Update 2 --Post Spinal Surgery,

[Ken Robb]

Originally Posted by jgar12

What's up with backs? How come you guys needing all these massive surgeries and how can I avoid them?

Don't get old.

[Ozz]

Originally Posted by ken robb

don't get old.

+1

[dancinkozmo]

Originally Posted by steveandbarb1

Update day 13. Surgery not fun, one reason they usually beef people up with some steroids to reduce pain/inflammation, I got none due to my diabetes. Surgery prep was 1 hour and surgery itself 1 hour. In hospital for 2 days. Now I am walking about 1 - 1.5 miles a day split up, finally passed on using the walking sticks. Can't pick up more than 5 lbs, and can't walk the dogs. XLIF is totally different, going in from the side, I have zero pain in my spine...weird... but radiating pain from side down into my groin/leg kind of stinks. Sciatica not gone, just bit different. Put my leg over my firefly and wanted so bad to get out on it. Going to ride my daughters hybrid when doctor clears, probably on the 8th of Aug. Huge difference than posterior approach, hope it will work.

keep on keeping on !
wishing you a speedy recovery !!

[buddybikes]

>>What's up with backs? How come you guys needing all these massive surgeries and how can I avoid them?


Like any ortho body part, things break down more in some people. Injuries or deformaties can exasperate things. In my case, heredity

[Onno]

I just had ALIF (going in through the front)--put a spacer and bone growth factor at L5-S1 to try to deal with perennial lower back pain. That was 2 weeks ago. I'm already feeling a lot better--can walk a couple of miles, and the post-op pain is mostly gone. The sharp back pain I used to have is already gone too, although there's still a dull ache, which I assume (hope!) is still pain from the surgery.

Anyone (perhaps OP?) have any idea how long before one can get back on a stationary bike (i.e. Zwift)? I sat on my bike yesterday for the first time, and did 20 easy minutes. Felt fine while I did it, but a bit achy afterwards. I don't want to be stupid, but I'm also going nuts not getting any exercise while we are having the most beautiful summer in years!

[David Tollefson]

I'm now 5 weeks post surgery for similar (L3-L4 microdiscectomy and laminectomy, and L5-S1 microdiscectomy). The L3-L4 issue came on about 5 weeks prior to the already-scheduled L5-S1 surgery date, and MRI convinced the doc (and insurance) to do both at the same time rather than go through the 10-month ordeal I've been dealing with on the L5-S1 issue (some centralization, ineffective PT and ineffective cortisone injection).

I was able to start walking around the house immediately, and within 2 weeks I was doing a couple miles a day. At 4 weeks I was cleared to do stationary bike (trainer). So that has done much to keep my sanity.

The good: The L3-L4 issue seems to have been remedied.

The not-so-good: The L5-S1 seems to be slowly returning to pre-surgery state, though slightly different. The pain *level* is a bit less, but more constant. I'm on continual ibuprofen/acetaminophen to tame the constant nature, but all the triggers for pain remain. I have my second follow-up next week.

For those using CBD -- details please? What are you using? How much? (I'm in Washington, so it's legal here.)

TIA

[gone]

Reading this thread with great interest as I have a microdiscectomy scheduled for Sept 4.

I had a major episode on June 8 (4 days of the worst pain I've ever experienced) that has *very* gradually gotten better. As of today, my forefoot is numb, my calf is tight/burning and pain in my lower back.

I've had cycling related back trouble (I can obviously hurt it by dead lifting a VW, I avoid doing that) since 2014. The frequency, severity and recovery time have been increasing with three cycling related episodes since November. Up until November, pain has been localized to my back but since then increasing sciatic involvement.

MRI shows herniated disc at L5/S1 "with associated trauma".

Not sure what to hope for. If it "resolves" itself between now and September I could cancel the surgery but then I'm on the same train I've been riding since 2014 so I'd sort of "like" to get the surgery done. Having said that, surgical risk, etc., makes me feel like I should avoid it until I'm essentially a cripple but nerve degradation worries me.

Oh, and FWIW, I've done all the conservative stuff (core strengthening, acupuncture, bike fits, ...) over the years.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by Onno

I just had ALIF (going in through the front)--put a spacer and bone growth factor at L5-S1 to try to deal with perennial lower back pain.

I had the same surgery 18 months ago. Recovery was rough for me, although the first week or two were easier than the roller coaster of the first few months.

I probably pushed too hard to get back on the bike (mostly indoors) at first, I think I was back on the trainer within a week or two of the surgery although it was for very short rides. Everyone's different, but it really took me a year until I felt really good again - part of my issue was that I had to defer the surgery for a long time as the doctors didnt think that not being able to ride my bike for several hours was a treatable medical condition while both my discomfort and fitness deteriorated and it made the road back much tougher.

Happy to share my own experience if you have questions....

[Onno]

I had also done all the conservative stuff for years, including oblation and injections, which worked for a while, but then didn't. Cycling hurt the least of all the sports I like to do. I've given up tennis and squash years ago (those REALLY hurt), and was going to have to give up xc skiing, because that also hurt quite a lot. Running has also really been a problem the past year or two. It was the idea of having to give up skiing that really pushed me to surgery. A local surgeon was recommending microdiscectomy until I made clear that 90% of the pain is lower back, and not sciatica. Then he recommended fusion of 3 vertebrae with pretty major surgery and hardware. Sought a second opinion, and he recommended ALIF of just L5-S1, which is far less major surgery. So I've taken a risk on that, hoping that this takes care of much of the pain, but guessing that it probably won't cure all of it. Backs are just too complicated.

