Unethical Strava

[joosttx]

https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/07/...m-dispute.html

I don’t have a problem with Strava nixing Relive from their platform but I do have a problem and I bet a court of law will too with Strava leading it’s subscribers to believe Relive was being unethical with user’s data while it was a ploy to stifle competition.

[LJohnny]

Yes, I closed my Strava account. I don’t even use Relive, but that just told me I don’t want to give any more of my data to Strava.

[marciero]

Non Strava user but I find this interesting. Agree that the letter appears to be a total misrepresentation. It’s not surprising that API agreements like this would be written with rather broad restrictions-Under no circumstances can you do ANYTHING with the data! As DC points out, the agreement prohibits some of the activities that the API is designed to facilitate, and which they tout elsewere. And it appears that Strava is arbitrarily/selectively enforcing their the agreement since other third party apps are doing the same types of things, and just bullying Relive.

[peanutgallery]

So....Strava, being a software company and not a hardware company, gets all "their" data from 3rd party devices. This is like a chicken/egg question for Silicon valley. This can only be solved by more attorneys and MBAs with like a year of practical experience

Guessing monetization thru subscription isn't going well. Dial up another round of funding...find some more suckers

[madsciencenow]

Originally Posted by peanutgallery

So....Strava, being a software company and not a hardware company, gets all "their" data from 3rd party devices. This is like a chicken/egg question for Silicon valley. This can only be solved by more attorneys and MBAs with like a year of practical experience



Guessing monetization thru subscription isn't going well. Dial up another round of funding...find some more suckers

If they would actually develop features I’d be happy to pay but as it sits now they don’t offer anything compelling beyond the basic subscription.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MattTuck]

I'm a bit ambivalent on this one. Strava doesn't owe any 3rd party app access to their system. When you develop a system that is predicated on another platform, you need to realize you're at the whim of that system.

At the same time, it does seem pretty sleazy for strava to do that. And I say that as a long time fan/user of Strava, and have a special interest in them for a number of reasons.

I'm a big proponent of competition, and firmly believe that competition drives innovation and benefits consumers. So when I see something like this, which has tinges of anti-competitiveness, it definitely rubs me the wrong way.

[FlashUNC]

Strava gonna Strava.

[joosttx]

Originally Posted by FlashUNC

Strava gonna Strava.

Sooooo true.

[simonov]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

I'm a bit ambivalent on this one. Strava doesn't owe any 3rd party app access to their system. When you develop a system that is predicated on another platform, you need to realize you're at the whim of that system.

At the same time, it does seem pretty sleazy for strava to do that. And I say that as a long time fan/user of Strava, and have a special interest in them for a number of reasons.

I'm a big proponent of competition, and firmly believe that competition drives innovation and benefits consumers. So when I see something like this, which has tinges of anti-competitiveness, it definitely rubs me the wrong way.

The part in bold is spot on and like Strava or not, they're not a public utility. They clearly aren't great at PR either and definitely could/should have handled things differently (at least in the court of public opinion). Hell, even a little bit of self-reflection would have helped them realize the irony of themselves being partially dependent on other systems like Garmin/Wahoo to get much of their data. But, they owe Relieve nothing. And if Relieve was adding features that encroached on Strava's features, Relieve shouldn't have been surprised to get cut off. Competition would have been Relieve standing independently as a service to track and visualize activity data. But that's not what it is. If anything, it's more like a remora than a challenger/competitor. So, yeah, Strava sucks, but that's the way it goes in the world of software.

[unterhausen]

I appreciated the fact that they split their service into 3 parts and kept the price the same. I should probably subscribe, but I haven't. I wonder if it actually cost them money. This contrasts well to ride with gps that made it so I had to pay their top individual rate just to be able to add things to my cue sheets.

[54ny77]

Strava and all this hand-wringing is a really weird paradigm.

So much for just going out and riding with buddies or actual people, where you will know right then and there if you're sucking wind, or if everybody is riding at a mellow pace you're just enjoying the day.

Clearly, this app has become a big enough feature of people's lives that they actually care.

[benb]

Tough scenario but I don't see this going that well for Strava.

Garmin or someone else can come along and crush them if motivation happens.

I have let my Summit/Premier membership lapse periodically and then will reactivate it.

But it's tough.. right now I don't have a Summit membership because:
- Most of the summit features are training based
- They haven't added any meaningful features in years
- Other applications are a much better use of $$ than Strava Summit if you are getting down to the nitty gritty training details

The Strava feed for me has benefit in seeing what rides other people I know are doing. This can have a motivating effect for me. But in the last few years that motivational factor has gone down the tubes because the feed is cluttered up with Zwift rides, Peloton rides, etc.. and last time I looked they don't have a way to hide that stuff.

I have been using it less and less this year, though that is partly because I don't have a goal oriented cycling focus this year. And maybe the whole goal oriented focus of these applications is a bad thing for me anyway...

[dbnm]

My Summit membership expires next month and I have no reason to renew. There are no new features and I cannot take part in monthly challenges if my profile is private.

Oh well.

[Bostic]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

When you develop a system that is predicated on another platform, you need to realize you're at the whim of that system.

This reminds me of the article I read in the local newspaper regarding the amount of money one gets from gathering up scooters and charging them overnight. At first things were great and the pay was worth the effort. Then it became too successful with people fighting over scooters to round up and the scooter companies started paying much less. Plus the scooters got heavier and bulkier so less could fit in an SUV or Minivan.

[benb]

Originally Posted by MattTuck

I'm a bit ambivalent on this one. Strava doesn't owe any 3rd party app access to their system. When you develop a system that is predicated on another platform, you need to realize you're at the whim of that system.

Relive is dependent on Strava and is predicated on Strava.

But Strava is also predicated on/dependent on Garmin Connect, Suunto's platform, Wahoo's platform, etc..

In some sense it must be scary for Strava too. Relive exists because Strava is not filling a desired feature that users on their platform want.

Strava exists because Garmin/Suunto/Wahoo/etc.. are not filling a desired feature that users on those platforms want.

It is interesting that Garmin has actually tried to start encroaching on Strava's features for years now they just haven't put enough effort into to make it worthwhile to use.

So I'd imagine in the case of Strava they must realize they are in the same position and exist at the whim of some of the other systems. You can use the Strava phone app but I'd imagine a lot of their user base uses dedicated cycling GPS units. Strava also exists at the whim of Google & Apple. Either one of those companies could put a big hurt on Strava if they decided the Strava app was violating the TOS of the iOS/Android platforms.

The features have been so stagnant in the Strava phone applications for so many years that I'd imagine they know people don't use the phone app as a primary upload point/analysis point. There's alway be been so much missing from the apps compared to the website, which is jarring if you also use something like Training Peaks or even Garmin Connect where you can see most of the info on the phone app.

It takes a ton of work to make an add on or plugin or whatever for anything in the software world.. you have to realize if people are starting companies and building products that piggy back off yours you might be missing the boat in terms of features. StravistX is another one I've used... everything it does is stuff Strava could have/should have added and didn't.