see me and clip me because they're not paying attention.

It isn't right for every situation, but it definitely works to promote safety.

[Tickdoc]

wow, this post has me feeling lucky to live where I do, and to be as lucky as I have.

The risk v benefit is still keeping me on the road for now, but I can always choose the trails if needed ( I hate the trails, even though ours are really nice)

Lights even in the daytime are standard for me now, unless on a group ride. Bought a mirror and attached to my helmet about two years ago. It is such a fred thing but I am addicted to it now. I instinctively pull far over when I know someone is passing, and I keep my driver interactions to a minumum, especially when out in bfe.

Do what you can but there isn't anything you can do, really. Just roll the dice and go for a ride.

[bigbill]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

I'd rather assert my rights and have someone see me and be annoyed than not see me and clip me because they're not paying attention.

It isn't right for every situation, but it definitely works to promote safety.

I do this on my road ride. I'm on a nice shoulder for much of one section but approaching town the shoulder goes away and while it's still a divided 4 lane, the right edge is a curb. Approaching this section, I look back and if there are cars coming, I wave my arm up and down and I move left into the lane. Once in the lane, I ride in the center so drivers have to move over to the other lane to pass and not squeeze me over. As I approach an intersection, I move to the left wheel track to lessen the chance that I'll get hooked by a right turning car. Riding assertive IME is the safest way. Make them notice you.

[teleguy57]

Originally Posted by weisan

This is an advice that I only give out to people who are seriously interested in making their rides safer. It's field-tested and it really works. If you want to come and criticize this idea, I prefer that you just shut your mouth and don't say anything, just F.O. especially if you haven't try it yourself, you have no right to criticize. We are talking about personal safety and peace of mind so it's worth the extra trouble and suffering a bit on the "style" points or aerodynamics.

Oh, and that behavior that I see some of my riding buddies do...in "asserting your rights" by riding further out the road and thereby making it unsafe for cars to pass....that's the absolute worst thing you can do to anger and irritate drivers. They don't respond to that well. It's counter-productive. It doesn't work. It's dumb.

I rarely comment on the back-and-forth stuff that goes on here, but since I just responded to a PM from you and commented that I appreciated your contributions here I feel compelled to make sure you didn't think I read this before saying that.

So -- who peed in your Cherios this morning? Telling others here to "f.o." doesn't sound like you, and I don't think it helpful to dialog.

I (and I bet almost everyone here) am serious about ride safety. Glad putting your hand out works for you. I'm not going to confuse drivers by something that could look like signalling intent to do something and then just "being there." Oh, wait. I was told not to comment...

Now, back to contributing positively to the content:

Last year I started riding with mirrors. Yup, plural. A while back I tried glasses/helmet mount. Couldn't make them work. Now using the Italian Road Mirror on both left and right bar ends. First, aesthetically it just looks better on both sides -- and we're all about the "look." But I find on double pacelines or in those situations where I'm on the left side of a lane (such as turning left) it's great to see behind me on both sides.

Rear flasher -- all the time now.

I am a fan of riding assertively -- not aggressively, but taking the lane as appropriate, signalling clearly to drivers with hand signals like pointing to a lane I'm taking as @bigbill has written.

And I'm a big fan of eye contact and showing appreciation by waving, smiling, etc.

We do share the road. Figure out how to do that is an ongoing responsibility I take seriously.

[Tony]

Originally Posted by Clean39T

Thanks for the commissary. I don't want to stop either. Maybe just shift focus and add in some other two-wheel fun to reduce the statistical exposure rate.

I was where your at several years ago, too many close calls. I added mtbing, something I enjoyed in the nineties and enjoying very much now!

[p nut]

Originally Posted by fiamme red

I've never thought much about running a rear blinky in the daytime. But yesterday, I was riding for a few miles on suburban roads a few hundred yards behind a cyclist who was using one, and I was surprised at what a difference it made.

I noticed the same with front lights as well. The difference it makes for DAYTIME visibility for cyclist is pretty astounding. I started riding with both front and rear lights couple years ago. And not the cheap 50lum Knog lights, either. Lezyne 500-900lum front and PDW rear lights for all my bikes. Although Dinotte has intrigued me as well.

weisan - when you stick your hand out, I'm assuming it's your left hand? Doesn't that signal a left hand turn?

[GregL]

Originally Posted by teleguy57

I am a fan of riding assertively -- not aggressively, but taking the lane as appropriate, signalling clearly to drivers with hand signals like pointing to a lane I'm taking as @bigbill has written.

And I'm a big fan of eye contact and showing appreciation by waving, smiling, etc.

We do share the road. Figure out how to do that is an ongoing responsibility I take seriously.

^^^ IMO, best advice thus far in this thread. I've found that effective cycling behavior (as quoted above) is the best way to ensure safety on the road. When motorists clearly know your intentions, they lose the "I didn't know what you were going to do" excuse.

I 100% agree with the positive message mentality (eye contact, waving, smiling, etc...) to reinforce good road user interaction. When another road user adheres to vehicle traffic law and (rightfully) gives me the right-of-way, I make sure to give them a smile, wave, and a "thank you" when windows are open. I often thank motorists for courteous driving if circumstances allow. I even exchanged compliments with a driver at a country three-way intersection. We both complimented each other for signaling and stopping. A little friendliness goes a long way!!

The collective "we" are all ambassadors for cycling. We all have to do our part to make cycling a safe, friendly experience. And for everyone who has bad road cycling experiences in their part of the world, please come for a visit to central New York. We have miles of lightly-traveled roads. Most roads have wide shoulders (thanks to our high tax burden). And in my experience, central New Yorker drivers tend to be friendly and polite! I'm happy to lead you on roads I love.

Greg