Crossing the Final Frontier: Electronic Shifting.

[Bob Ross]

Originally Posted by Eli Bingham

The other thing is the max 13T gap on the front for 2x.

Wait, wut?

Is that something new for AXS that didn't exist in previous versions of eTap?

'cuz I've been riding 11-speed eTap since early 2018 and the 34/50 chainrings work great.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by Bob Ross

Wait, wut?

Is that something new for AXS that didn't exist in previous versions of eTap?

'cuz I've been riding 11-speed eTap since early 2018 and the 34/50 chainrings work great.

Yes it is. All axs cranks have a 13T difference at the crank, which is why I don't use them. I'm using a shimano grx 48/31 crank with the chainline corrected to eliminate the +2.5mm, by way of spacing washers. A Campy 48/32 or grx 46/30 works too. Other 11 speed cranks will work, but a 50/34 makes for a really tall 50/10 top gear. All cassettes start with a 10T sprocket.

[Ozz]

Originally Posted by David Kirk

...I'm in the process of building myself a new ride and it will have eTap.
...

dave

I had to laugh a little to myself when I read this....

DK building himself a new ride, is much different than most of us building (up) a new ride.....

[Waldo62]

Originally Posted by zennmotion

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dict...ive-aggressive

Are we in the midst of some sort of East Bay - Marin throw down?

[weisan]

Originally Posted by Ozz

I had to laugh a little to myself when I read this....

DK building himself a new ride, is much different than most of us building (up) a new ride.....

I had to laugh a little to myself when I read this too...

On the contrary, seems to me that DK only get a "new" bike every few years while some of us change bikes like playing the next song on the album, on demand and frequent!

[Likes2ridefar]

Took me awhile to jump on the etap axs bandwagon. I always said I didn’t need it, and cables work just fine.

Well, I’m pretty confident I wouldn’t pick anything else other than axs etap right now.

My mullet setup took some smarter mechanics than I to dial in but now it works perfectly. Simply put, never had a bike that shifts so effortlessly and exactly in every gear, every time, or brake like my eagle 1x12 with hope rx4+ brakes.

[pasadena]

This was my mentality about it for a long time. Didn't get it at all.. until I rented a Di2 bike for a couple weeks on a trip... then it's clear how good electronic really is.

I still find some mechanical groups to be brilliant stuff, but for me, Di2 is a gamechanger.

I get the idea that a battery makes it seem ... unpure?
but it's really, as you say, a mental thing not a real downfall.

A battery, much like cables, can fail. However, the service life of a battery is far greater than a cable.

I have one Di2 groupset that is 6 yrs old and have not adjusted it once, nor replaced the battery. Literally no service or adjustment at all except replacing jockey wheels. Perfect shifts every time.

And the performance... it's just so good, it increases the enjoyment of the ride and the faster you ride, the better it is.

Originally Posted by osbk67

I'm often in a minority of nearly one on these things, but what the heck.

To me, deciding between mechanical and electronic shifting isn't a technological but a philosophical question.

Electronic shifting introduces an external power supply to what was previously an entirely human-powered means of transportation, recreation, exercise and competition.

I don't mind using electronics to record (GPS) the activity and make it safer (lighting) but fortunately I'm still capable of doing the physical work to make the machine go, stop and change gears.

For as long as I can I plan to leave power assistance out of my cycling, lawn mowing, and walking.

To each their own.

[buddybikes]

AXS 1x user here, works nice. Yesterday rode my Firefly with 9000, and it worked nice.

Both work nice

Such a first world problem!

[reuben]

Originally Posted by weisan

I had to laugh a little to myself when I read this too...

On the contrary, seems to me that DK only get a "new" bike every few years while some of us change bikes like playing the next song on the album, on demand and frequent!

Alexa, play "Bicycle Race" by Queen.

[Mark McM]

Originally Posted by osbk67

To me, deciding between mechanical and electronic shifting isn't a technological but a philosophical question.

