Tire review or maybe a warning?

[Kirk007]

Originally Posted by David Kirk

You are of course correct....despite my 40 years of working in the industry and mounting countless thousands of tires without incident there's always a first time. I fully admit that I may have not properly seated the tire the first time when it blew up just leaning against the wall despite the fact that they only had 50 psi in them.

And I suppose it's even possible that the second time I mounted the tire that I messed up again despite being super careful due to the first issue. Possible? Sure. Likely? No.

What I can say for sure is that I used a pair of these tires for two seasons (with multiple mount dismount cycles to fix flats or mess with wheels) without a single issue.....on these very same wheels mounted by the same guy, pumped up with the same pump/gauge. So when the one tire blew off twice (different sides of the tire FWIW) it was very out of character.

On top of that the testimonials on this thread have shown me that either no one here knows how to mount a tire or that the tires vary enough that many have had serious safety issues with this tire.

And....on top of that if I looked closely I could see and feel the difference in the actual bead of the tire between my old successful pair and the new scary pair. There was a design change or a very wide tolerance in how they were made.

In the end I threw the new ones out to be sure I never mistakenly mounted them again forgetting that they like to blow off the rim without cause or warning. Life is too short to ride wondering if the tires will stay on the rims.

Thanks as always for reading.

dave

Dear Dave,

I think it was probably a problem with the bike. You should send it to me to save yourself from further risk of injury. I promise to sign whatever release form you require.

[K3RRY]

Thanks for sharing! I’ll be more careful when I inspect tires before installing

[thwart]

Having scanned through this thread again, it appears one tire was defective, having blown off the rim on both sides.

Take home message for me: If I elect to continue riding Challenge tires (which I will) I need to very carefully check the bead of any new tire I mount.

What's interesting is just this past weekend I decided to change wheelsets on my Riv Romulus. Took off a wheel set with Soma Supple Vitesse SL 32c tires (certainly a nice tire, no doubt, and these had latex tubes too) and put on a similar wheelset but with Challenge Eroica 30c (blackwall) tires mounted. Butyl tubes. Will be traveling with the bike, may be riding in some rain and didn't want to hassle with cleaning the gumwalls or dealing with the slow leak of latex tubes. I installed a new rear Eroica tire (hoarded NOS in an airtight container ) since the rear was fairly worn... then went out for a vigorous ride.

I marveled how smooth the ride was, and how sticky the tires felt while climbing on fine gravel and in corners as well.

Sure hope that the folks at Challenge do something about their QC. Soon.

[benb]

I had not one but 2 Vredstein tires (Fortezza tri-comp about 10 years ago) both do this. It scared the daylights out of me. The tires had been on sale and I bought about 4 of them. I had trouble with the first one I put on the front rim blowing off. It blew off after I got off the bike at the end of the ride, I thought it was weird. Put a new tube in. It did it again, right after I got off the bike at the end of the ride. Put another tire on, it again blew off. At that point all of them went in the trash, including the one on the rear tire that had not shown any signs of issues.

I think it is more just QC around the diameter of the tire having variance than anything else. Still scary though.

I also much more recently went through a set of Challenge Gravel Grinders and never had any trouble running them right till they were worn through. Those were not cotton sidewall/open tubular style though.

Between companies like Enve coming out against Open Tubulars/Cotton sidewalls and repeated mentions of issues like this with Open Tubulars I have no interest... they are more expensive, are often more likely to tear/flat, might have safety issues, and buy you a little bit of suppleness and usually < 10w improved rolling resistance over the same tire with vulcanized sidewalls.

I view them as the same thing as Tubulars.. if you're in a race with a follow vehicle/support staff it's worth it, the rest of the time nope. Any performance benefit is not worth the cost/hassle/wear/safety/whatever issues... conservative tires are fine for me.

[dmurphey]

Originally Posted by David Kirk

Can you give me an accurate outside diameter or radius of that Conti 30mm tire? If you can that would be awesome.

dave

Conti 5000's in 700 x 30 size mounted on DT swiss alloy rim measure 30 mm wide and 30 mm tall above the rim edge.

[David Kirk]

Originally Posted by dmurphey

Conti 5000's in 700 x 30 size mounted on DT swiss alloy rim measure 30 mm wide and 30 mm tall above the rim edge.

