New Gravel Bike vs 2015ish XC MTB

[claytramey]

Looking at the geometry, today's gravel bikes are not getting that far off from 2015 era xc race bikes. Anyone have any feedback on monstercrossing one of these older xc bikes with drop bars and making it a dedicated gravel bike? To get a proper fit I would prob need to size down on the xc bike.

Been looking at the Cannondale F-Si, Sworks Epic HT, and BMC TeamElite from that era.

[.RJ]

Works awesome, its so nice to set it up with the drooper post and wide flared bars, it really rips on gravel. Not much slower than my CX bike on most rides.

[.RJ]

Some things that may help - either GRX or Sram 11speed hydro is the way to go with these, so you can use the left shifter to operate a drooper post, although with Sram I was able to fine a setup here with post mount brake calipers already, so easy button.

Most droopers put the cable head at the post, and this makes it far less fussy to install it wont work with road shifters - I have a shimano pro post on mine where the cable runs opposite, and it was a pain to install. I got it cheap I guess because no one buys these because of the backwards cable routing and somewhat limited droop (125mm). Most of these older frames have provisions/routing for front derailleurs so you can use that - if you have external cable routing I'm not sure what options are out there. Get the thing installed and working before putting the crank in, if the cables run internal since you'll need to get it through the BB shell. This one I have has an EBB so the shell is huge and that made it far easier.

My stem is ~30-40mm shorter than if I was using flat bars, with 44cm salsa cowbells - I normally use a 42cm shallow drop bar.

I've got 29x2.0 s-works renegades and they're pretty rad, switching to 29x2.25 schwalbe g-ones next.

I build this as a proof of concept of the idea and I dig it, and I'm in the queue to get a custom version next winter - some things I'd like to change are to steepen the seat tube a bit to push the front center out, drop the BB, shorten up the chainstays and slacken the head tube a hair... and make it out of metal instead of the **** carbon this one is built out of.

[benb]

I've tried to ride a lot of the same trails on my MTB and my Gravel bike..

It's really going to depend on your local terrain, what your goals are, how technically skilled you are, lots of factors.

Both my gravel bike & MTB are fairly old.. it would be really hard when one or both really break to decide what I'd rather have if I decide I don't want both.

Unless you're comparing a fully rigid MTB the MTB is still going to really come into it's own and be much better on certain trails. Big tires don't really help deal with weight distribution issues when you hit a really steep descent. The drop bars still feel like a liability to me on a steep descent no matter what else is done, and if you keep raising them and bringing them back you start feeling like you compromised too much on easy/flat terrain where a gravel bike is naturally superior. Suspension forks are obviously really nice once you start getting into rough stuff at speed.

For some reason the MTB brakes continue to be far better in those situations too, even though gravel bikes obviously can be had with hydraulic discs.

The flipside is anytime stuff is easy/buffed the gravel bike can be way more pleasant.

[claytramey]

Originally Posted by benb

I've tried to ride a lot of the same trails on my MTB and my Gravel bike..

It's really going to depend on your local terrain, what your goals are, how technically skilled you are, lots of factors.

Both my gravel bike & MTB are fairly old.. it would be really hard when one or both really break to decide what I'd rather have if I decide I don't want both.

Unless you're comparing a fully rigid MTB the MTB is still going to really come into it's own and be much better on certain trails. Big tires don't really help deal with weight distribution issues when you hit a really steep descent. The drop bars still feel like a liability to me on a steep descent no matter what else is done, and if you keep raising them and bringing them back you start feeling like you compromised too much on easy/flat terrain where a gravel bike is naturally superior. Suspension forks are obviously really nice once you start getting into rough stuff at speed.

For some reason the MTB brakes continue to be far better in those situations too, even though gravel bikes obviously can be had with hydraulic discs.

The flipside is anytime stuff is easy/buffed the gravel bike can be way more pleasant.

Yeah I have a yeti sb130 to ride on singletrack and an allied Alfa to ride on the road so this would be used solely for gravel with most rides consisting of no pavement.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by benb

I've tried to ride a lot of the same trails on my MTB and my Gravel bike..

It's really going to depend on your local terrain, what your goals are, how technically skilled you are, lots of factors.

Yup. The one I built is very much an in between / goldilocks bike for rougher/steeper/chunkier gravel, and also for bikepacking gravel. Its not a very good mountain bike and its a little sluggish for road, so...

