Biking on packed snowmobile trails

[moose8]

I do an annual winter trip in Baxter park in Maine and this year is my 10th anniversary of the trip and I want to change it up a bit. I’ve always skied the whole way dragging a sled full of gear and beer. I’ve always wanted to try it on a fatbike but I don’t have one.

I do have an anniversary surly 1x1 that has 24 inch large marge wheels with 3 inch arrow brand tires. I also have a set of 26 inch Marge lite rims I could get built into wheels. I understand 3 inch tires will work with this bike/rim combo. But building new wheels will be more expensive.

I need to cover 13 rolling miles that is gaining elevation the whole way. I will also need to drag a pulk, but would probably also carry stuff on the bike.

Any with experience or thoughts about 24x3 vs 26x3 choice and whether those sizes could work on a packed snowmobile trail while dragging a pulk?

Thanks for any advice!

[Hobine]

It will all depend on the snow conditions that day. There are days when nothing works better than a studded skinny and others where you need the fat tires.
My experience is that fats have the best chance of success on more days.
I’d try and borrow a real fat bike. Nate tires work great on those Marge rims.

[p nut]

If the snow is hard and temps are way below freezing, you should be fine. But snow conditions change throughout the day. From solid, pavement-like surface to slushy/mushy. You will suffer if this happens. Most likely push-a-thon. Even with 4" tires, you'll need to air down quite a bit to stay upright. I've gone 1-2psi at times.

I would also suggest borrowing a bike with a minimum of 3.8" tires. Or just buy my Commando.

[BikeNY]

Are bikes allowed on the trails you plan to ride? Most snowmobile trails systems do not allow bikes.

And, as others have said, it will depend on the snow conditions, which can change drastically very quickly. I would rather ski 13 miles than push my bike for 13 miles!

[Mikej]

i'd stay clear of the sled trails unless sledding -

[unterhausen]

I tried riding on snomobile tracks, and it didn't work. Took me a while to become disentangled from the mess I got myself in. Depends on how packed they are. Definitely make sure it's ok.

[moose8]

Bikes are permitted by the park. The snowmobile trails are packed from the rangers driving in and out so there’s barely any actual traffic but the trails are packed. Non-ranger snowmobiles are only allowed a tiny portion of the route we take in.

It tends to be super cold that time of year (-20 Fahrenheit before windchill was the coldest) so slushy snow is not a concern when I’m going (first week of February). Borrowing a real fatbike isn’t a possibility since I don’t know anyone with one. It’s a Sufferfest on skis dragging 70 pounds or so of gear and beer (I say this having done it many times), though the return trip isn’t bad since that’s mostly downhill.

I know I can do it on skis no problem, but biking sure sounds like fun. I guess I’ll just see if I can’t do a few test rides with what I have beforehand. I was hoping someone would say “yeah definitely doable” but doesn’t seem that’s the case.

[p nut]

Originally Posted by Mikej

i'd stay clear of the sled trails unless sledding -

Places I go here are multi-use--skis, snowshoes, bikes, and sleds. I do hate them things, though. Loud, smelly, and some get a little crazy. Fortunately, most are very courteous and you can hear them coming from ways away. But I still ride with a big red blinky.

[p nut]

Originally Posted by moose8

Bikes are permitted by the park. The snowmobile trails are packed from the rangers driving in and out so there’s barely any actual traffic but the trails are packed. Non-ranger snowmobiles are only allowed a tiny portion of the route we take in.

It tends to be super cold that time of year (-20 Fahrenheit before windchill was the coldest) so slushy snow is not a concern when I’m going (first week of February). Borrowing a real fatbike isn’t a possibility since I don’t know anyone with one. It’s a Sufferfest on skis dragging 70 pounds or so of gear and beer (I say this having done it many times), though the return trip isn’t bad since that’s mostly downhill.

I know I can do it on skis no problem, but biking sure sounds like fun. I guess I’ll just see if I can’t do a few test rides with what I have beforehand. I was hoping someone would say “yeah definitely doable” but doesn’t seem that’s the case.

If it's that cold, you should have problems with traction. But being that cold, you might run into pretty rough terrain. Snowmobile tracks that freeze make for a bone-jarring ride (think railroad tracks). I'd want fattest tires I could get for that (and gears!).