Cool - thanks for the info.

dave

[merckx]

Originally Posted by dmurphey

Conti 5000's in 700 x 30 size mounted on DT swiss alloy rim measure 30 mm wide and 30 mm tall above the rim edge.

The GP 5000 is available in 622-28, and 622-32. Among those two sizes which one measures 30mm x 30mm? What is the inner rim width?

[PacNW2Ford]

Donnelly CDG in 700x30c at 65 psi on HED Belgium Plus rims:
radius = ~346mm
width = 31.4 mm
height from rim = ~30mm

[dmurphey]

Originally Posted by merckx

The GP 5000 is available in 622-28, and 622-32. Among those two sizes which one measures 30mm x 30mm? What is the inner rim width?

merckx is correct! Conti 5000's don't come in 700 x 30. They come in 28 or 32. I ran 28's for the last few years and tried a little fatter. I can't resist trying a little fatter tires. I am now running Conti 5000 in 700 x 32 and they ride very well. They measure 29-30 mm wide on normal DT swiss alloy rims.

[David Kirk]

Originally Posted by dmurphey

Conti 5000's in 700 x 30 size mounted on DT swiss alloy rim measure 30 mm wide and 30 mm tall above the rim edge.

Hey DM - I wonder if I can impose on you in the name of science? Would you mind measuring the tire the way shown in the photo?

I put a piece of tape on the vertical surface so that I can make marks and not worry about it. The wheel is placed up against the wall so that it is vertical and then a square is placed against the tire and the wall. The wheel needs to be as vertical as possible. Then I make a mark on the underside of the square on the tape....and then of course measure from the mark to the floor.

It's just like proud parents measure the growth of their kid on a door jamb.

This method should give quick and accurate results.

I measured a few tires I have here -

Compass 700 x 28 - 684mm OD
Challenge 700 x 30 - 688mm OD
Compass 700 x 32 - 692mm OD

I hope that makes sense. It would rock of you could try it this way and let me know what you get.


dave

[Heisenberg]

have had awful luck with 4-5 sets of Challenge since their re-emergence as a brand a 5-10 years back. clinchers delaminating and blowing off rims. tubulars lumpier than arenberg. they're ****in' garbage.

friends don't let friends ride Challenge, unless you want them dead/missing teeth.

[dmurphey]

Originally Posted by David Kirk

Hey DM - I wonder if I can impose on you in the name of science? Would you mind measuring the tire the way shown in the photo?

I put a piece of tape on the vertical surface so that I can make marks and not worry about it. The wheel is placed up against the wall so that it is vertical and then a square is placed against the tire and the wall. The wheel needs to be as vertical as possible. Then I make a mark on the underside of the square on the tape....and then of course measure from the mark to the floor.

It's just like proud parents measure the growth of their kid on a door jamb.

This method should give quick and accurate results.

I measured a few tires I have here -

Compass 700 x 28 - 684mm OD
Challenge 700 x 30 - 688mm OD
Compass 700 x 32 - 692mm OD

I hope that makes sense. It would rock of you could try it this way and let me know what you get.


dave

Happy to oblige. These measure 690 mm tall overall on DT Swiss RR440 rims. Same method of measurement as above.

[David Kirk]

Originally Posted by dmurphey

Happy to oblige. These measure 690 mm tall overall on DT Swiss RR440 rims. Same method of measurement as above.

Very cool - that's a solid usable number.

Thank you.

dave

[Spdntrxi]

enve came out against them

[Spaghetti Legs]

[QUOTE=Spaghetti Legs;2592637

I have a set of the Challenge vulcanized 120 tpi Strada Bianca in a 33 size and they held up nicely on 400 mile tour with 100+ miles of gravel. I just bought a set of the vulcanized Paris Roubaix (27 that everyone measures at 29) that I hope will just squeeze onto my Ciöcc. I’ll post back how those work out.

Glad the blowouts didn’t cause injury. I hope Challenge will make it right for you.[/QUOTE]

So here’s the report on the Paris Roubaix. I mounted the rear and pumped up to 40 or 50 psi, anticipating that it would be a squeeze to get in the bike. Mounted the front one and pop!, blew out at about 85 psi. I did notice that the bead is flimsier and although they weren’t hard to mount, the bead would fall out as I was moving around the tire.

Anyway, I tried again, paying super close attention to the seat of the bead and got both tires pumped up to about 85 psi. Rode 32 miles, including 14 miles gravel today with no problems.