Electronic shifting introduces an external power supply to what was previously an entirely human-powered means of transportation, recreation, exercise and competition.

I don't mind using electronics to record (GPS) the activity and make it safer (lighting) but fortunately I'm still capable of doing the physical work to make the machine go, stop and change gears.

This seems to be same philosophy of the organizers of every human powered sporting competition I can think of, except cycling. And even then, such externally powered devices used to be banned in cycling, but a few years ago a new rule was specifically added to allow electric shifting (added no doubt due to pressure for commercial interests).

I can think of plenty of human powered sports that specifically forbid such devices, and even a few that are powered by other "natural" power sources. For example, America's Cup racing boats are far more high tech than any bicycle, but no external power is allowed - everything has to be powered either by the wind, or the muscle of the sailors. Every rudder movement, sail adjustment (and now the raising, lower and control of hydroplane "wings") are powered by human muscle.

Probably the closes analogy to electronic derailleurs is the use of electrically adjustable cross country ski bindings. Many bindings today are mounted to skis on a rails, which allow the bindings/feet to be moved forward and back on the skis. A forward position makes it easier to achieve high grip, which makes climbing easier. A rearward position reduces grip, which makes skis glide faster, especially on downhills. In this way, adjusting the binding position is like "shifting gears", to adapt the ski's "drivetrain" characteristics to the terrain. It was inevitable that someone would come up with a way to adjust the fore-aft position of the bindings with an electric motor, allowing skiers to shift their bindings as they skied. They even came up with a wireless "shifter" control that could be attached to the grip of a ski pole. But this system was deemed illegal for competition, because it used an external power source.

People are free to make their own choices about whether or not to use electronic shifters. But their use in racing goes against the spirit of human powered competition, at least as understood by all other human powered competitions. I've asked this before, and have never gotten an answer, so I probably won't get an answer this time - what other Olympic sport allows any type of electric motor to power any device used in competition?

[zennmotion]

Originally Posted by Waldo62

Are we in the midst of some sort of East Bay - Marin throw down?

Intervention.

[herb5998]

I really enjoyed the EPS bikes I had. For my Kirk, I wanted to stick with just mechanical shifting, and honestly, I don't miss anything. One caveat is that I haven't had an EPS bike with disc brakes, and I think for my next bicycle it would probably be that combination.

[Coffee Rider]

Originally Posted by herb5998

One caveat is that I haven't had an EPS bike with disc brakes, and I think for my next bicycle it would probably be that combination.

It's quite lovely.

[chrismoustache]

Originally Posted by osbk67

I'm often in a minority of nearly one on these things, but what the heck.

To me, deciding between mechanical and electronic shifting isn't a technological but a philosophical question.

Electronic shifting introduces an external power supply to what was previously an entirely human-powered means of transportation, recreation, exercise and competition.

I don't mind using electronics to record (GPS) the activity and make it safer (lighting) but fortunately I'm still capable of doing the physical work to make the machine go, stop and change gears.

For as long as I can I plan to leave power assistance out of my cycling, lawn mowing, and walking.

To each their own.

Maybe ride with a front dynamo that recharges the battery while you ride?

I'm interested in the Archer wireless system too. I think it'd be real neat to run with some wild rear derailleur, like a Sachs Jubilee or some USA-made CNC derailleur.

[ripvanrando]

Originally Posted by Dave

Yes it is. All axs cranks have a 13T difference at the crank, which is why I don't use them. I'm using a shimano grx 48/31 crank with the chainline corrected to eliminate the +2.5mm, by way of spacing washers. A Campy 48/32 or grx 46/30 works too. Other 11 speed cranks will work, but a 50/34 makes for a really tall 50/10 top gear. All cassettes start with a 10T sprocket.

Not Shimano, Rotor, or Campy.

Mix/match these with Sram is not for the faint hearted or those on a budget but it can be done.