Rivendell saved for now...

[colker]

Originally Posted by Burnette

It doesn't but we all go to bike boards to talk bikes and the Riv story is a good one. You bring up an excellent point here too. By putting all his stuff out there online I would wager it has hurt the image of the place quite a bit. You know as well as anyone, you have to protect your brand and the blog has done much harm IMO.

Don't you reckon that it may have had an effect on someone wanting to place a high dollar order with them, people who sell to them on credit, people who might want to invest in the place?

The story has legs because he blogs. And what he blogs, love him or not, is off the charts. I mean if you read it as a reader untethered to the place it's wild stuff.

Add to that, the asking for donations and blog updates that go one step higher and yes, it's going to get plenty of responses.

Agree.

[Spoker]

Originally Posted by e-RICHIE

Agreed.
Nothing that happens or is discussed here helps his current revenue problems either.

Why not?
There seems some sound advice hidden in the pages.

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by colker

Here is what i think: the luxury market in the US could be his best market and Riv is far away from these buyers.
It could be reached though. Maybe it could. It goes a bit against the soul of Riv... and against GP style, his blog etc.. But his bikes are the kind of thing the luxury market wants. Just like they are.

EDIT: Traditional materials. Comfort. Classic looks... It only takes a good marketing person to sort this thing out.

Honestly, bicycles would be one of the last things I would want to try and sell. Go to Adrenalinebikes, Wrenchscience and such, we are inundated with bike choices.

As far as the luxury market goes, I don't think so.

Hear me out though. The market for the Riv bikes posted recently in this thread are served by hybrids and comfort bikes. These consumers have plenty of bikes in the $300 and above range. And no way they are going to drop $1,400 to $3,000 on just a frame.

You guys came up with Riv and are in the club, there's not enough of you buying, he has to reach new people and pushing premium hybrids in this market is a tall ask.

In our current bicycle market there is no shortage of choices, and price erosion is real.

[Louis]

Originally Posted by Spoker

Why not?
There seems some sound advice hidden in the pages.

Choosing to rely on internet fora for advice to save your floundering business could well be a reflection of the iffy judgement that resulted in the problems in the first place.

[Joe Remi]

"Donations"

This is not a thing and I'm amazed it keeps getting repeated in this thread. GoFundMe is a donation, you get nothing in return but a receipt and a warm feeling in the heart for helping someone. Paying money for parts is not a donation. Thanks you.

[dancinkozmo]

can we call it 'begging' then ?

[Joe Remi]

Originally Posted by dancinkozmo

can we call it 'begging' then ?

Whatever makes you happy as long as it reflects money paid for stuff. "Donations" is a lie, and it this point seems to be an intentional one.

[geordanh]

Originally Posted by ravdg316

And below -- one of my favorite bikes ever photographed.

Absolute perfection. This is the sort of timeless stuff riv was built on that any bike enthusiast can appreciate.

This thread and current state are all kind of a bummer. The pic below to me always captured the spirit of it all. Shame if it went away despite all the reasons well hashed out already.

[bward1028]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

Whatever makes you happy as long as it reflects money paid for stuff. "Donations" is a lie, and it this point seems to be an intentional one.

"Interest-Free Loan"

[bfd]

Originally Posted by ravdg316

Top of my head --

1). Better website pictures. All their main pictures of their bikes are headbadges. This is sloppy and unacceptable.

2). 80/20 analysis -- analyze their product line using numbers from the past two years. Figure out the 20 percent of their store inventory and bicycle models that produce 80 percent of their sales, double down on those items and sell the rest at cost in a big sale. Clear warehouse space and free up some cash to re-invest and promote best-selling inventory.

3). Copywriting -- focus less on mocking modern parts and more on hyping the beauty, durability and ride of traditional steel. Honesty is good, but mocking the purchasing decisions of potential customers is bad. Grant needs somebody who'll be his editor and not be afraid to question his decisions to put particular ideas in print. He seems to write and publish on feel rather than research.

4). Advertising. I want to see a Hunqapiller with Ultegra 8000, or a silver Roadeo or Roadini with Campagnolo 12, Shamal Mille's and Compass Bon Jon Pass tires. Take tons of photos and submit to the Radavist. Then, get pictures of the same bikes with more traditional Rivendell parts (Tektro, Sugino etc.). Test and see which pictures do better.

5). Eliminate employees down to the essentials (80/20 rule again). Give raises to the employees who remain. Not sure how this will work from a managerial standpoint, but this will be the most difficult but necessary component.

6). Renegotiate terms with Taiwanese vendors. Not sure how much Grant has done here or how good Rivendell's credit is, but he'll need to have difficult conversations with his vendors to see about securing better payment terms than he has now, in exchange for ordering more good inventory up front/paying slightly more in exchange for cash flow.

