OT: eGolf vs. Leaf - experience?

[NHAero]

This is all really helpful as I haven't driven a Leaf, only the Golf, which is a nice car. The sightline comment is particularly helpful.
Old Potatoe, we used to have just a 2 bay charger here at work and just upgraded to eight. We're an employee-owned company and a B corp (triple bottom line) so we measure our operational carbon footprint and employee driving was half of it, so incentivizing cleaner transportation became a priority.

[ofcounsel]

Originally Posted by NHAero

What comes with each trim level is still a bit confusing to me. The car I see locally is a 2016 SE. It has alloy wheels. I can't tell if this model has the 3.6 or 7.2 kW charger. Is there a way to tell by looking at the charging bay?

Thanks for all the info!

If it has a round plug with an oval plug underneath (for the DC Fast Charging capability) it should be a 7.2kW onboard, because for 2016, the 7.2kW onboard charger and DCFS came together. The oval plug has a rubber cover, and once take off the cover, you see the two extra female connections that the DCFS chargers use. See this website's photo series, it shows what I'm talking about: http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...-e-golf-video/ If you look at the bottom of the page, you see a photo of the charging bay with DCFS cover on and one without.

Beyond that, I'm not sure how else to tell just by looking at it.

Originally Posted by oldpotatoe

If when you get to work, the charging station is being used..what do ya do? Just curious..my driving requirements means no e-car in my future due to distances traveled. I guess charging stations will become more common but even in the republic, they aren't that common.

We have 6 stations for a 45-story Downtown LA high-rise, so this happens often.

The chargers are run by Chargepoint, a company with a network of chargers all over the place. If you get to work and the chargers are all being used, Chargepoint's phone app can alert you when a charger in your selected location becomes available (the app will also show you where other chargers --their brand or other brands-- are, anywhere on a map). In addition, the building has it set up so that the first 3 hours of charging are free, but after three hours, the charging rate goes up to $5 an hour. Essentially, it's a penalty to encourage people not to leave their cars parked at the charging station for too long.

If for some reason, I miss out on a day of free charging at work (because I couldn't plug in when I get in, but get stuck in an all-day meeting), I drive home in "eco" mode to save a little juice and plug in as soon as I get home, and I'm about 3/4's full for the next day, which is more than enough to get me to work then next day. That's pretty rare though.

[alancw3]

interesting sidebar. about two months ago i went to the local cherolet dealer on a sunday (dealer closed so i could study the vehicles at my leisure) to look at their tahoe inventory on their back lot behind their showroom and service buildings. i was amazed to see six bolts being charged behind one to the buildings so they must be selling like hotcakes. on their back lot they must have had 30 bolts in inventory.

[Polyglot]

Originally Posted by cribbit

How do the i3's do in used price? When I was looking a year and a half ago they were still too expensive for what they were (or really, for my needs).

The i3 can be purchased as a BMW Certified Pre-Owned with complete BMW warranty in the high teens for a high spec version and mid-teens for low spec version (in 2014 for example there were still quite a few cars without DC fast charge, from 2015 on all came with DCFC). The i3 also offers the option of a range extender engine (REX), which is effectively an on-board gas-powered generator that recharges the batteries while you drive. I have friends who have driven over 1000 miles in a day in their i3, combining DCFC and use of the REX. To get full use of the REX, you will however need to code your vehicle. In the 18,000 miles of use of my i3 REX, I have used the REX on 4 occasions for a total of less than 50 miles, so I have peace of mind and can still drive electric. In truth, had I selected a pure electric i3 (BEV), on those 4 occasions, I would have more than likely made it home as the added weight (about 300 lbs) of the REX engine impacts the range by about 10%. When I purchased my car, it had travelled 15,000 miles and still had more than 2 years of bumper to bumper protection (including service). There have been 3 recalls but none that impacted me negatively apart from needing to drop the car off at the dealership (they gave me a loaner). I have had some great cars in the past including a few other BMW's and this is the one that has provided me and my wife with the most pleasure (my wife was previously hesitant to drive whenever we drove together and now even volunteers to drive, it is so much fun!)

[Polyglot]

Originally Posted by alancw3

interesting sidebar. about two months ago i went to the local cherolet dealer on a sunday (dealer closed so i could study the vehicles at my leisure) to look at their tahoe inventory on their back lot behind their showroom and service buildings. i was amazed to see six bolts being charged behind one to the buildings so they must be selling like hotcakes. on their back lot they must have had 30 bolts in inventory.

The Bolts were selling so poorly that they had an extended stop in production in July and August and speeded up their introduction plan throughout the country, originally they were only to be sold in a few select markets with a gradual expansion to other markets. They are now available throughout the country and sales are picking up quite nicely.

[ofcounsel]

I'm likely going to lease another one in April, when my current lease is up. The other car I am considering is the Hyundai Ioniq. Their lease deal with electricity reimbursement is pretty good. But so far, the cars are only available in California.

Also, OT: My 2015 e-golf SE end-of -lease residual is about $11,950. It seems my lease-end residual is at least a few thousand less than what their going for on Auto trader. So if anyone is interested in purchasing it instead of me just handing it over to the dealer, let me know!

[NHAero]

Thanks very much!
Our lease buyout at work here was $16K for the same vehicle - but I don't know what we were paying on the lease.