Originally Posted by claytramey

Very nice, yeah those niner Air’s are awesome. Do you ride the same frame size as you do with flat bars?

Yup, same size just shorter stem!

[spoonrobot]

XC conversion to drop-bar - fit comes from shorter stem (speed up steering), wider bars (slow down steering), and higher bars (ride in the drops). If you size down often you end up too far forward for technical and fast riding and the bars are too low without high rise stem. You want to be around 5-40mm stem length so you can stay in a good spot relative to the front wheel pivot point.

If you know your contact points run potential bikes through bikegeo.net to see how things stack up. IMO, it's very hard to maximize the potential of the bike if your handlebars are much lower than your saddle.

I've converted three different XC bikes to drop bars, mainly for racing in the N GA mountains and riding the single-track near my house. I've also done a lot of gravel with them. The most relevant thing for you is that riding on the road or gravel, the aero and hysteresis losses are huge. Enough that I went from the B+ group to the C group the few times I raced flat or mixed gravel races or group rides. This was using the fastest tires I could find and optimizing my position for the races, still a big change.

That said, my drop bar MTB is the most fun bike I own. I ride it more than my regular MTB or gravel bikes and it is a phenomenal racing bike for mountain races where the field is split between MTB and gravel. I heartily recommend trying a conversion.

[owly]

Ideally I'd be looking for a frame which has a shorter reach and taller stack than the majority. That way you don't have to run such a short stem to get the fit right. One of the carbon Cube wsd frames from a couple years back was the best match I came across when hunting around.

One of the riser style flared drop bars with sub55mm reach from Japan could be a fit option also.

[.RJ]

Originally Posted by owly

Ideally I'd be looking for a frame which has a shorter reach and taller stack than the majority.

Anything from 5-10 years ago will be much shorter than the new stuff sold with 40-50mm stems and wide bars, and will be QR or 15/142 axles so easy to find cheap wheels for.

[claytramey]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

XC conversion to drop-bar - fit comes from shorter stem (speed up steering), wider bars (slow down steering), and higher bars (ride in the drops). If you size down often you end up too far forward for technical and fast riding and the bars are too low without high rise stem. You want to be around 5-40mm stem length so you can stay in a good spot relative to the front wheel pivot point.

If you know your contact points run potential bikes through bikegeo.net to see how things stack up. IMO, it's very hard to maximize the potential of the bike if your handlebars are much lower than your saddle.

I've converted three different XC bikes to drop bars, mainly for racing in the N GA mountains and riding the single-track near my house. I've also done a lot of gravel with them. The most relevant thing for you is that riding on the road or gravel, the aero and hysteresis losses are huge. Enough that I went from the B+ group to the C group the few times I raced flat or mixed gravel races or group rides. This was using the fastest tires I could find and optimizing my position for the races, still a big change.

That said, my drop bar MTB is the most fun bike I own. I ride it more than my regular MTB or gravel bikes and it is a phenomenal racing bike for mountain races where the field is split between MTB and gravel. I heartily recommend trying a conversion.

A lot of good info here. Thank you!

[p nut]

Why don’t you just get a proper monster cross? ie, Wolverine, Gorilla Monsoon, Fargo, Flannimal, etc. that can take big fat MTB tires?

All the mountain bikes I’ve converted to dropbars have never worked out for me. Funky handling/geo.

[charliedid]

Chamois Hagar

[girlscantell]

Originally Posted by p nut

Why don’t you just get a proper monster cross? ie, Wolverine, Gorilla Monsoon, Fargo, Flannimal, etc. that can take big fat MTB tires?



All the mountain bikes I’ve converted to dropbars have never worked out for me. Funky handling/geo.

YES. I went back and forth and eventually converted an old mountain bike. It didn't do the smooth gravel well. I just got a Black Mountain Monster Cross Disc and will never go back. So much fun to ride on bad roads and gravel. Even the smoother singletrack.

[claytramey]

Originally Posted by .RJ

Works awesome, its so nice to set it up with the drooper post and wide flared bars, it really rips on gravel. Not much slower than my CX bike on most rides.

Very nice, yeah those niner Air’s are awesome. Do you ride the same frame size as you do with flat bars?

[azrider]

Originally Posted by .RJ

Works awesome, its so nice to set it up with the drooper post and wide flared bars, it really rips on gravel. Not much slower than my CX bike on most rides.

Woah...........i wished I hadn't of seen this.......


Now I want one.