But I believe Mr. WM Robinson aka wayfarer rode through some cold, snowy trails on a SS road bike. So you're better off that he was.

[onekgguy]

I think the part that would concern me most would be how you're going to keep your toes warm. I've ridden in -17ºF and I'm good for about 90 minutes at that temp before my feet turn to bricks of ice. I've used everything from Lake winter cycling boots to regular boots but still the cold eventually wins out. I would guess you'll be out there at least a couple of hours considering you're pulling a sled -- maybe longer.

I don't see a problem riding on a snowmobile trail at all. I've snuck on them here at an off time of the week and they're heavenly.

Best of luck for a great experience and be sure to try and take a photo or two to post here!

Kevin g

[moose8]

Originally Posted by onekgguy

I think the part that would concern me most would be how you're going to keep your toes warm. I've ridden in -17ºF and I'm good for about 90 minutes at that temp before my feet turn to bricks of ice. I've used everything from Lake winter cycling boots to regular boots but still the cold eventually wins out. I would guess you'll be out there at least a couple of hours considering you're pulling a sled -- maybe longer.

I don't see a problem riding on a snowmobile trail at all. I've snuck on them here at an off time of the week and they're heavenly.

Best of luck for a great experience and be sure to try and take a photo or two to post here!

Kevin g

Plan would to be to wear my mountaineering boots while biking. I’ve never gotten cold in them - after the first year where I got kind of scared being out in the cold I bought a pretty heavy duty pair of scarpas which seem to do the trick. On skis the trip takes a long time, though it can vary completely depending on conditions. But the time of year I’m going it’s usually fast snow - late feb/March is when it can get dicey in terms of conditions with thawing and refreezing.

If I end up biking I’ll definitely take some pictures and report back.

[cetuximab]

Originally Posted by moose8

I need to cover 13 rolling miles that is gaining elevation the whole way. I will also need to drag a pulk, but would probably also carry stuff on the bike.

I pull my kids in a chariot with cross country skis attachments replacing the wheels.

You will need 4 or 5 in wide fat tires.

Your surly single speed is the wrong tool.

My first fat bike was only 600 or 800 on bikes direct. There are likely other cheaper options.

[cetuximab]

Originally Posted by onekgguy

I think the part that would concern me most would be how you're going to keep your toes warm. I've ridden in -17ºF and I'm good for about 90 minutes at that temp before my feet turn to bricks of ice.

Biking results is less circulation to the feet. Hence the invention of cyclo cross. Hiking, cross country skiing you perfuse you feet better and you feet stay warm with less insulation. It is cheap insurance to take a couple packs of toe warmers in you coat pocket.

[commonguy001]

Originally Posted by moose8

Plan would to be to wear my mountaineering boots while biking. I’ve never gotten cold in them - after the first year where I got kind of scared being out in the cold I bought a pretty heavy duty pair of scarpas which seem to do the trick. On skis the trip takes a long time, though it can vary completely depending on conditions. But the time of year I’m going it’s usually fast snow - late feb/March is when it can get dicey in terms of conditions with thawing and refreezing.

If I end up biking I’ll definitely take some pictures and report back.

If they do get cold , jump off and push for a bit running along side. I'm guessing you'll be fine if you do that and wear those boots. Heat packs as already mentioned for a back-up plan if it's really cold.

Wheel wise bigger is better. 26" will roll better on packed snow than 24". 3" is pretty small for snow but if it's hard pack you should be fine.

[marciero]

Local intel could be helpful. I'm a Mainer but have never done anything like this. There must be some who've ridden these tracks, albeit likely without dragging full camping gear. You could ask at bike shops. Bike Man in Wiscassett is pretty fat-bikey. Plan well and get the right equipment. You already have knowledge of the snow conditions. But if the right equipment also means fat bike then you can get one cheap or rent one. LL Bean rents them for like $75/day as I recall. That gets pricey, yes, but not outrageous for two-day trip. (Plus you can return it 24/7).
Also, you might want to re-think the rest of your equipment and do it bike-packing style with frame, bar, and saddle packs rather than dragging a sled. This would mean paring things down a bit, perhaps replacing things with lighter smaller things, and additional expense.