I've become a waxer

[charliedid]

In 2022 I started using just the SILCA Drip and liked it. In 2023 I started hot waxing with SILCA and topping off with drip. I probably re-waxed 3 times last year. Results seemed very good on the clean drive train and quietness factor. I'd be lying if I was worried about longevity of DT parts.

This past week I cleaned the bike that had the waxed chain and boiled the chain, and did a OMS and Acetone clean, dried completely before reinstalling and lubing with SILCA Synergetic which is what I had been using before any wax based lube.

I have always been good about keeping bikes clean and in great working order and I will be interested in seeing my observations having reverted back to wet. Having worked off and on in the industry for years I have often tried things for myself as an additional bit of data vs what becomes commonly accepted.

Planning to give it 4 months before making any decisions about the real world benefits for me and going back to wax but do have a DA chain pre waxed that I can install.

[m_sasso]

Originally Posted by BdaGhisallo

Interestingly, MSW recommends waxing the quicklink while Silca recommends not doing it.

I have done both and notice no discernable difference either way, though not waxing it makes it easier to snap closed.

Makes no sense what so ever not to wax your quick link, that is like suggesting the quick link is not going to be exposed to any fiction while the chain is in operation. If you can't clean enough wax off your quick link to reinstall the quick link after waxing you have other more serious problems. Why would you run a portion of your chain with no lubrication?

Sounds like Silica has a serious investment in quick link producers!

[makoti]

Originally Posted by m_sasso

Makes no sense what so ever not to wax your quick link, that is like suggesting the quick link is not going to be exposed to any fiction while the chain is in operation. If you can't clean enough wax of your quick link to reinstall the quick link after waxing you have other more serious problems. Why would you run a portion of your chain with no lubrication?

Sounds like Silica has a serious investment in quick link producers!

Drip wax on the quicklink after re-installing the chain. Two drops. Solved!

[charliedid]

Originally Posted by makoti

Drip wax on the quicklink after re-installing the chain. Two drops. Solved!

Yep

[gravelreformist]

Originally Posted by m_sasso

Makes no sense what so ever not to wax your quick link, that is like suggesting the quick link is not going to be exposed to any fiction while the chain is in operation. If you can't clean enough wax of your quick link to reinstall the quick link after waxing you have other more serious problems. Why would you run a portion of your chain with no lubrication?

Sounds like Silica has a serious investment in quick link producers!

The quick link doesn't contain any parts that need to be lubricated directly. The pins get pushed through the rollers on the chain that are already fully packed with wax. Waxing the quick link just makes reinstallation harder for no benefit.

[Mikej]

Originally Posted by m_sasso

Makes no sense what so ever not to wax your quick link, that is like suggesting the quick link is not going to be exposed to any fiction while the chain is in operation. If you can't clean enough wax of your quick link to reinstall the quick link after waxing you have other more serious problems. Why would you run a portion of your chain with no lubrication?

Sounds like Silica has a serious investment in quick link producers!

There is plenty of wax in the open rollers the QL will insert into. The reasoning behind not to wax a QL is the added thickness causes a misalignment and could prevent a full engagement when snapping the link closed. I have closed a link and only one side snapped, leaving the opposite side unseated.

[m_sasso]

Originally Posted by gravelreformist

The quick link doesn't contain any parts that need to be lubricated directly. The pins get pushed through the rollers on the chain that are already fully packed with wax. Waxing the quick link just makes reinstallation harder for no benefit.

You demonstrably do not understand the reasons and minute physical properties as to why immersion waxing works as well as it does.

On a microscopic scale, hot melted wax penetrates the pores and irregularities of chain metal, coating and filling inconsistencies in the metal creating a semi-permanent smooth surface layer on the chain metal.

The wax lubricates, prevents dirt and abrasive material from entering those micropores and surface irregularities reducing friction and ware to the surfaces of moving parts of a chain. The wax is also not easily displaced under pressure like a wet lube on a microscopic scale.

Simply if you are only treating half of a link, both the quick link pins and side plate metal not immersed in wax will not fully benefit from the advantages provided by immersion waxing.

Non hot waxed quick links can be put together easily misalignment, if you can't position quick links correctly you likely should not be taking your chain apart for immersion hot waxing

[gravelreformist]

Originally Posted by m_sasso

You demonstrably do not understand the reasons and minute physical properties as to why immersion waxing works as well as it does.