Originally Posted by ofcounsel

If it has a round plug with an oval plug underneath (for the DC Fast Charging capability) it should be a 7.2kW onboard, because for 2016, the 7.2kW onboard charger and DCFS came together. The oval plug has a rubber cover, and once take off the cover, you see the two extra female connections that the DCFS chargers use. See this website's photo series, it shows what I'm talking about: http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...-e-golf-video/ If you look at the bottom of the page, you see a photo of the charging bay with DCFS cover on and one without.

Beyond that, I'm not sure how else to tell just by looking at it.




We have 6 stations for a 45-story Downtown LA high-rise, so this happens often.

The chargers are run by Chargepoint, a company with a network of chargers all over the place. If you get to work and the chargers are all being used, Chargepoint's phone app can alert you when a charger in your selected location becomes available (the app will also show you where other chargers --their brand or other brands-- are, anywhere on a map). In addition, the building has it set up so that the first 3 hours of charging are free, but after three hours, the charging rate goes up to $5 an hour. Essentially, it's a penalty to encourage people not to leave their cars parked at the charging station for too long.

If for some reason, I miss out on a day of free charging at work (because I couldn't plug in when I get in, but get stuck in an all-day meeting), I drive home in "eco" mode to save a little juice and plug in as soon as I get home, and I'm about 3/4's full for the next day, which is more than enough to get me to work then next day. That's pretty rare though.

[ofcounsel]

Originally Posted by NHAero

Thanks very much!
Our lease buyout at work here was $16K for the same vehicle - but I don't know what we were paying on the lease.

For mine, I put $2500 out the door (the same amount as the California EV rebate, so net out the door = $0). My lease payment was $229 per month + tax for a 36 month/15k per year lease. I think the lease deals have gotten better since 2015 when I picked up mine.

[NHAero]

I was looking at a lease for a Kia Soul EV (what we swapped the eGolf for when the lease ended), but when I add the collision insurance and MA excise tax to the lease payment over what I pay now, it adds $4K to the $7K of the 36 month lease. At that point, I'd rather spend a bit more and get a used one with low miles and own it still at the end of the three years.

Originally Posted by ofcounsel

For mine, I put $2500 out the door (the same amount as the California EV rebate, so net out the door = $0). My lease payment was $229 per month + tax for a 36 month/15k per year lease. I think the lease deals have gotten better since 2015 when I picked up mine.

[ofcounsel]

Originally Posted by NHAero

I was looking at a lease for a Kia Soul EV (what we swapped the eGolf for when the lease ended), but when I add the collision insurance and MA excise tax to the lease payment over what I pay now, it adds $4K to the $7K of the 36 month lease. At that point, I'd rather spend a bit more and get a used one with low miles and own it still at the end of the three years.

Yikes! I hear you!

[ofcounsel]

Originally Posted by NHAero

I was looking at a lease for a Kia Soul EV (what we swapped the eGolf for when the lease ended), but when I add the collision insurance and MA excise tax to the lease payment over what I pay now, it adds $4K to the $7K of the 36 month lease. At that point, I'd rather spend a bit more and get a used one with low miles and own it still at the end of the three years.

Well... A bit of a post script: This weekend, I just traded in my VW-eGolf for a 3 year/15k miles lease on a 2017 Kia Soul EV+. I got $12.5k for the trade in on the VW (residual was $11.950k). I applied net $550 to cap cost reduction, I then paid $1500 out-of-pocket drive off, and ended up with a monthly payment of $192+tax. Not bad for a car that retails for $37,000.

I thought about keeping buying out the VW, but given that it's a 2015 model, the HOV lane stickers on that car will expire on Jan 1, 2019, and can't be renewed (at least not here in California). And the HOV stickers are the primary reason for me getting the car (I save 40 minutes of commute time per day using the HOV lane).

[Brian Smith]

Originally Posted by NHAero

This is all really helpful as I haven't driven a Leaf, only the Golf, which is a nice car. The sightline comment is particularly helpful.
Old Potatoe, we used to have just a 2 bay charger here at work and just upgraded to eight. We're an employee-owned company and a B corp (triple bottom line) so we measure our operational carbon footprint and employee driving was half of it, so incentivizing cleaner transportation became a priority.

Depending on which equipment is installed at your workplace, you may only be able to receive less than 3.6kW from each plug if the two adjacent charge locations are being used simultaneously. That could make your selection of vehicle on-board inverter output capacity a moot point. In most cases, the popular commercial EVSE models often don't reach 7.2kW on a single lead, either. Chances are that if you are shopping for vehicles of these moderate battery capacities, and you and other employees work something like 8-hour days, and you have fewer than 16 EVs desiring charging throughout the workday, and the equipment installed is typical (that is a gaggle of assumptions, I know) that it won't be a practical concern whether your first EV has 3.6kW or 7.2kW on-board inverter output for its use for the work commute. Level 2 charging can likely be very economically expanded at the workplace with simple 20-amp 120V L1 outlets for 2.4kW per outlet. Those with shorter commutes among employees can gain as much advantage from these as L2 spigots.

Whether or not you would plan to use the vehicle on longer trips requiring in-trip charging may be a substantially different story. Even with a vehicle with a 10kW output on-board inverter will usually be supplied, via the overwhelming majority of the installed base of L2 public stations, less than 9kW. Although less reliable and available still, in these days, in most areas, DCQC equipment and vehicle capacity is much more desirable than a maximal L2 capability. If trips such as these are expected, and you'll plan to own it for a few years, I wouldn't recommend a Leaf example without the DC quick charge port. The L2 would be the failover option, in the case that a DC fast charge station is possibly available.