Warning about swapping tubeless tires between different rims

[spoonrobot]

Originally Posted by proletariandan

since I am drinking the Kool Aid and started running much higher pressures on Rene Herse than I ran on other gravel tires and am less worried about pinch flats.

Can you explain? Is there a movement advocating for higher pressures? Most of what I see is for lower.

[proletariandan]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot

Can you explain? Is there a movement advocating for higher pressures? Most of what I see is for lower.

The ride quality of the RH means that I run them about 10psi higher (36-41psi depending on terrain for the Snoqualmies) than what I was running other similar sized gravel tires at.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by spoonrobot View Post
The Nox Skyline is a hookless rim?
Yes... and Rene Herse tires have known problems with hookless.

Not sure about the Maxis tires and hookless compatibility.

Can't even speel tubless but somebody tell me again, what is the 'advantage' of hookless vs hooked rims? Mark, Paging Mark.

For right below, that's what I thought...geez, bike design run amok and driven by marketeers and guys with $ calculators.

I'd say big DISADVANTAGE to user if a tire won't stay on the rim.

Kinda like 'treadless headsets' BITD..painted as 'performance' where it was just a way to save $, not only NOT passed on to the end user but made MORE expensive by these BS claims.

Kinda like wireless shifting too...teehee...

[cmbicycles]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Can't even speel tubless but somebody tell me again, what is the 'advantage' of hookless vs hooked rims? Mark, Paging Mark.

Advantage to the user is nada, they're just cheaper to manufacture, and saves precious grams for the data sheet.

[MikeD]

Hookless is really only good for low-pressure mountain bike tires- too much risk of a tire blowing off the rim otherwise. Hookless is really for carbon rims as the manufacturers have issues forming the hook. No advantages for aluminum rims.

[prototoast]

Originally Posted by cmbicycles

Advantage to the user is nada, they're just cheaper to manufacture, and saves precious grams for the data sheet.

For mountain bikes, I have seen at least some manufacturers claiming hookless reduces the chance of pinch flats, but I think that's of more relevance for people really smashing than the kind of impact you'd see on the road.

[adub]

Manufacturers invented carbon hookless rims to save money in the manufacturing process, nothing to do with a better product.

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Kinda like 'treadless headsets' BITD..painted as 'performance' where it was just a way to save $, not only NOT passed on to the end user but made MORE expensive by these BS claims.

Kinda like wireless shifting too...teehee...

What? There are real advantages to threadless headsets. Wireless shifting? Never tried it but can't see a need. Tubeless road?

[Spdntrxi]

I've switched tires a bunch of times but until recently all my wheel sets were 25mm internal and within .5 external width. All hookless.. no issues.

[benb]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

It's a good thing I'm an old man stuck in his ways with rim brakes and ancient technology because I want absolutely nothing to do with these new hookless rims. Too sketchy for me.

Glad to hear the OP did not have a "forced dismount" due to this.

I also think a lot of RH tires are just not up to the task of tubeless low pressure use for prolonged periods of time. They ride super well, and a lot of that supple ride is what contributes to them being a little too flexy for reliable tubeless service.

IMO of course.

Me too. They are basically trying to get riders to beta test rim technologies without getting proper testing done and creating proper tire/rim standards for safety. All for marginal gains and non-marginal $$$$. No thanks!

RH tires are basically weight weenie versions of Panaracers since they're basically just contract made Panaracers. It does not surprise me they are involved in this incident and everyone thinks they stretch a lot.

I had this horrible ride experience on a group ride where RH tires flatted like crazy and it's always scared me off, but I also don't need to pay the extra money and don't really need or care about the lower weight or more supple ride. But I have run a lot of Gravel Kings.. if they really stretch I don't know what to think, but I run them on hooked rims with tubes.

[KonaSS]

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

Kinda like 'treadless headsets' BITD..painted as 'performance' where it was just a way to save $, not only NOT passed on to the end user but made MORE expensive by these BS claims.

Kinda like wireless shifting too...teehee...

You're missing the target today Spudly. Time for a nap.

[lorenbike]

You see enough of these threads it really makes me wonder why anyone risks it with hookless rims and road/gravel tires at high pressures set up tubeless.

I've run several different RH tires over the years with tubes at pressures from 30-60psi and never had any issues, few flats, and they roll wonderfully. Well worth the money. Currently I'm back on paselas on two bikes and also rarely flat and they roll nicely for the better price.

[dddd]

The hookless rims I have appear to maintain a much thicker material section at the top of the rim sidewall, so presumably much more impact-resistant (and presumably also why there are hookless rims at all).

I can understand how hookless might also simplify the manufacturing process, making the rims a bit more affordable(?).
Mine are 650b, bought on clearance.

For sure though, for hookless setups to be safe means that both tire and rim makers need to be on the same page with sizing tolerance standards.

[proletariandan]

Originally Posted by lorenbike

You see enough of these threads it really makes me wonder why anyone risks it with hookless rims and road/gravel tires at high pressures set up tubeless.

I've run several different RH tires over the years with tubes at pressures from 30-60psi and never had any issues, few flats, and they roll wonderfully. Well worth the money. Currently I'm back on paselas on two bikes and also rarely flat and they roll nicely for the better price.

Idk if 40psi is high but I'm gonna use this as an excuse to try out TPU tubes and see if I get driven back to tubeless.

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by benb

Me too. They are basically trying to get riders to beta test rim technologies without getting proper testing done and creating proper tire/rim standards for safety. All for marginal gains and non-marginal $$$$. No thanks!

Actually, hookless rims are not new but old technology. They were called straight-sided rims and still are listed that way in the ETRTO tire standard. I've ridden some old Araya straight sided aluminum rims BITD and they were low end rims and they sucked. They couldn't take folding tires and even steel beaded ones blew off at a much lower pressure than when mounted on hooked rims. "Hookless" is a disingenuous marketing speak term that pretends to be new technology when it isn't.

From Frank Berto's book "Upgrading Your Bike" published in 1988 "There's no good reason to buy straight-side rims today. You can get hooked-edge rims in all three widths and they're inherently superior to straight side rims.