On a microscopic scale, hot melted wax penetrates the pores and irregularities of chain metal, coating and filling inconsistencies in the metal creating a semi-permanent smooth surface layer on the chain metal.

The wax lubricates, prevents dirt and abrasive material from entering those micropores and surface irregularities reducing friction and ware to the surfaces of moving parts of a chain. The wax is also not easily displaced under pressure like a wet lube on a microscopic scale.

Simply if you are only treating half of a link, both the quick link pins and side plate metal not immersed in wax will not fully benefit from the advantages provided by immersion waxing.

Non hot waxed quick links can be put together easily misalignment, if you can't position quick links correctly you likely should not be taking your chain apart for immersion hot waxing

So your contention is that heating a steel chain to less than the boiling point of water is enough to materially open the pores of the chain to better bond to the wax?

That doesn't quite pass the sniff test in and of itself. But let's go with it.

The inner surface of the two rollers that interface with the quick link are already fully waxed. So by not waxing the link, we are missing out on 1/2 of the possible lubrication for two rollers. So that's 1 part total out of a 116 link chain. Best-case, waxing may save a few watts over other lubrication methods. Let's call it 5. So the possible benefits of waxing the quick link or not is down to 1/116 of 5w. My napkin math results in a 0.04w improvement. Now we are talking truly marginal gains.

So no, it doesn't matter at all.

Let's not even get into how you believe the inner rollers of the other 115 links of the chain are being more thoroughly waxed than the quick link inserted into the only two rollers of the chain that are internally fully exposed to the wax...

[m_sasso]

Originally Posted by gravelreformist

So your contention is that heating a steel chain to less than the boiling point of water is enough to materially open the pores of the chain to better bond to the wax?

That doesn't quite pass the sniff test in and of itself. But let's go with it.

The inner surface of the two rollers that interface with the quick link are already fully waxed. So by not waxing the link, we are missing out on 1/2 of the possible lubrication for two rollers. So that's 1 part total out of a 116 link chain. Best-case, waxing may save a few watts over other lubrication methods. Let's call it 5. So the possible benefits of waxing the quick link or not is down to 1/116 of 5w. My napkin math results in a 0.04w improvement. Now we are talking truly marginal gains.

So no, it doesn't matter at all.

Let's not even get into how you believe the inner rollers of the other 115 links of the chain are being more thoroughly waxed than the quick link inserted into the only two rollers of the chain that are internally fully exposed to the wax...

First you are basing your incorrect assumptions solely based on Watts gained or lost when you should be considering not only Watts but dollars and cents, chain life span. Yes, it matters!

Second if you believe the metal surface of bicycle chain at a microscopic level is a continual regular surface and does not include pores/non continual areas and irregularities you are again misinformed.

And if you want to discus nonsense about manipulating metal at the boiling point of H2O, I can't help you.

Maybe you will comprehend pictures better https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtvV-WcjNIM

[spoonrobot]

nvm

[makoti]

Originally Posted by gravelreformist

So your contention is that heating a steel chain to less than the boiling point of water is enough to materially open the pores of the chain to better bond to the wax?

That doesn't quite pass the sniff test in and of itself. But let's go with it.

FWIW, I've heard (and do this) that you should lay your chain on top of the solid wax in your crockpot and heat it and the wax together. The reason for this is that the chain warms as the wax does, and expands every so slightly to allow the wax to penetrate better. I assumed that they were talking about the spaces between links, but I never delved into it. It sounded reasonable and wasn't going to hurt anything, so I do it

[mortirolo]

My waxing method:
aluminum pot
induction cooker
infrared thermometer
MSW wax (83 Celsius)
15 minutes (to allow the wax to penetrate)

[Jdm]

Originally Posted by makoti

FWIW, I've heard (and do this) that you should lay your chain on top of the solid wax in your crockpot and heat it and the wax together. The reason for this is that the chain warms as the wax does, and expands every so slightly to allow the wax to penetrate better. I assumed that they were talking about the spaces between links, but I never delved into it. It sounded reasonable and wasn't going to hurt anything, so I do it

This also what I do, both because Zero Friction recommended it and because it’s easier. I throw 5 chains on top of my cold wax in the crockpot. Set to low. Come back in about 3 hours. Take out chains.

[Mikej]

With thermal expansion, all of the material in the pot expand as the temperature rises…so the tolerances most likely don’t change much.