I'm just trying to figure out how to safely get back to exercise. I don't see the surgeon again until next week, 3 and a half weeks out. I really am trying to take it easy, but I guess I don't really understand what is happening at the fusing joint. What can go wrong there if I do too much? There's no real hardware (no rods or bolts), just 2 plates and a spacer, as I understand it.

[gone]

Originally Posted by Onno

I'm just trying to figure out how to safely get back to exercise. I don't see the surgeon again until next week, 3 and a half weeks out. I really am trying to take it easy, but I guess I don't really understand what is happening at the fusing joint. What can go wrong there if I do too much? There's no real hardware (no rods or bolts), just 2 plates and a spacer, as I understand it.

This would be one area where I'd take no chances. Wait until after you've seen the surgeon and have definite answers to your questions. It'd be awful to undo the surgery and have to have it again or an even more major surgery.

Patience!

(Note that I'm probably the least patient patient in the world).

[Onno]

Originally Posted by .RJ

I had the same surgery 18 months ago. Recovery was rough for me, although the first week or two were easier than the roller coaster of the first few months.

I probably pushed too hard to get back on the bike (mostly indoors) at first, I think I was back on the trainer within a week or two of the surgery although it was for very short rides. Everyone's different, but it really took me a year until I felt really good again - part of my issue was that I had to defer the surgery for a long time as the doctors didnt think that not being able to ride my bike for several hours was a treatable medical condition while both my discomfort and fitness deteriorated and it made the road back much tougher.

Happy to share my own experience if you have questions....

Interesting! My doctors certainly seemed to get that giving up forms of exercise was serious enough, and I guess the MRI of the degenerated disc was clear enough that insurance had no issues.

Do you just let pain be your guide in the recovery? Anything you did during the recovery that you think was a mistake?

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by Onno

Interesting! My doctors certainly seemed to get that giving up forms of exercise was serious enough, and I guess the MRI of the degenerated disc was clear enough that insurance had no issues.

I think if I was maybe in a place where recreation was more a priority then I'd have been able to get it done sooner. But everyone in DC seems to care about their desk jobs. I had 2 years of declining fitness and several times I had to quit a ride because my left leg just refused to work.

Originally Posted by Onno

Do you just let pain be your guide in the recovery? Anything you did during the recovery that you think was a mistake?

Basically. Once its pinned together there's little risk of damaging the joint, even more so when the bone starts to grow through.

My mistake was focusing too much about getting back on the bike and back to fitness - i was on the trainer within a week and it was painful but I just pushed through it. I should have done more walking instead, and more time on my other hobbies like photography. Its a very long road back and its an invasive procedure thats pretty disruptive in a lot of ways - I had some GI issues for a few weeks, too. I also had a lot of other stuff going on that wasnt helpful - we had just moved, planning a kitchen renovation (contracted out, thankfully) and my brother in law moving in with us for 6 months - none of it was good for my recovery.

[buddybikes]

Problem with microdiscectomy w/o instrumentation is that level is now missing stuff - thus risk of breaking down and needing fusion increases.

Also, which sucks for all of us lumbar problems - do one level now and chance of upper/lower level goes up. I had L4/5 Dec 2015, went back in for L3/L4 July 2019 (later was XLIF).

Wish you luck. These decisions what/how much to do often end up with us patients.

[bigbill]

Originally Posted by David Tollefson

I'm now 5 weeks post surgery for similar (L3-L4 microdiscectomy and laminectomy, and L5-S1 microdiscectomy). The L3-L4 issue came on about 5 weeks prior to the already-scheduled L5-S1 surgery date, and MRI convinced the doc (and insurance) to do both at the same time rather than go through the 10-month ordeal I've been dealing with on the L5-S1 issue (some centralization, ineffective PT and ineffective cortisone injection).

I was able to start walking around the house immediately, and within 2 weeks I was doing a couple miles a day. At 4 weeks I was cleared to do stationary bike (trainer). So that has done much to keep my sanity.

The good: The L3-L4 issue seems to have been remedied.

The not-so-good: The L5-S1 seems to be slowly returning to pre-surgery state, though slightly different. The pain *level* is a bit less, but more constant. I'm on continual ibuprofen/acetaminophen to tame the constant nature, but all the triggers for pain remain. I have my second follow-up next week.

For those using CBD -- details please? What are you using? How much? (I'm in Washington, so it's legal here.)

TIA

I took 6 weeks before getting on a bike. By that point was walking 4 miles in an hour on a flat gravel path. Two years after surgery, I had issues with scar tissue and some muscle atrophy in the affected side calf. I've been to a neurologist and the nerve root is likely damaged but it has not worsened in the past three years. It doesn't affect my riding although my calves are different sizes. It impacts my hiking sometimes because one leg is stronger when I push off so I time my steps if I'm climbing steep terrain.

CBD, I get it from Farmhouse Hemp because I can't have THC. I put it in tea in the evening and it seems to complement the Meloxicam I take in the morning. I take 15mg of Meloxicam every other day and never need anything else such as Tylenol or IB.

[David Tollefson]

Originally Posted by steveandbarb1

Problem with microdiscectomy w/o instrumentation is that level is now missing stuff - thus risk of breaking down and needing fusion increases.

I was wondering about this. And thinking that maybe this is why I'm getting the L5-S1 symptoms back already -- the hole where "the jelly is squeezing out of the donut" is still there, and nothing is preventing recurrance other than the hope that he fibrous surround will heal.