You have a world-class copywriter on staff in Grant, who also happens to be one of the most knowledgeable and well-connected people in the entire industry. However, Grant seems to be operating unchecked and now seems to be depending on the goodwill he's cultivated over the years to keep his company running. I don't think it has to be that way. I think Rivendell can be saved. None of the above recommendations cost significant money to implement -- only time and the willingness to make difficult decisions.

And below -- one of my favorite bikes ever photographed.

One problem with this photo is Grant/Riv would have never approved of it! He doesn’t like modern equipment so they end up excluding an entire market segment.

Yes, you prefer touring or gravel or what he calls country bikes, cool sell it. But why exclude an entire market segment that could bring in much needed revenue?! I don’t get it?!

Good Luck!

[Joe Remi]

Originally Posted by bfd

One problem with this photo is Grant/Riv would have never approved of it! He doesn’t like modern equipment so they end up excluding an entire market segment.

Yes, you prefer touring or gravel or what he calls country bikes, cool sell it. But why exclude an entire market segment that could bring in much needed revenue?! I don’t get it?!

Good Luck!

One problem with that statement is you didn't do your research. The Roadeo was the replacement for the Rambouillet, and every photo in its listing has modern brifter drivetrains. One of the photos on the Roadini listing has SRAM stuff like this Ram.

https://www.rivbike.com/products/roadeo

[ravdg316]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

One problem with that statement is you didn't do your research. The Roadeo was the replacement for the Rambouillet, and every photo in its listing has modern brifter drivetrains. One of the photos on the Roadini listing has SRAM stuff like this Ram.

It's just lazy to make flippant comments like this without even bothering to click on the website first.

https://www.rivbike.com/products/roadeo

Joe, you're right here about the Roadeo and Rivendell's genuine willingness to let customers use modern-ish parts. However, Rivendell is still synonymous with terms like "Retro-Grouch." Reality may be different (a Google search shows the word "grouch" isn't used even once on the entire website), but public perception can't be denied.

Not every potential customer is going to dive deeply into Grant's nuanced philosophy on modern parts.

Riv's primary website photo is of a Sam Hillborne with Albatross bars placed way above the saddle, thumbshifters, long-reach brakes and a threaded headset. This is the first photo a brand new customer engages with on the site. There's nothing wrong with this, but the 30-something who's in decent shape and just spent a year on an entry-level Trek road bike is going to look at this picture and potentially be turned off altogether. It's just too far gone from what his buddies ride. He won't even bother digging deep enough into the site to discover the Roadeo. He's gone!

I would love to see Riv showcase a beautiful, lugged Riv road bike with a horizontal top tube and modern-ish parts as the primary photo. The Trek rider would immediately recognize it as something different but familiar and relatable, and Riv will then be able to ease that Trek rider gently into the Riv philosophy. Trekster's gotta learn to walk before he learns to run.

[R3awak3n]

Originally Posted by ravdg316

Joe, you're right here about the Roadeo and Rivendell's genuine willingness to let customers use modern-ish parts. However, Rivendell is still synonymous with terms like "Retro-Grouch." Reality may be different (a Google search shows the word "grouch" isn't used even once on the entire website), but public perception can't be denied.

Not every potential customer is going to dive deeply into Grant's nuanced philosophy on modern parts.

Riv's primary website photo is of a Sam Hillborne with Albatross bars placed way above the saddle, thumbshifters, long-reach brakes and a threaded headset. This is the first photo a brand new customer engages with on the site. There's nothing wrong with this, but the 30-something who's in decent shape and just spent a year on an entry-level Trek road bike is going to look at this picture and potentially be turned off altogether. It's just too far gone from what his buddies ride. He won't even bother digging deep enough into the site to discover the Roadeo. He's gone!

I would love to see Riv showcase a beautiful, lugged Riv road bike with a horizontal top tube and modern-ish parts as the primary photo. The Trek rider would immediately recognize it as something different but familiar and relatable, and Riv will then be able to ease that Trek rider gently into the Riv philosophy. Trekster's gotta learn to walk before he learns to run.

I am not sure about that. People that are into that aspect of road cycling do not want a Riv, even if the picture shows the bike kitted out with road parts. I don't think Rivs savior is in modern rim brake road bikes.

[Lewis Moon]

Originally Posted by R3awak3n

I am not sure about that. People that are into that aspect of road cycling do not want a Riv, even if the picture shows the bike kitted out with road parts. I don't think Rivs savior is in modern rim brake road bikes.

The trick is to marry the good stuff from modern tech with the beauty and class of the older bikes in a seamless manner that works and looks right. It's not one or the other.
And...keep it at a price point that allows said bike to be owned as one of several bikes, by real people.

[R3awak3n]

Originally Posted by Lewis Moon

The trick is to marry the good stuff from modern tech with the beauty and class of the older bikes in a seamless manner that works and looks right. It's not one or the other.
And...keep it at a price point that allows said bike to be owned as one of several bikes, by real people.

I bet that guy vapes