Rivendell saved for now...

[Joe Remi]

Originally Posted by Black Dog

I will take your roadeo and raise you an Ottrott.

And my Alaris, which has been renamed Axiom. Cuz that makes so much more sense!

[Joe Remi]

Originally Posted by AngryScientist

i'm not your son.

do not talk down to me or anyone else on this forum.

this is a friendly space, and personal tit for tat crap is not going to fly.

that goes for everyone here.

final warning.

Sorry for the "son" business. That wasn't necessary.

[54ny77]

Interesting that someone mentioned Velo Orange as doing just fine in their relatively esoteric market. They sell things that people need and buy. I just picked up a handful of items that I needed which no LBS would possibly stock (fender hardware, and some other vintage
oriented do-dad's). If Rivendell had it, I'd consider shopping with them. But, I have no idea if they do. Their website is straight out of 2003. Didn't feel like scrolling and searching thru the mishmash of items.

VO website is really well done and easy to navigate. Kudos to whomever designed and operates it.

All the bashing aside, I read more of the owners' blog and one extraordinarily generous thing stood out: Charlie Cunningham had a really bad bike crash, and Rivendell set up a GoFundMe page (or something like that) to help with medical expenses, where in exchange for donating $18, all of which went to Cunningham, Rivendell would credit that person for $10 at their shop / online store. That's a special kind of karma and kindness of heart.

[Burnette]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

We're talking past each other. If I keep saying the bikes are selling and you say they aren't, we're conversing in two separate realities. My understanding is bike sakes are "decent", parts/accessories are not. I don't have a solution short of what Performance just did, which may be inevitable. Continuing to run RBW as a brick-and-mortar shop is probably not feasible.

Again, it's a big operation and all phases have to click. In his last blog he goes over investments that may or may not pay off, he's bleeding money that the bike sales can't cover, hence the pay cuts.

He would need to sell way more bikes than he does today and being what they are he can't. So they sell but not enough to erase errors in the rest of the business. To get higher volume bike sales he would have to sell bikes more inline with what people are buying today, which he does not.

[Joe Remi]

Interesting. I bought parts from V-O last week and RBW yesterday. Both sites felt the same to me as far as ease of locating parts sections I needed.

[charliedid]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

Also, I'm not sure how the Roadini being a sloping-toptube steel road bike makes it weird. There's a million bikes like that out there.

What makes it weird is that it's a "road bike" but all your weight is on your ass. He just can't help himself.

[Joe Remi]

Originally Posted by charliedid

What makes it weird is that it's a "road bike" but all your weight is on your ass. He just can't help himself.

Whelp, it worked for me. But then I don't ride "road bikes" with my back flat and staring at the ground cuz that's not enjoyable for me. My Seven has a tall headtube, too.

[charliedid]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

Whelp, it worked for me. But then I don't ride "road bikes" with my back flat and staring at the ground cuz that's not enjoyable for me. My Seven has a tall headtube, too.

Me too but at some point if you can't ride a road bike, ride something designed for that sort of weight distribution. I ride with about 2-4 cm of drop which by many standards a rather comfortable fit.

Whatever works I guess.

[raygunner]

Firstly, just wanted to type my appreciation for the mods on Paceline, especially for keeping this conversation going.

As I noted early, on the RBW Owners Group...labeled as a place for "discussion" of all things Riv, a thread on this very subject was locked and then removed. Not sure how the subject of the state of affairs at Riv is outside the realm of discussion but I guess the members at RBW Owners Group would rather discuss barefoot riding or other whimsical topics.

Additionally, on the Rivendell Owners Facebook group, members were removed from the group when the discussion of the financial issues at Riv started around the time of the hail mary.

This form is a great place and I appreciate the well informed and helpful members on here, for both bike & non-bike discussion.

Despite the tough love for Riv, myself and many others here are in a debt of gratitude for all they've done. I've owned several of their bikes and want to add another to the stable. But during the last few years they've lost their way.

If Joe Remi, or other concerned readers have time, please go back through all the pages of this thread. You'll find some extremely direct but helpful and constructive advice for Riv. People here know bikes, know business and know the bike business. There is some solid advice. It may blunt and honest but it's not whimsical so please don't take it as criticism.

No one wants to see them go under but for all accounts and based on Grant's last posting it seems like that's where the ship is headed.

[dem]

I normally stay outta threads like this.. but every time it pops up, I think "A t-shirt would be kind of cool because I like interesting/obscure bike T-shirts"

Every time they are all out of stock. Literally the easiest, highest margin item you can sell.

That is all.

[Joe Remi]

The thread at Riv Bunch wasn't removed, you can read it to your heart's content. It was locked after being dormant for two months, then someone decided to stir it up again and the moderator wasn't interested in another round. But no worries, someone else restarted a new version. Enjoy!

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by Joe Remi

He's relaxed.

He's stoned.. and 'some' in this thread ought to be...too..

[colker]

I was always under the impression that Grant/Riv was selling bikes to the "other people"... you know: those guys who don´t know the length of their chainstays to the last milimeter.
95% of everybody wants to ride a bicycle that does not have saddle to bar drop, short chainstays and would rather have a kickstand and a bell rather than lightweight. Rivendell does not want to be a niche... they believe they are the new normal and many of their ideas end up as the new normal. Large tires on a drop bar road bike, for example. I could go on and on...
Cyclocross is a niche. Mountain biking is a niche. Gravel riding is a niche. Rivendell is about riding a bicycle, slowly and enjoying the ride.
So why is Rivendell failing? I believe their main problem is marketing and exposure: they stay on line and nn line SVCKS for the kind of thing they do... Rivendell should be sold on bike shops in malls where people go to find bicycles. To look at a bicycle, try it and buy it.
The problem is not that they want to be a brick and mortar shop.. it´s that they end up being an on line shop. I am sure Grant would agree.

[charliedid]

Originally Posted by colker

I was always under the impression that Grant/Riv was selling bikes to the "other people"... you know: those guys who don´t know the length of their chainstays to the last milimeter.
95% of everybody wants to ride a bicycle that does not have saddle to bar drop, short chainstays and would rather have a kickstand and a bell rather than lightweight. Rivendell does not want to be a niche... they believe they are the new normal and many of their ideas end up as the new normal. Large tires on a drop bar road bike, for example. I could go on and on...
Cyclocross is a niche. Mountain biking is a niche. Gravel riding is a niche. Rivendell is about riding a bicycle, slowly and enjoying the ride.
So why is Rivendell failing? I believe their main problem is marketing and exposure: they stay on line and nn line SVCKS for the kind of thing they do... Rivendell should be sold on bike shops in malls where people go to find bicycles. To look at a bicycle, try it and buy it.
The problem is not that they want to be a brick and mortar shop.. it´s that they end up being an on line shop. I am sure Grant would agree.

I guess I sort of see what you are saying but....if you are "going to the mall" to buy a bike I doubt the $1700.00 Riv is going to do well against the Electra for $1000 less.

I could be wrong.

I've sold a lot of bikes in my life and the average person in this country thinks $
700 for a bike is way too much. I said average consumer not niche cyclist with half a clue. Tough biz on the best of days.

[oldpotatoe]

Originally Posted by charliedid

I guess I sort of see what you are saying but....if you are "going to the mall" to buy a bike I doubt the $1700.00 Riv is going to do well against the Electra for $1000 less.

I could be wrong.

I've sold a lot of bikes in my life and the average person in this country thinks $
700 for a bike is way too much. I said average consumer not niche cyclist with half a clue. Tough biz on the best of days.

Yup..

Maybe you’ve never been tempted to buy a bike at Walmart or from another department store, but you almost certainly know someone who did—or might. So-called “big-box” or mass-merchant stores, like Sam’s Club or Costco, sell 75 percent of all bikes in the US, according to the National Bicycle Dealers Association.

About $12million bikes per year

Also look at this chart..flat, flat, flat..

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...s-of-bicycles/